Just some HOI3, thoughts...

[RigVild]

Hi folks!

If there will be a Hoi3, wich I pray to god for every night, it has to ship with some, wich I think, IMPORTANT changes from Hoi2 or Doomsday.

1. No more infinite range for ai controlled naval vessels.
2. The possibilty to use money in a more accurate way. Like my own, resource, infrastructure, factory development events launched every 1 january every year. Basicaly you get a choice to spend some money to increase either one of the above. I also have random struck oil, iron, rare, coal events. Makes it more intresting. Holy Moses!, Iceland have oil fields?!
3. Include Northpole and Southpole. Why? Because they are there in RL. Or am I wrong?
4. Resource targeted bombing.
5. Improved spies. The ability to get information of enemy naval and, perhaps, land movement. Example(Some ingame quick message feature). "Telegram from OKW. Our spies in England learned of a huge fleet leaving Scapaflow 0600 hours, heading for Tobruk!" Makes it fun to try to mount a naval bombing attack to that fleet. Etc. Land based movements is easier to keep secret then a large ship convoy. So this feature maybe used only for naval movement.
6. More sea zones!
7. Recycling. When you scrap something you get the resources back. Example. 10 ic unit build for 100 days, 10 ic is 20 energy, 10 iron, 5 rare, for 100 days = 2000 E, 1000 I, 500 R. And the manpower of course. To bad I cant get the time spent back! :P
8. Improved use of submarines and other naval vessels. You get the choice to engage enemy fleet or try to break away when 2 fleets are in same province. (Not needed though if they add alot more sea zones) You get a chance to break away if failed though, combat. Submarines get a large bonus for this break away chance. Also I would like to see submarines have the passive ability to scout enemy traffic when enemy fleets are moving to its province. And since naval provinces dont have any info about them. Fill that empty info window with the subs recon report of ships currently in its province. To make it balance though. Give the DD´s and probarly CL´s a chance to locate the sub and draw it into battle.
9. Improved production. (This one is gone make some of you crazy, :P , its just an idea).
9a. For every Port built u get a (very little?) little production(time or cost, or both) bonus for naval vessels.
9b. For every Airport built u get a (very little?) little production(time or cost, or both) bonus for aircrafts.
9c. For every Factory same as above for tanks, moto and mechs.
9d. For every Infrastructure same as above for infantry units.
10. Scout, radar planes. Or increased range of the landbased radar as you build more in same province and research new radar techs. Scapaflow could detect German naval ships outside Norways coast.
11. A better combat information screen. If you have a 30 unit fleet, I want to be able to see the status of all those units at the sametime.
12. US needs more land provinces.
13. Be able to send supplies manually using transports to other nations. (Cause then enemy can target them with subs or whatever)
14. Active coastal defences. Dont get too close. One sea-province in range. (But only if they add more sea zones. Otherwise, the japs will have super duper guns in the pacific. ) This feature could be handled the same way as AA.
15. AA and active coastal battery. A chance to actually destroy an aircraft or sink a ship. No matter its strength. A critical hit if you want to. Even though I know a aircraft unit represent alot of aircrafts. But its vital. The Germans wont let the Allies bomb them for free. :P

Well thats about that. For now. Please respond!

Currently, Doomsday is the best game on the planet, but dont discuss that here. Talk about the ideas i just put down instead and add your own ones!

Bye Bye !

[Ironhead 5]

Originally Posted by RigVild

Hi folks!

If there will be a Hoi3, wich I pray to god for every night, it has to ship with some, wich I think, IMPORTANT changes from Hoi2 or Doomsday.

1. No more infinite range for ai controlled naval vessels.
2. The possibilty to use money in a more accurate way. Like my own, resource, infrastructure, factory development events launched every 1 january every year. Basicaly you get a choice to spend some money to increase either one of the above. I also have random struck oil, iron, rare, coal events. Makes it more intresting. Holy Moses!, Iceland have oil fields?!
3. Include Northpole and Southpole. Why? Because they are there in RL. Or am I wrong?
4. Resource targeted bombing.
5. Improved spies. The ability to get information of enemy naval and, perhaps, land movement. Example(Some ingame quick message feature). "Telegram from OKW. Our spies in England learned of a huge fleet leaving Scapaflow 0600 hours, heading for Tobruk!" Makes it fun to try to mount a naval bombing attack to that fleet. Etc. Land based movements is easier to keep secret then a large ship convoy. So this feature maybe used only for naval movement.
6. More sea zones!
7. Recycling. When you scrap something you get the resources back. Example. 10 ic unit build for 100 days, 10 ic is 20 energy, 10 iron, 5 rare, for 100 days = 2000 E, 1000 I, 500 R. And the manpower of course. To bad I cant get the time spent back! :P
8. Improved use of submarines and other naval vessels. You get the choice to engage enemy fleet or try to break away when 2 fleets are in same province. (Not needed though if they add alot more sea zones) You get a chance to break away if failed though, combat. Submarines get a large bonus for this break away chance. Also I would like to see submarines have the passive ability to scout enemy traffic when enemy fleets are moving to its province. And since naval provinces dont have any info about them. Fill that empty info window with the subs recon report of ships currently in its province. To make it balance though. Give the DD´s and probarly CL´s a chance to locate the sub and draw it into battle.
9. Improved production. (This one is gone make some of you crazy, :P , its just an idea).
9a. For every Port built u get a (very little?) little production(time or cost, or both) bonus for naval vessels.
9b. For every Airport built u get a (very little?) little production(time or cost, or both) bonus for aircrafts.
9c. For every Factory same as above for tanks, moto and mechs.
9d. For every Infrastructure same as above for infantry units.
10. Scout, radar planes. Or increased range of the landbased radar as you build more in same province and research new radar techs. Scapaflow could detect German naval ships outside Norways coast.
11. A better combat information screen. If you have a 30 unit fleet, I want to be able to see the status of all those units at the sametime.
12. US needs more land provinces.
13. Be able to send supplies manually using transports to other nations. (Cause then enemy can target them with subs or whatever)
14. Active coastal defences. Dont get too close. One sea-province in range. (But only if they add more sea zones. Otherwise, the japs will have super duper guns in the pacific. ) This feature could be handled the same way as AA.
15. AA and active coastal battery. A chance to actually destroy an aircraft or sink a ship. No matter its strength. A critical hit if you want to. Even though I know a aircraft unit represent alot of aircrafts. But its vital. The Germans wont let the Allies bomb them for free. :P

Well thats about that. For now. Please respond!

Currently, Doomsday is the best game on the planet, but dont discuss that here. Talk about the ideas i just put down instead and add your own ones!

Bye Bye !

1. Agreed
3. North pole is only ice, right? Not feasible for military units. Antarctica would have to have something in the realm of -200% infrastructure, but maybe provide lots of resources? Probably not feasible either.
4. Doesn't STR bombing hit resources?
5. An interesting idea... like a random intelligence event? I like it.
6. Is this necessary? So many sea zones already.
7. I like this idea as well.
8. I like it.
9. Good idea, makes building these things more worthwhile.

Some other decent ideas as well. I am a proponent of a better command system - tweaking chain of command, HQs, etc, to accurately reflect the command hierarchy. No more field marshals commanding 12 divisions; Field Marshals should be commanding 3 Generals, who should be commanding 3 lieutenant generals, who should be commanding 3 major generals, who would all be commanding a division.

[Draigh]

1) Of course!
2) Nice idea about the money, but the resources seem a little too much. After all, this is a historical game, so Ethiopia doesn't suddenly get huge resources and starts world conquest.
4) I'd like to see that logistical strikes hurt supply depots. Of course, there are only very few of them, but it happened IRL that supply and oil dumps were frequent targets for air and even land raids.
5) Nice idea.
6) Not necessarily. If you would, for example, give the channel more provinces, that would make it much easier for the Kriegsmarine to break out, as the RN has to spread its fleets out. I like the way it is now, as it gives you plenty of opportunity to block important sealanes.
9) Disagree. This is way too exploit-rich. And what does infrastructure have to do with infantry? It seems like an emergency to make sure infantry also gets something.
14) Coastal defences did not come into play until ships sailed right up to the coast. Even at the landings in Normandy, the supporting battleships were out of range of the coastal batteries, so suddenly they would even start sinking ships that are sailing on the high seas? It's modelled fine now, IMO.
15) No way that one critical hit can destroy a complete squadron. AA kills some planes, and it's fine as it is. IRL, no squadrons were annihilated by AA either. Only fighters can do that.

I also second Ironhead's chain of command comment. HQ's should have more influence on battles, like armies in surrounding provinces receiving a minor amount of the HQ's leader's skill and trait bonuses.

[Ironhead 5]

I'm happy to see that there are others who agree with me on revising HQs and chain of command. I hate putting a lousy Gen/FM in charge of a HQ, and to me major generals are almost useless.

[Lucky]

Originally Posted by Ironhead 5

3. North pole is only ice, right? Not feasible for military units. Antarctica would have to have something in the realm of -200% infrastructure, but maybe provide lots of resources? Probably not feasible either.

At least Germany could build top secret research centers there.

[alan_le_cowboy]

Originally Posted by Lucky

At least Germany could build top secret research centers there.

Especially the so-waited by blue emu orbital mind control weapon.

[Volt]

- I totally agree on the HQs and a revision of the command chain.
- airforce overhaul - It should not be possible to bomb entire divisions out of existence. Effectivity of air attacks should harshly decrease when it's like 12 air divs against one inf.
- navy overhaul - Naval battles sometimes took several days. One naval province is several thousand square miles. Therefore, especially battles against subs should no longer wipe out entire fleets within two hours, and not all ships should close in immediately.
- army overhaul - Battles should take MUCH longer, too, even it's 3 vs 1.
All in all, get rid of the old EU-system which treats battles like in the 17th century: Two armies face each other and exchange shot after shot.

And if it's technically feasible, the old province system could be abandoned and replaced by some 3d map, but maybe that's more something for HOI4...

[Ironhead 5]

Originally Posted by Lucky

At least Germany could build top secret research centers there.

Well if you are going to do that, Britain should be able to access the 00-agent menu from the Intelligence folder and send in an international man of mystery to destroy the research center and sleep with lots of beautiful women. Will probably also require a roulette option whereby UK's cash can be gambled on the wheel. Come on, vingt et deux...

[Ganz Anders]

More land provinces, like in "Victoria".
And somewhat better diplomacy (there are still some annoying things, like Germany creating Slovakia while allied to Hungary, or USSR not automatically allied to Germany when they succeed in proposing the "Unholy Alliance").

[Slaalien]

meany wise thoughts there,) i would like if you could do more with a strong navy, example; in normandie, 1944 the allied supreme quarters used strong and precise naval guns to soften upp the germans before launching an attack, i cant remember the exact loss of this imence atry barrage, but the material damage was huge..

even doh the germans inflicted severe damage to the allied troops and material, doh they were undermanned, armed. it was many other things that supposed german defeat those days, but they recisted pretty good for a long time.. much thanks to induvidial courage/leader skills and theyr commanders knowlegde.. think that leadership and divisions iduvidial leaders should have more bonuses, and that we should be able to set commanders as low as divisions sized.. with cournals for exmpl

[Umbriel]

Originally Posted by Lucky

At least Germany could build top secret research centers there.

They actually did give serious thought to establishing resupply facilities for U-boats in Antarctica. The expedition that surveyed partly in furtherance of that plan was what gave rise to all the wacky "Admiral Byrd vs. Nazi UFOs" lore in the first place.

Unfortunately there's no mechanism I'm aware of in the game that would allow the German player to set up an Antarctic base for U-boats (to which he would, of course, have to run supply convoys... good luck ) that wouldn't also let him operate a fleet of battleships and amphibious transports from there.

I think a better candidate for "additional god-forsaken map location" would be the Svalbard Islands, which at least had significant coal output in the WWII era. I guess an argument could be made for giving Svalbard and Neuschwabenland a bit of Rare Materials output to reflect whaling operations there. Existing territories like the Falkland Islands could qualify for this too.

Re: RigVild's #14 -- I'm unfamiliar with the current effects of coastal fortresses, but it would be realistic to allow them to inflict some harm on fleets conducting coastal bombardment or amphibious landings. Historically, the Germans lost the cruiser Blücher to coastal guns during the attempt to land at Oslo, and the Japanese lost a destroyer during the invasion of Wake Island. Other than on actual attacking forces, though, coastal guns should have no game effect. About the only chokepoints narrow enough for such things to be a factor are those already closed to naval forces not occupying the surrounding land.

[AmonRa]

I think that expecially the Diplomatic system could be reworked:
POSSIBILITY TO PARTIALLY DECIDE ABOUT THE RESERCH OF PUPPETS A problem with puppets ist that they always decides to make useless reserch or reserch that you're already doing.
HOW COULD THAT WORK:
1 - All these schould be diplomatic action availeble only for puppets, they schould cost money etc...
2 - Possibility to decide complytelly about one tech reserch
3 - Possibility to decide about the main research area (inf, arm-art, industry etc...) that puppet would research with all the tech team (except for one that will always remain free) in that area.
4 - Possibility to impose own doctrine to puppets: how schould does work: one diplomatic action = a) delate one doctrin. b) You should do that untill you can change the doctrin line, give blueprints.
5 - Possibility to impose to reserch befor recived blueprint


I AGREE EXPECIALLY WITH THE MORE LANDS AREAS!!

I think that the relation between Nation should influence the decision in events... for exemple if Deutschland and USSR have +200 relation schould be easier that Russia ask in R-M Pact for an Alliance and easier that Deutschland agree.
If they have -200 schould be unpossible too, that they can agree with R-M pact.

[Slaalien]

Originally Posted by Umbriel

They actually did give serious thought to establishing resupply facilities for U-boats in Antarctica. The expedition that surveyed partly in furtherance of that plan was what gave rise to all the wacky "Admiral Byrd vs. Nazi UFOs" lore in the first place.

Unfortunately there's no mechanism I'm aware of in the game that would allow the German player to set up an Antarctic base for U-boats (to which he would, of course, have to run supply convoys... good luck ) that wouldn't also let him operate a fleet of battleships and amphibious transports from there.

I think a better candidate for "additional god-forsaken map location" would be the Svalbard Islands, which at least had significant coal output in the WWII era. I guess an argument could be made for giving Svalbard and Neuschwabenland a bit of Rare Materials output to reflect whaling operations there. Existing territories like the Falkland Islands could qualify for this too.

Re: RigVild's #14 -- I'm unfamiliar with the current effects of coastal fortresses, but it would be realistic to allow them to inflict some harm on fleets conducting coastal bombardment or amphibious landings. Historically, the Germans lost the cruiser Blücher to coastal guns during the attempt to land at Oslo, and the Japanese lost a destroyer during the invasion of Wake Island. Other than on actual attacking forces, though, coastal guns should have no game effect. About the only chokepoints narrow enough for such things to be a factor are those already closed to naval forces not occupying the surrounding land.

i agree! is should be possible to create coastel guns AND coastel forts.. i think that static guns/aa and so on should have a much larger effect! a coastel torpedo battery or a coastel gun (not coast fort) should be possible to build, and that they could sink ships.. it sounds like Umbiel knows his history as a proud norwwegian i am familiar with the Blücher incident in the Oslo fjord

[AmonRa]

Originally Posted by Slaalien

i agree! is should be possible to create coastel guns AND coastel forts.. i think that static guns/aa and so on should have a much larger effect! a coastel torpedo battery or a coastel gun (not coast fort) should be possible to build, and that they could sink ships.. it sounds like Umbiel knows his history as a proud norwwegian i am familiar with the Blücher incident in the Oslo fjord

I personally don't agree: that would make of HOI a game like other minor strategy game, where you have only to fortify and to wait to become stronger to attack. History sayed that the static protection have never been so effective after the artillery modernization. Giveing more effectiveness to costal fort AA etc would make convenient in the game to fortify instead to build movement troops. Is not Midle Age, is WWII the Castle were already useless in the I WW !!
But I personally agree with the Idea to give the possibility to build costal anti-navy gun (to be really uneffective)

[Slaalien]

Originally Posted by AmonRa

I personally don't agree: that would make of HOI a game like other minor strategy game, where you have only to fortify and to wait to become stronger to attack. History sayed that the static protection have never been so effective after the artillery modernization. Giveing more effectiveness to costal fort AA etc would make convenient in the game to fortify instead to build movement troops. Is not Midle Age, is WWII the Castle were already useless in the I WW !!
But I personally agree with the Idea to give the possibility to build costal anti-navy gun (to be really uneffective)

hehe i see what u mean i dont mean that a coastel gun wpuld have the effect to destroy a fllet of 30 ships.. but in 1939-45 the navnal guns did do damage to water vessels as well as land forces! they DID sink ships.. so i may have wanted that if a province had coastel guns/batteries they would hamper an invation not only by redusing they org. but also be able to inflict damage to f.eks destroyers and landing crafts that HAD to go near the coeast to do theyr job

[corner_mcloud]

I agree with the lot of you about HQ, Divisions and Combat.... Hopefully important people are reading....

I want some fixes done to the Air Force as well....I can't stant that when you crater a runway that you cannot also destroy planes on the ground... was very popular during the war and would love to use this in the game....it would have to bebalanced so that whole wings are not destroyed wholesale... but defenitly strength losses and some org losses too.

I also like using sprites as well as counters. I like sprites because I like seeing aircraft fly around and seeing huge aircraft carriers ruling the seas. So since there are people who like both, I think HOI3 should really boost some of the graphics for the game...but not to insane amounts that require graphic cards that are imorted from mars! Just to lively things up a bit. More land areas are also great, as well as sea zones...and maybe a more glamorous map.

Also River names would be really cool

My final suggestion would be to have a history slider that would cover the history of your nation.....it could be like a portfolio that you can add stuff to, and edit the way the computer automatically adds stuff. You can add pics from the game, battles from the game, your own text.. outside stuff... whatever to enhance your history... even printing it later would be awesome.... it would be like a AAR builder within the game.... Just imagine we could all share them online together,... our histories! Yay!

What do you gentlemen think?

[Slaalien]

totaly agree.. the Luftwaffe destroyed allmost all of the soviet airplanes (in the western parts of ocupied poland) on the ground during the first week of operation barbarossa! the German highcommand counted on tac and cas to destroy soviet planes before they could reach the sky and attack german forces!

good idea

[AmonRa]

i think that the CAS should work something different... they actually bomb the area, but they should bomb exactly the land thet you choose... German Stuka where effective exactly to make the enemy moving slower and allowing German Panzer to encircle them.
So we would have a lot more of differences too with the TAC

CAS could be very less effective ( with soft, hard att... and expecially def) but they could target the exactly land that you choose

[Disgustoid]

Originally Posted by AmonRa

i think that the CAS should work something different... they actually bomb the area, but they should bomb exactly the land thet you choose... German Stuka where effective exactly to make the enemy moving slower and allowing German Panzer to encircle them.
So we would have a lot more of differences too with the TAC

CAS could be very less effective ( with soft, hard att... and expecially def) but they could target the exactly land that you choose

It wouldn't be half a bad idea if you could "attach" CAS to land-units ... kind of like giving them a "guard" unit ... they'd then scramble and support those land units whenever they engage in land-combat

[Slaalien]

Originally Posted by Disgustoid

It wouldn't be half a bad idea if you could "attach" CAS to land-units ... kind of like giving them a "guard" unit ... they'd then scramble and support those land units whenever they engage in land-combat

i think that would have been great! that way commanders could command CAS into action beside the regualr troops! but i would also ceep CAS as a own branch of airwings