Coming Soon - The Hitler Assassination Mod

[MKSheppard]

http://www.joric.com/Conspiracy/Conspiracy.htm

Did you know?

That the July 20, 1944 assassination attempt against Adolf Hitler was not the act of a lone officer but the last chapter of a six-year conspiracy involving more than 200 German army officers, intelligence officials, diplomats, civil servants, and politicians.
Did you know?

That during the 1938 Czech-Sudetenland crisis, the highest ranking officers of the German Army had assembled a commando force in Berlin to overthrow Hitler and the Nazi regime. The go-ahead contingent on whether Britain would stand up to Hitler.
Did you know?

That the aborted 1938 attempt to liberate Germany was to be the first of 17 assassination attempts against Hitler by the German Resistance over the next six years.

The most famous other than the Stauffenberg assassination attempt
was the November 1939 Munich assassination attempt.

A clockmaker put a time bomb in the pedestal to be used
by Hitler during his speech to the old hands.....and...

On November 8, 1939, Hitler enters the Burgerbraukeller at 8:10 P.M.

While Elser's time-bomb is ticking away inside the massive swastika-draped column behind the podium, Hitler delivers his speech to the old-timers, ranting and raving about the plight of the down-trodden in the decadent capitalist West while the German people make enormous strides under National Socialism.
The minute hand on Elser's concealed clock is crawling ever closer towards 9:20PM. Hitler is not scheduled to leave the hall until 9:30PM at the earliest. But suddenly at 9:12PM - 57 minutes into his speech - Hitler wraps up his speech, gives a quick Nazi salute, and trots out of the Burgerbraukeller. His heavily armored motorcade whisks him away to the train station. Eight minutes later...

KABOOOM!

I need to take a look at which assassination attempts I should
introduce, because if I do all 17, then well, Adolf isn't surviving
the war, lol.

[DeathwisH]

Thats a cool idea. You could have an event where if Germany is at war with both the Allies and Comintern, and Hitler is killied, his Generals offer to join forces with the allies and fight the soviets.

[Maddogg1178]

if its possible make it so, that the higher the dissient the higher the chance of hitler being eliminated. also if hitler is killed who will replace him (and dont say goering,himmler,or borrman)

[Ego]

Actually, would this not be a straightforward coup? At least the Stauffenberg version would be (with some convenient sleepleaders, of course).

Ego

[KongoMueller]

Sounds very good to me. A little suggestion, btw: I dont think the nazis would have gone away just like that, without a fight. So it may be a good feature to include some sort of german civil war, with nazi heartland in Bavaria.

[Panzer39]

Karl Doenitz, the same man that replaced him in real life. He took over as head of the Navy after Raeder resigned. Hitler passed the leadership to him and Doenitz was the one who surrenderd Germany.

If not him you could put the ever popular choice Rommel in charge.

Better yet have it trigger a small civil war between forces loyal to the Nazi party (Himmler) vs the Army.

[MKSheppard]

One of the assassinations is already in the game.

Just open up the Germany.txt file in your events directory.

You'll see teh data for the 20 June 1944 Stauffenberg bomb
plot with both endingd (hitler dies or lives)

[Burris]

If the creators of the coup win, all conquered territory should be restored with indepedence.

BTW: You cant really have a civil war over a land of that scope. Units would be popping up fighting in Poland. Its better to have all these countries become independent again, Rommels forces become allied and fight the Nazis.

[albso437]

Originally posted by Panzer39
Karl Doenitz, the same man that replaced him in real life. He took over as head of the Navy after Raeder resigned. Hitler passed the leadership to him and Doenitz was the one who surrenderd Germany.

Yeah, but before 1941 it should be Hess.

[Maddogg1178]

dont give back any territory the object of the game is to expand, giving all you took back would be pointless, so instead either become nutral or become allied then turn and fight the russians.

[Karl Martell]

Wait wait wait...

Dönitz was never Hitler's No.1 in line for succession until April 1945. For one thing, succession to the Führer was not something talked or even thought about very often, for another thing, Hitler had his testament changed only a day before he shot himself after he had learned of Göring's attempts to contact the Allies via Sweden - something the isolated, paranoid and irrational Hitler regarded as high treason. Göring had previously been Hitler's designated successor as BOTH Führer and Chancellor.

From Hitler's political testament, April 29th 1945:

Before my death I expel the former Reichsmarschall Hermann Goering from the party and deprive him of all rights which he may enjoy by virtue of the decree of June 29th, 1941; and also by virtue of my statement in the Reichstag on September 1st, 1939, I appoint in his place Grossadmiral Doenitz, President of the Reich and Supreme Commander of the Armed Forces.

Before my death I expel the former Reichsfuehrer-SS and Minister of the Interior, Heinrich Himmler, from the party and from all offices of State. In his stead I appoint Gauleiter Karl Hanke as Reichsfuehrer-SS and Chief of the German Police, and Gauleiter Paul Giesler as Reich Minister of the Interior.

Goering and Himmler, quite apart from their disloyalty to my person, have done immeasurable harm to the country and the whole nation by secret negotiations with the enemy, which they conducted without my knowledge and against my wishes, and by illegally attempting to seize power in the State for themselves.

In order to give the German people a government composed of honourable men,—a government which will fulfill its pledge to continue the war by every means—I appoint the following members of the new Cabinet as leaders of the nation:

President of the Reich: DOENITZ
Chancellor of the Reich: DR. GOEBBELS
Party Minister: BORMANN
Foreign Minister: SEYSS-INQUART


[Here follow fifteen others.]
http://www.ess.uwe.ac.uk/documents/poltest.htm

Why did he choose Dönitz? Because Dönitz was a nobody, so to say... and the only one Hitler still trusted. Everyone who had proper Nazi spirit in him or at least ambition and skill was either dead, fighting the Russians or had lost the Führer's confidence. It's not like Hitler left his dull admiral much to govern anyways, he was only the executor of the Führer's last will.

IMHO, had the July 20 plot succeeded in killing Hitler, the conspirators - along with a large part of the home army - would have to fight against the SS who were fiercely loyal to their own boss, Heinrich Himmler, one of the scariest characters among the leadership of the Third Reich, and perhaps elements of the Wehrmacht led by loyalist generals. (By 1944, a lot of the "fresher" generals were diehard Nazis.) The conspirators were determined to remove the SS from power, and the SS was at all times dedicated to the National Socialist cause above everything else.

Would be an exciting mod, though.

But one thing to consider, is - the Allies had already agreed at Yalta that unconditional surrender was the only acceptable offer from the Germans. So it is very doubtful if the Western Allies would ever have made a separate peace with the successful conspirators...

[KonigMaximilian]

dont wont to spoile your fun but the Hitler Assasination of 17 times, and the Sucess of hitler being Assasinated, and most of the higher officials beoing arested apart from Raeder etc etc are in the games event for Germany if you ever looked in thier,

The event code from Succesful Hitler Assasination is 2025, problem is it wont end the war striaght away etc.

Also thier are plenty of other codes like Stalins Bitter Peace offer, code 2024 and much more, just go into the events file and go to Germany events file, then you can see what i mean ive tryed the hitler Assasination jsut by typing (event 2025) on the consoul screen and event works, now i gues this event would only kick in very Rarly, probably like 1 in 40-100 games or so not sure lol, ive had the fail attempt one which had consiquences for those that tryed it

So not points in this event being maid.

[swilhelm73]

As long as FDR was leading the US, it is unlikely the Allies would have accepted peace even though the conspirators were willing to offer up pretty much the whole of the SS and the NAZI party leadership.

On the other hand, the success of the 1944 coup would have saved alot of lives, if not military ones.

If you want a coup attempt that could have changed WWII, and hence HOI in a meaningful way, you might want to look at the 1938 asssassination plan. Basically, the German general staff was planning on killing Hitler, and had a squad assembled, if the Allies would stand up to Hitler on the Czech issue.

Presumably, this would have led to a war between the Allies, the Czechs, and call them Republican(?) Germans ( I would guess L-C or centerists in HOI terms), versus the much more popular in Germany National Socialists.

I had some thoughts on writing up a scenario like this at one point, with the Soviets eventually intervening on the NAZI side...

[Crazy_Ivan80]

Originally posted by swilhelm73


I had some thoughts on writing up a scenario like this at one point, with the Soviets eventually intervening on the NAZI side...

Wouldn't it be more plausible to have the Russians intervene on their own side?
Stalin taking advantage of the whole thing.

[swilhelm73]

Originally posted by Crazy_Ivan80
Wouldn't it be more plausible to have the Russians intervene on their own side?
Stalin taking advantage of the whole thing.

Well, the basic idea I had in mind was that while the West was busy fighting a war in Germany - with VERY high dissent back home, the Soviets move through the Baltics and onto Poland quickly.

Then, if they annex Poland by a certain date, they can intervene in the German Civil War in much the same way as they did in the Spanish - nominally helping one side while using the opportunity to try and implant their own ideology...

The Soviets always wanted a chance to launch their own coup in Germany.

[Crazy_Ivan80]

Originally posted by swilhelm73
Well, the basic idea I had in mind was that while the West was busy fighting a war in Germany - with VERY high dissent back home, the Soviets move through the Baltics and onto Poland quickly.

Then, if they annex Poland by a certain date, they can intervene in the German Civil War in much the same way as they did in the Spanish - nominally helping one side while using the opportunity to try and implant their own ideology...

The Soviets always wanted a chance to launch their own coup in Germany.

mh yeah, now it makes sense.

Like it

[Generalisimo]

Originally posted by Karl Martell
Wait wait wait...

Dönitz was never Hitler's No.1 in line for succession until April 1945. For one thing, succession to the Führer was not something talked or even thought about very often, for another thing, Hitler had his testament changed only a day before he shot himself after he had learned of Göring's attempts to contact the Allies via Sweden - something the isolated, paranoid and irrational Hitler regarded as high treason. Göring had previously been Hitler's designated successor as BOTH Führer and Chancellor.

From Hitler's political testament, April 29th 1945:



Why did he choose Dönitz? Because Dönitz was a nobody, so to say... and the only one Hitler still trusted. Everyone who had proper Nazi spirit in him or at least ambition and skill was either dead, fighting the Russians or had lost the Führer's confidence. It's not like Hitler left his dull admiral much to govern anyways, he was only the executor of the Führer's last will.

IMHO, had the July 20 plot succeeded in killing Hitler, the conspirators - along with a large part of the home army - would have to fight against the SS who were fiercely loyal to their own boss, Heinrich Himmler, one of the scariest characters among the leadership of the Third Reich, and perhaps elements of the Wehrmacht led by loyalist generals. (By 1944, a lot of the "fresher" generals were diehard Nazis.) The conspirators were determined to remove the SS from power, and the SS was at all times dedicated to the National Socialist cause above everything else.

Would be an exciting mod, though.

But one thing to consider, is - the Allies had already agreed at Yalta that unconditional surrender was the only acceptable offer from the Germans. So it is very doubtful if the Western Allies would ever have made a separate peace with the successful conspirators...

well, like he said, if the conspirator don't kill Himmler (posibly Göring too and maybe even Hess!!) quickly... they will be killed by this little man.
civil war?? ... mmm... i don't think so...
there were too many people loyal to Hitler in that time... i don't think you could produce a civil war...

[MKSheppard]

Originally posted by KonigMaximilian
dont wont to spoile your fun but the Hitler Assasination of 17 times, and the Sucess of hitler being Assasinated, and most of the higher officials beoing arested apart from Raeder etc etc are in the games event for Germany if you ever looked in thier

Of course I know all about *that*. I saw that the moment
I looked through the Germany.txt event file...i even made this point
severeal posts ago...

So not points in this event being maid.

Actually, there was more than just ONE assassination attempt.
I'm currently looking at the Munich beerhall bombing attempt
that was foiled only because Adolf left the hall 17 minutes ahead
of the big boom...and that was in 1939(!)....

The problem is, figuring out which assassination attempts would've
actually had a good chance of suceeding, because if you put in
all 17, then the game will ALWAYS be ahistorical....

(5% chance of him being assassinated each time...that adds up
to a 85% chance of him not surviving if you play the game thru...)

I'm hoping to tie in the Assassination Mod with The Yogi's
New Order in the East events...so that certain options are not
available to you if Adolf is alive....

[BzAli]

Originally posted by MKSheppard
The problem is, figuring out which assassination attempts would've
actually had a good chance of suceeding, because if you put in
all 17, then the game will ALWAYS be ahistorical....

(5% chance of him being assassinated each time...that adds up
to a 85% chance of him not surviving if you play the game thru...)

Not trying to be a smartass here, but that's not the way you canlculate it.

Actually, having 17 5% chances of getting Hitler killed, would result in one of them succeding only 58 % of the times... Trust me on this one, I study physics, and with that follows some statistics and mathematics.

A quick break-down: 5 % of Hitlers death is 95 % of his survival.
That is, for him to survive each time, is 95 % of 95 % of 95 % etc., in all .95^17 = .418, or approximately 41,8 %.

So, even with 17 assasination attempts, with 5 % chance of succes each time, Hitler would still be standing in 1945 42 % of the times.

[MKSheppard]

Originally posted by BzAli
Not trying to be a smartass here, but that's not the way you canlculate it.

Actually, having 17 5% chances of getting Hitler killed, would result in one of them succeding only 58 % of the times... Trust me on this one, I study physics, and with that follows some statistics and mathematics.

A quick break-down: 5 % of Hitlers death is 95 % of his survival.
That is, for him to survive each time, is 95 % of 95 % of 95 % etc., in all .95^17 = .418, or approximately 41,8 %.

So, even with 17 assasination attempts, with 5 % chance of succes each time, Hitler would still be standing in 1945 42 % of the times.

Cool.

I'm just a HS Grad with no experience in statistics, playing
with this game, trying to make it more fun and realistic, lol.