Getting Sweden going(better)

[Gustav_Dk]

Hello. I just reach the year 1500 with Sweden.
Things are good I believe. I have taken over half of Norway, all my cores in Denmark and the island of Fyn. I have also taken provinces from Novgorod. I have 12000 knights under arms and a honorable reputation, however I have noticed that I am technologically inferior to most european powers. I have naval 1, land 1, trade 3, government 1, production 1. I have been building workshops and sending out merchants as often as I can, but my economy seems stale. I am capable of building 1 workshop a year or sending out a bunch of merchants. Also My stability takes forever to improve.

I need suggestions to improve my technology, stabilty and economy... Anyone else has suggestions for sweden in this situation: Doing fine but still being eclipsed by southern/central european powers..

[Kashked]

Im in a pretty similar position, Sweden, 1507.
I control all but 3 norweigan provinces (the remaining belong to Great Britain) and all of the danish provinces, plus Hamburg, Pskov, Ingermanland, Kexholm and Neva.
But my economy just sucks. I have 30% inflation, level 2 at all sciences and -2 stability. Add to this a tarnished reputation.

Although my position is strong I believe I have traded long term supremacy for short term territorial gains, which is easy when you play sweden. You really want acces to the continent, so you make war on the Danes. You want a secure scandinavia, so you battle the norweigans, and of course there is always the russians looming over you in the east.

I cant really give you an answer to your question, 'cause I have basicly the same problem.

[Walter Model]

Tech 1 in land is EXTREMELY poor by 1500. You should have on average (going from Gov-Land)

4-5-7-3-5 and limited inflation. Of course, this is only an estimate, and won't apply for every country. To get research up, I focus ALL of my money on one technology, for example at the start i'll focus on gov 1 and gov 2, then go for another, and keep doing that, letting all of your technologies advance at an EQUAL pace.

[Carewolf2]

Originally Posted by Gustav_Dk

Hello. I just reach the year 1500 with Sweden.
Things are good I believe. I have taken over half of Norway, all my cores in Denmark and the island of Fyn. I have also taken provinces from Novgorod. I have 12000 knights under arms and a honorable reputation, however I have noticed that I am technologically inferior to most european powers. I have naval 1, land 1, trade 3, government 1, production 1. I have been building workshops and sending out merchants as often as I can, but my economy seems stale. I am capable of building 1 workshop a year or sending out a bunch of merchants. Also My stability takes forever to improve.

I need suggestions to improve my technology, stabilty and economy... Anyone else has suggestions for sweden in this situation: Doing fine but still being eclipsed by southern/central european powers..

Stop the military aggressions and focus on research. DUH!

[Gustav_Dk]

well. Thing is I have only fought one (1) aggressive war. my russian provinces were a result of Novgerod DoWing me. My norwegian gains the same. Only the danish provinces were a result of a offensive war... I am not really into warmongering that much.
My question is: how can I focus more on research. I am not minting, but I need to spend a lot of money to avoid all the stab. hits I seem to take...

[StephenT]

Originally Posted by Kashked

But my economy just sucks. I have 30% inflation

Which means that your tech level will generally be at best only 70% of what all your rivals have. When they're at 10, you'll be at 7. When they're at 30, you'll be at 21. You'll also only be able to afford an army and navy 70% the size of an equally wealthy enemy country. (Assuming they have no inflation).

You're right that embarking on a military conquest spree gives you short-term gains at the expense of long-term strength: unless the provinces you capture are rich enough to outweigh the disadvantages. As for what to do next, you have a couple of choices. Pulling your economy around is likely to take many years, during which time you shouldn't engage in any more major wars in Europe. (Colonial wars, on the other hand, should be fine). Alternatively, forget the economy, and just try and conquer your way to total power before your inevitable economic collapse takes place.

How to improve your economy?

First, do you have cores on all your new provinces? If not, wait 25 years and you will. That'll see your income from the affected provinces increase by a factor of ten. If you don't have a land connection to your capital, that's a problem; either capture one, or move your sliders to Naval and possibly take the Viceroys national idea.

As for merchants, they can be a huge moneymaker and really boost your trade, but if you have a poor reputation (due to conquests) this will cripple them. Again, wait 10-15 years until your reputation improves back to honourable. Consider the two National Ideas that boost your trade chances; they're very useful.

Keep your stability at +3. If it drops, get it back to +3 as quickly as possible. This has a direct effect on your income and your economic growth, not to mention revolt risk. Recovering stability quickly requires a homogenous empire (with most or all provinces being your state religion and an accepted culture, Swedish in your case). There are province improvements you can build at higher tech levels to reduce the time further, and of course the luck of an effective monarch also helps. Finally, if it's a real problem there is a National Idea to help too (church attendance).

If you're avoiding wars for the time being, don't forget to reduce military maintenance. spend mony on province improvements and trade, and perhaps save up for five years or so for a manufactory.

Colonial expansion can be expensive, but very useful - a single Caribbean province with sugar as its resource can produce as much income as ten poor Scandinavian provinces with fish or grain.

Above all, be patient. To keep a healthy economy, after a big war of conquest you should spend the next 30-40 years or so consolidating and recovering before your next burst of expansion.

[StephenT]

Originally Posted by Gustav_Dk

my russian provinces were a result of Novgerod DoWing me.

As presumably non-culture, non-core provinces (and Orthodox too?), they're still dragging down your stability and tax revenue. Either wait 25 years and maybe even send a missionary, or cut your losses and sell them back to Novgorod or release them as a vassal if that's an option.

[Kashked]

Which means that your tech level will generally be at best only 70% of what all your rivals have. When they're at 10, you'll be at 7. When they're at 30, you'll be at 21. You'll also only be able to afford an army and navy 70% the size of an equally wealthy enemy country. (Assuming they have no inflation).

Well, it's still rising. 6% in the last 20 years, so it's slowed down from it's original curve atleast.

Pulling your economy around is likely to take many years, during which time you shouldn't engage in any more major wars in Europe.

I tried that, but then Mecklemburg invaded Denmark so I had to invade too, to keep the germans off my dorrstep. This led to a war of Austrian succesion, as well as two more wars with Mecklemburg and one with Brandenburg and Bavaria.
Whatever I do I can't seem to stay out of wars, mainly because I get bored with the game in peacetime.

If you don't have a land connection to your capital, that's a problem

Does the landpasses, for example those between Sjealland and Fyn, or Stockholm and Finland count as a land connection?

[StephenT]

Originally Posted by Kashked

Whatever I do I can't seem to stay out of wars, mainly because I get bored with the game in peacetime.

Well, that's a problem. It's not wrong to play the game as a warmonger, but it does limit your options more. Just a thought: you could try playing a shorter scenario instead of the Grand Campaign... (For example, play as Sweden starting in 1700 and deliberately end the game in 1721, and try to do better than Charles XII did in reality)

Does the landpasses, for example those between Sjealland and Fyn, or Stockholm and Finland count as a land connection?

I'm not sure. Try opening the province screen, and hover your mouse over the 'tax' value. You'll see a list of modifiers in green and red: "no land connection to capital" will be listed as one of them if it does apply.

[Skarion]

You can easily annex Denmark and Norway during the first 15 years of gaming even on the hardest difficulty.

So during this period I usualy mint the economy enough to get a good defensive line in Jylland and towards Novgorod.

When this is accomplished just upgrade your provinces and such. Also make sure your minting = 0, you don't want any more inflation then the 10 inflation you get by the time youve annexed Norway/Denmark.

Now select good national ideas. Research, Smithian economics and such stuff are wonders for your economy and research.

Focus your research on a few areas (I never research Stability, Naval or Trade, instead I let these get upgraded by advicers).

Oh, and remember: ALWAYS pick advicers that put money on research. They make the research speed up the first 100 years enormously.

[Mats_SX]

Originally Posted by Kashked

Does the landpasses, for example those between Sjealland and Fyn, or Stockholm and Finland count as a land connection?

To my knowledge they do.
My best tip to improve your situation would be to as fast as possible get rid of you scarily high and completely lethal inflation. The best way would be the National Idea National Bank and keep minting at 0 for the rest of the game. If you cannot do this, then you will in the next 50 years way behind in every tech and your economy nothing to brag about... Try some more wars, vassalize, and cripple some countries and go for the high tax provs. If you are way behind in tech, try to use the Quantity slider and the Narrowminded will give you, even less tech, but good possibilities to become some kind of a religious monster

As a second option, use this experience and restart, trying to do the same things better.

[Gustav_Dk]

Originally Posted by StephenT

As presumably non-culture, non-core provinces (and Orthodox too?), they're still dragging down your stability and tax revenue. Either wait 25 years and maybe even send a missionary, or cut your losses and sell them back to Novgorod or release them as a vassal if that's an option.

They are cores now... But you think selling them off would improve my economy?

How much would I sell them for?

[Westheim]

Originally Posted by Walter Model

Tech 1 in land is EXTREMELY poor by 1500. You should have on average (going from Gov-Land)

4-5-7-3-5 and limited inflation.

Sorry, but from my experiences that's just ridiculous ... I played countries in different sizes (Castille, Hungary, Lorraine) and never got even close to that. Maybe, if you get some **** or ***** advisors on certain techs ...

How can you get 30% inflation? No wonder you're broken ... I always try to get no inflation at all, that's the safest way to stay on track. Only in my Lorraine game right now I had to mint some money to get through some hard times, but my maximum inflation was 1.0%

[Boblof]

pff n00bs ^^
you reduce denmark and norway to one province minors in that first war (that is quite possible even on hardest difficulty on the HRP mod), don't mint anything. then you just try to lay your hands on as many fur producing provinces you can from then on, colonize the new world and so on

[StephenT]

Originally Posted by Gustav_Dk

They are cores now... But you think selling them off would improve my economy?

If they're already cores then probably not, but it depends on how wealthy they are. Do they produce fur (valuable) or fish (useless)? Do you have to keep a large, expensive army to defend them from Novgorod, or are relations with them friendly? Are they the same religion as you?

Originally Posted by Westheim

Sorry, but from my experiences that's just ridiculous ... I played countries in different sizes (Castille, Hungary, Lorraine) and never got even close to that. Maybe, if you get some **** or ***** advisors on certain techs ...

I checked the saves of the two games I've played past 1500:

England in 1508:
Gov-6
Prod-2
Trade-3
Naval-8
Land-2
(total of 21 levels)


Castile(Spain) in 1509:
Gov-7
Prod-7
Trade-3
Naval-2
Land-3
(total of 22 levels)

That's less than the 24 levels of tech shown in Walter's example, but pretty close. And my inflation is zero in both cases. (And Castile was vassalised by Portugal and lost half her income for 10 years, which didn't exactly help...).
Twelve years later I had Spain up to 8-8-4-5-7.

If you look at the tech due dates, the game assumes you should research, on average, one level (in all five techs) every ten years. You should be at 6 in 1500, 16 in 1600, 26 in 1700. After that things speed up, because so much trade income is available, and you should be gaining a new tech every four years.

[Gustav_Dk]

Originally Posted by Boblof

pff n00bs ^^
you reduce denmark and norway to one province minors in that first war (that is quite possible even on hardest difficulty on the HRP mod), don't mint anything. then you just try to lay your hands on as many fur producing provinces you can from then on, colonize the new world and so on

You are right. I am noob in this game but I expect to improve my game. I am happy that you find the game so easy. Maybe you can become an E-sport star.

[Sleepyhead]

You really shouldn't expand into Russia. Focus on Scandinavia and try to gain some wealthy German provinces (preferably from the same culture, I prefer Pomeranian and Lübeck + Pommern)

[Boblof]

Originally Posted by Gustav_Dk

You are right. I am noob in this game but I expect to improve my game. I am happy that you find the game so easy. Maybe you can become an E-sport star.

sorry, I didn't actually men that "pff n00bs" comment, hence the ^^ after it
I just wanted to say that it is quite possible to reduce them in the inital war, 3-4 cavalry regiments and Engelbrekt are more than enough to slap them silly and compleatly deplete their manpower.
go easy on Denmark to avoid them being invaded from the south by mecklemburg. I red somewhere that if you have both a ship in port and a fleet in the sund the danes cant march across the strait, that would make it alot easier to let them keep some regiments in Själland without having to guard skåne with half your military (since the straits are a bit bugged), but I haven't tried that yet (would get a lot easier then if I don't have to guard Skåne all the time).
although if you want to use your badpoints for something else like expanding into germany (I agree with sleepyhead, germany is superior when it comes to income, i however like to roleplay so I always go for uniting scandinavia and create a baltic mare nostrum ) you migh just want to take your cores and sieze their colonies (Finnmark and the two Iceland provinces, Iceland is good if you want to go after North America) along with some money.
but really Russia isn't that bad, olonets, kexholm and Ingermanland are quite valuable.
btw straits count as land connections.