March Through Time -Development Thread

[King of Men]

The Great Game

Development Thread

Due to some issues, I have taken over Trav's previous position as custodian of the first post and updater of the rules. This post is a blatant rip-off of his old first post. So where it refers to me in the third person, that's Trav speaking.


I sometimes update this thread with current information. Please post here if you have questions or comments.

Game Start Date: March 25, 2006
Game Day and Time : Saturday @ 0600PST/0900EST/1400GMT/1500CET

Europa Universalis 2 - v1.09 , using KoM's CK conversion, with no events and random leaders

Settings:

• Difficulty : Hard
• AI Agressiveness : Normal
• Game Speed :Slow - Below Normal
• Autosave : Yearly

Details:

Host

• Absolut

Maps for 1712 :







Interested Players and their Title:

• Formula - Italy
• King of Men - Norway (ICQ#205752074)
• Dr Bob - England (ICQ#284067934)
• martmol - Byzantium
• BurningEgo - Castille
• Sid - China
• Absolut - Burgundy

Related stuff :

• One True AAR thread
• Cheap knockoff AAR thread, dealing with the unimportant nations
• Diplomacy thread

Game Rules

Game Play:

• If you wish to join, you must post here and get ICQ. An exception is made if we are in need of subs, which is chronic. In this case random Vnet people are accepted provided they talk, and sometimes when they don't. This is not a good thing, but we do it anyway.
• We will start the game at the scheduled time with the players that show, if you are going to be late or can’t make it, send an ICQ or post here. We can stop the game and rehost to pick up late players. A player is responsible for finding their own sub. Alas, we enforce the start-on-time thing a bit sporadically.
• Gentlemanly conduct is required at all times. You are certainly permitted to ravage another player's kingdom, carry off his daughters and his treasure, kill his armies, and force him to sign a humiliating peace; but be polite about it. No swearing, no name-calling.
• No diplomacy with the country of a player who isn't present. Also, no DOWing an AI'd player country; if it DOWs you, you can defend yourself and take a province or two, but no total rapings. However, a player who is often absent may find the rest of us not enforcing this rule any too strenuously.
• Avoid AFKs. By Murphy's Law, we will always crash in the middle of one, and then the rest of us are stuck waiting for our one AFK player. If it's something really unavoidable, ok, but at least give notice, and be prepared to find we've crashed and gone on without you. And AFKs of the style "watching the TV in the other room at the same time" is really a bit rude. We're here to play, not watch you watching TV.
• Due to the scope of what we are trying to do, by playing an MP game spanning three Paradox Games, CK-EUII-Vicky. We must play the game every week, regardless of who shows up. If you know you can't make it, you must find a sub. If you can’t find a sub your country will be controlled by the AI, or ghosted if we feel sorry for you. But usually we don't.
• Map trading will be allowed with other players after 1470 , but not with AI, that means no MAP trading with the AI period.
• A player may not have more than three vassals. There will be a 100 year grace period from the start of the game due to conversion.
• Fake wars to raise a player’s stability will not be allowed. Example: Bad-Boy player is suffering with stability at -1. Friend decides he can help by declaring war on Bad-Boy to raise his stability, giving the Bad-Boy a stab boost to 0.
• A player who is force-vassalized must remain a vassal for at least 15 years. Forced and Diplomatic Vassals are required to submit to any request by their overlord that is not self-destructive. If a peace forces you to change religion, you must remain in your new religion for at least 15 years.
• Turbo-Burning is strictly forbidden. It is ok to move an army into a province and the manu burns. That's life, and the probability isn't so great. But it's not ok to start the army moving, stop, start, stop, and so on until the manu burns; that's an exploit, and makes the burning guaranteed. Anyone spotted doing this will be brutally nerfed. But I don't think this will happen, here we are all honorable men.
• No switching back to Catholicism from counter-reformed before the Edict of Tolerance.

War:

• If you attack a realm, AI or human, you must role-play a reason for it, and it must be publicly stated. It doesn't have to be a good reason; "He laughed when my horse stumbled at my recent tournament" will do. But some kind of reasoning is needed. Also, you'll probably find it easier to garner support for an attack on a player country if your reason has some kind of in game relevance.
• There will be no DOWing of a player’s vassal without a DOW of the player realm. Unless the player has had the vassal for more than 50 years, except at the beginning of the game there will be a 100 year grace period. Military Access must be canceled before DOWing a realm (AI/player).
• Do not make peace with someone's vassal if you are at war with the overlord. Peace with a vassal must be a part of a general peace treaty.
• Upon starting a player versus player war, the aggressor must state their war goals. Note, this applies to AI realms as well. This is necessary so all players will understand what the attacker is looking for and what the defender must consider to end the hostilities. For example; As the King of Italy I demand that Tunisia recognize me as their new ruler . During the conflict both sides can negotiate these demands.
• Player vs. Player Peace Offers: x provinces from enemy (+2 from an alliance). TPs count for 0, colonies ½ (less than 1000 inhabitants) and provinces with a COT count as 2.
  • 1419 - 1650 = 3 provinces
  • 1650 - 1750 = 5 provinces
  • 1750 - 1819 = 7 provinces
• Player vs. AI: Max 3 provinces (+2 for an alliance).
• A player must accept a peace offer if all of the following apply :
  • The War Exhaustion in his capital is at least 6, or the war has gone on for three years or more.
  • His enemy's warscore is 99%.
  • The peace offer would cause a stab hit if rejected.
• If a war starts and allies are called, where any ally that was a player country but that player is not present and their country is AI’d, it is ok to call on them to join.
• A player cannot release a vassal during wartime unless it is explicitly part of a peace agreement between players
• A vassal may not DOW its overlord or its overlord's allies for 15 years after the vassalisation is accepted.

Alliances:

• Formal Alliance: Any realms that are allied within the game and their alliance shows in the diplomacy window.
• Informal Alliance: Any group that works together against a common foe in a conflict but in the game they do not have a formal alliance. For the purposes of peace, these realms will be considered in a formal alliance.
• No more than 3 players in a formal alliance. No more than 2 player alliances working together informally during a conflict.

Edits:

• Manufactories, Shipyards and CC can be moved for 200d. Capitals for 800d and –2 stability.
• Holding 85% of provinces with a foreign culture, in your realm, for over 50 years will allow a player to adopt that culture. This can be done a maximum of 2 times. If you control less than 30% of provinces of a culture in your realm you will lose that culture.
• Random Leaders: (Due to not having historical leaders we will be creating leaders using the following method.)
  • Random leaders will be created for each session.
  • 2 leaders per session
  • 20 years lifespan
  • Min. 2 - Max. 5 - Average 3.5, except for siege, which is min 0, max 2, average 0.5
  • Post in AAR which combination of generals/admirals you want
  • After 1492 you can ask for a conquistador or explorer to replace one of your two leaders.
• Any public agreement between players that would occur simultaneously in the real world but that, due to limitations in the game engine cannot be done simultaneously, must be adhered to. This rule includes, but is not limited to, any type of sale.
• To encourage people to arrive on time, there will be a 1 percent deflation for those who do.
• AAR Rewards: (You may choose one)
  • 1 Deflation (-1%)
  • 1 Bad-Boy reduction (-2)
  • a Conversion (religion only)
  • Money (250d)
  • 1 Fortress increase (you must be able to build this)
  • 1 DP slider change.
• To qualify for the AAR Rewards, players must have posted their AAR to the forum, by Friday at 1500PST/1800EST/2300GMT/2400CET. The AAR must be at least 500 words.
• Technology Rewards
  • 1st player reaching Land Tech = 5: improvement of Fortress in capital (+1) Sterk 1450
  • 1st player reaching Naval Tech = 11: 5 warships Formula 1520
  • 1st player reaching Trade level = 4: a Refinery Formula 1510
  • 1st player to reach Infra level = 5: Bad-Boy reduction (-5)
• All edits will be finalized by Friday 2000PST/2300EST/ Saturday 0400GMT/0500CET . All edits must be agreed upon by a majority of the players, with the exception of moving. Do not ask for something to be edited after the deadline.
• We will maintain a clean, un-edited, save to compare with the edited one to ensure only those changes agreed to were applied. This is intended to protect the editor from accusations and players from becoming uncomfortable with so many edits occurring from week to week.

You can get ICQ here[/quote]

--------------------------------------

This is the old post that used to be number 7 in the thread. I've kept it around just because I like the strategic analysis.

I think, perhaps, that Kasperus will not be possible at this time, unless we want to postpone for yet another week; it was hard enough getting people to do the work necessary for the MyMap conversion. (If, indeed, they have been doing so. Trav, any news on those blocks of yours?) We may yet be going with the vanilla map.

However, you should note that the map Trav has posted almost certainly overstates the power of the CK majors, because it was made with the builtin converter and not my custom one. My converter gives you a lot more vassal states than does the builtin - for just one example, Sweden is a vassal to Norway and has its historical territory, rather than being annexed as in Trav's map. I had precisely this situation in mind when I coded it. So I don't think the plight of Spain, for example, is hopeless - the majors will be spending some time maneuvering to diplo-annex their vassals, and prevent the other majors from doing so. Into that diplomacy, a skilled player could well insert himself with considerable success.

Incidentally, here's the diplomatic situation for the humans, which you can't be getting from the map :

Norway and Poland are deadly foes; we've been sparring for dominance of Russia and the Baltic since Norway's recovery from the Great Rising, around 1230. At the moment Poland is in the ascendant, having just won a major war to recover Novgorod and surrounding lands.

Burgundy (if it's still played - RP, are you out there?) proclaims itself a satisfied power, although its intervention in the Norway-Poland war that I just mentioned was decisive, and it didn't scruple to restore its Weser border at Norway's expense. Not to mention its recent land grabs in France. It remains the wealthiest nation around, indeed the conversion will give it enough money to build a manufactory right away, and its kings will be excellent. Truly, I think this is the nation to watch; yet it maintains friendly relations with Poland - who needs its support against Norway - and at least an armed neutrality vis-a-vis England, who has no wish to fight over its Normandy holdings. That may change with the discovery of the New World, though.

In terms of sheer territory, Hungary certainly looks dominant; we ran out of CK time, and our crusade to free the Middle East from, um, the Catholics, was unsuccessful. (Though a few more years might have done it.) Hungary, then, has no real friends, but maintains an alliance of convenience with Norway : We'll each help the other against Poland, though I could care less if Italy spanks him and he will help me restore the trans-Weser lands when hell freezes over.

Italy dominates the Med, and has been known to project power far into Germany; but as a general rule, they keep themselves to themselves and concentrate on maintaining the balance of power. Thus they have supported Norway against Poland, France against Burgundy, Burgundy against Norway, Hungary against Poland, Byzantium against an endless parade of rebels, and Bohemia against all comers. Nobody's ally but everyone's friend, Italy is the weight in the scales of Europe.

Byzantium has finally come through its century of rebellions, and by some miracle has done it almost intact, losing only its westmost lands to an aggressive Hungary. They know full well that only Italy's aid allowed them to do so, and will most likely remain a staunch ally of that nation, concentrating on the Black Sea and Middle East rather than pushing to dominate the Med.

Of the currently played powers, that leaves only England, with a large French Empire and a strong strategic position. Due to the disastrous civil war around 1300, England has been a fairly minor power in the regional struggle, content to let Burgundy, France, Norway and Poland duke it out; but with renewed strength, it has again become involved, abandoning its traditional alliance with Norway to gorge on the corpse of France - thereby depriving Burgundy of some of its spoils. It is not clear to me, and perhaps not to Dominus either, where England will go in the future.

Then there are the AI powers :

Bohemia has been chewed on by all the surrounding nations for most of two centuries, since Duuk left us; but as we have all found it convenient to have a buffer state, and nobody has been willing to permit anyone else to annex it, it has retained its independence, if barely. (It has twice been annexed to Poland, until the resulting war convinced Sterk that he didn't really want to expand his borders that far into Central Europe. And nobody would agree to my plan to let France grab it, to strengthen them against Burgundy. Though perhaps they would have, if cheech had not dropped.) I do think that Bohemia is now a bit too weak to be a viable player nation; at the very elast, it would require a truly excellent player to make anything of it now, landlocked and surrounded by hostile Great Powers as it is.

France is in only marginally better shape; by dint of sheer national willpower (and Burgundy being AI for two sessions) they've hung onto Paris, but that's the only land they retain north of the Loire. Still, those are rich lands; England will be concentrating on colonies; and France does at least have accessto the sea. Given an alliance with, say, Norway against Burgundy, Burgundy against England, or some other permutation, it might yet recover and be the power it deserves to be. I am certain that Italy would give considerablemilitary and economic aid, should a dedicated player turn up. Such a player would have to be aware, though, that our previous man in that spot gained a reputation for extreme aggression and greed, and take care that none of that miasma clung to him.

Spain was a Great Power until about two weeks (fifteen years) ago, when its badboy became so high that its player abandoned it. This was a slightly gamey maneuver to avoid the instant collapse that high badboy gets you in CK; the AI does not suffer this penalty, and it was only twenty years until the conversion. The upshot was that we decided to divest it of its overseas possessions, and Lurken left us. It retains the Iberian peninsula, not to mention all those historical explorers; it will be in a much better position than the historical Castille, even if it can no longer contest the Western Med with Italy. And there again, nobody will have a navy to start with, and Spain has no land border with a human Power. I should think it quite capable of rising again to greatness.

In the Middle East, there are two minor, just-released powers, Egypt and Mesopotamia, freed from two hundred years of Spanish bondage; and one fairly major one, the Kingdom of Jerusalem. None of these have been played for quite some time, so they don't really have a position in the diplomacy; but especially the KoJ is in a fine position to contest the Indian Ocean with Hungary.

Finally, we can certainly discuss aiding the Timurids a bit; there's Japan and the Indian powers; China is already spoken for.

[EarendilHE]

Originally Posted by King of Men

Byzantium has finally come through its century of rebellions, and by some miracle has done it almost intact, losing only its westmost lands to an aggressive Hungary. They know full well that only Italy's aid allowed them to do so, and will most likely remain a staunch ally of that nation, concentrating on the Black Sea and Middle East rather than pushing to dominate the Med.

I was NEVER agressive to Byzanz. I even didnt listen to people, who said i should take something while byzanz´s rebellions happened.

[Traveler]

KoM,

Awsome post, truly awsome. Thank you for that break down of the powers in our game. I will do my very best to post at least the first block tonight for your perusal.

Till then,

Traveler


...

[Traveler]

KoM,

Here's my block 400-500. Hope this helps. Let me know if you want me to do another.

400;Zyriane;2;262;URAL;BOLG
401;Hlynov;2;262;HLYN;NONE
402;Veliky Ustug;1;2682;HLYN;RUSS
403;Romny;2;268;HLYN;RUSS
404;Zaozerye;1;268;BELO;RUSS
405;Chud;1;268;BELO;RUSS
406;Vologda;1;268;BELO;RUSS
407;Kostroma;2;882;YARO;RUSS
408;Beloozero;2;268;BELO;RUSS
409;Bezhetsky Verh;1;272;NOVG;RUSS
410;Novgorod;10;272;NOVG;RUSS
411;Vodi;2;275;NOVG;RUSS
412;Torzhok;3;276;NOVG;RUSS
413;Pksov;3;277;PSKO;RUSS
414;Starya Russa;2;254;NOVG;RUSS
415;Velikiye Luki;2;1394;PSKO;RUSS
416;West Dvina;1;1902;POLO;LITH
417;Vitebsk;2;1394;SMOL;RUSS
418;Orsha;3;281;POLO;LITH
419;Polotsk;6;1906;POLO;LITH
420;Aukshayts;6;1905;SAMO;LITH
421;Zhmud;5;289;SAMO;LITH
422;Scalovia;4;1908;PODL;LITH
423;Sudovia;3;1433;PODL;LITH
424;Jacwiez;2;293;TURO;LITH
425;Podlasie;2;292;PODL;LITH
426;Yatvyagi;2;879;PODL;LITH
427;Galindia;2;1909;PRUS;LITH
428;Kujawy;4;300;MAZO;POLA
429;Gnieznienskie;4;1911;MAZO;POLA
430;Lubusz;3;303;WIEL;POLA
431;Poznanskie;3;881;WIEL;POLA
432;Kaliskie;4;300;MAZO;POLA
433;Opole;4;881;WIEL;POLA
434;Lower Silesia;4;314;SILE;POLA
435;Upper Silesia;5;314;SILE;POLA
436;Liberec;1;329;DBOH;BOHE
437;Praha;8;328;DBOH;BOHE
438;Hradec Kralove;5;1425;DBOH;BOHE
439;Plzen;7;330;DBOH;BOHE
440;Opava;3;314;MORA;BOHE
441;Ostrava;3;315;MORA;BOHE
442;Trencín;1;316;PRES;HUNG
443;Nitra;3;325;PRES;HUNG
444;Esztergom;4;325;PRES;HUNG
445;Pressburg;5;326;PRES;HUNG
446;Morava;3;315;OSTE;BOHE
447;Passau;3;327;OSTE;GERM
448;Salzburg;5;1970;OSTE;GERM
449;Österreich;4;1969;OSTE;GERM
450;Sopron;2;1969;SZEK;HUNG
451;Fejer;3;1916;PECS;HUNG
452;Pecs;3;1916;PECS;HUNG
453;Szekezfehervar;2;352;SZEK;HUNG
454;Vas;4;369;SZEK;HUNG
455;Steiermark;5;1947;STEI;GERM
456;Kärnten;3;1947;KARN;GERM
457;Krain;2;1947;KRAI;GERM
458;Istria;2;368;ISTR;GERM
459;Veglia;2;366;ISTR;GERM
460;Varadzin;3;366;SLAV;CROA
461;Zagreb;4;367;SLAV;CROA
462;Krizevci;4;367;SLAV;CROA
463;Usora;5;1918;DCRO;CROA
464;Senj;3;930;DCRO;CROA
465;Zadar;6;1964;ZARB;CROA
466;Zachlumia;2;365;DCRO;CROA
467;Split;2;365;ZARB;CROA
468;Ragusa;2;469;DSER;SERB
469;Zeta;3;362;DSER;SERB
470;Dyrrachion;3;1001;DYRR;BYZA
471;Ochrid;2;1001;DYRR;BYZA
472;Épieros;2;998;BUTR;BYZA
473;Árta;1;1925;BUTR;BYZA
474;Corfu;1;479;BUTR;BYZA
475;Hellas;1;359;HELL;BYZA
476;Achaia;1;1926;PELO;BYZA
477;Methone;1;1926;PELO;BYZA
478;Monemvasia;1;360;PELO;BYZA
479;Kaneia;1;480;KRET;BYZA
480;Chandax;2;480;KRET;BYZA
481;Korinthos;3;360;PELO;BYZA
482;Atheniai;2;359;HELL;BYZA
483;Rhodos;2;481;LYKI;BYZA
484;Naxos;1;1755;AEGE;BYZA
485;Euboia;2;1432;AEGE;BYZA
486;Samos;1;1755;SAMS;BYZA
487;Lesbos;1;1928;AEGE;BYZA
488;Demetrias;2;1432;HELL;BYZA
489;Thessalia;3;1580;HELL;BYZA
490;Thessalonike;7;1580;THES;BYZA
491;Chalkidike;3;1760;THES;BYZA
492;Strymon;2;1419;STRY;BYZA
493;Philippopolis;2;1760;STRY;BYZA
494;Adrianopolis;5;1430;ADRI;BYZA
495;Kaliopolis;2;357;ADRI;BYZA
496;Byzantion;20;357;THRA;BYZA
497;Thrake;3;1430;THRA;BYZA
498;Mesembria;3;321;VARN;BULG
499;Tyrnovo;4;358;DORO;BULG
500;Serdica;3;358;DORO;BULG

Traveler

...

[King of Men]

Thanks, Trav, that helps quite a bit. Now, if bin could see his way clear to posting his blocks, I'll have most of what I need.

Edit : Bin, if you're reading this, your PM box is full - please clear it.

[King of Men]

All right, gentlemen, I am making progress. Here is a save that will actually not crash upon loading in MyMap. A major accomplishment, to be sure; I've spent three hours removing nations to find out what the problem was. Note to Johan : Hardcoding a limit on monarch IDs is fine, but could you please provide a sensible error message when the limit is exceeded, instead of a silent crash? This sort of thing is a real nightmare to debug. I guarantee nothing for its being stable for actual gameplay, but it's midnight and I have no more time for debugging. I'll do more tomorrow.

Now, you'll note some problems, like the holes in the map of Europe; this is where I have failed to assign at least one CK province to an EU province. I shall fix this tomorrow, it's easy when you can actually see the map. There are also some weirdnesses with the cultures (like Burgundy getting french and castillian), as I'm using the old vanilla culture-conversion which doesn't necessarily fit with the AGCEEP setup. Again, I'll try to fix this tomorrow. If you see any other problems, please point them out; if you can suggest a solution, even better. I'm aware of the issue with only Europe having COTs; it's a quickfix to make the save run.

[FAL]

A CK-EU2 game? Impressive stuff

I don't know how experienced you all are with EU2, but in my signature is a link to a list with stuff that many people consider a MP exploit. You could give it a look and determine which you want explicitly ban in your game.

[Lurken]

Whoever plays Castille, will enjoy kings with sick admin skill, none is lower the 16.

[King of Men]

Ack! I think I balanced those stats for the sort of kings you get in 1066. Maybe I should take another look at that.

[Ampoliros]

I am seriously tempted to join your campaign but, alas, I´m going insane already with playing 1 - 2 campaigns.

In any case I wish you guys a lot of fun & luck.

As for Kasperus´s Map you can get the newest map here :

http://hagen.let.rug.nl/~s1054864/DbD/watk3.1.rar

It´s really quite a splendid map and doubly worth investing some time to get it working.

(Basically you just copy your entire EU II - Folder and then extract this RAR-File into it - that´s all. Piece of Cake actualy)

[Dr Bob]

Originally Posted by Ampoliros

It´s really quite a splendid map and doubly worth investing some time to get it working.

(Basically you just copy your entire EU II - Folder and then extract this RAR-File into it - that´s all. Piece of Cake actualy)

But the CK scenario must be converted to Kasperus map, which is not basic at all

[King of Men]

Indeed, the comrade Doctor is correct. We are by now pretty much committed to MyMap, unless we get a serious influx of manpower willing to do considerable work. And even then it would certainly mean postponing at least one week, probably two.

[Dominus]

Just finally subscribing to this thread. And no KoM, I have absolutely no freaking clue where England is heading.

Edit:

Oh and I am not adverse to postponing. We do have to figure out if we have new victims.. err, I mean players and where the hell RP is.

Also KoM, I failed miserably at trying to convert those blocks, but anything else just tell me. And I bet if we have to adjust the blocks later where there are only minute changes needed to be made here and there that I wouldn't get lost there.

[King of Men]

OK. So I fixed all the holes (with some stretching in Poland and Russia - there are some moderately dubious assignments where there just aren't enough CK provinces); the Timurids and Golden Horde no longer jut into CK lands, so Hungary has her rightful possessions; everybody in Europe knows the whole of the CK lands at game start; and I made a host of minor bugfixes. You can find the updated save here. The cultures are still a little weird, I'll see what I can do tomorrow. I also converted Norway to Sweden for the cool events (which I hope are still there in AGCEEP...); if anyone else wants a similar conversion, speak up now. Please download the save, look through it, make sure your nation isn't doing anything fantastically weird. (There's an issue with the population of some places, like Venice; I'll do what I can tomorrow.) If you could compare to the CK save and check that the boundaries look reasonable - not exact, but reaonable - that would be good. However, I do believe this is fairly close to the final save that we'll be playing with.

[Lurken]

Just scanned through and found and that the castillian kings got even better in adm. Now the six last kings has 19 in adm, and the lowest adm score is 13, which belongs to the first king.

However, the kings are sucky-sucky in both dip and mil.

[Dominus]

Loaded it up and got notices of two nations with control of parts of the Persian Gulf. And I'm not referring to the coast =)

Oh yes, and the English Kings, after the first two, are freaking gods. Yays!

Oh and Julich has no CoT

Mark that... Julich is unclaimed and Western Isles is Terra Incognita

Thats really all I'm seeing so far... But I've got to get ready for work...

One last thing actually, previouslly mentioned, but it is actually the Gulf of Suez and the Gulf of Persia that have cities in them =))

[EarendilHE]

what about creating random leaders for all countries?

or give hungary the austrian leader file...im certainly the weakiest nation by the look of event, leaders (taX, goods probably too...but cant be changed... )

[King of Men]

About leaders, I've got the start of the code, but I can't finish it by Saturday - there's just no time.

The Western Isles thing is due to a weirdness in MyMap; they are listed as being ocean, and Bad Things happen if you try to put a city there. I fear we'll just have to live with that.

The kings, as I mentioned, are balanced for normal humans, 1066-style, with stats somewhere around 5 to 8. I'll see if a quick hack can rebalance for the results of four hundred years of seeking the Kwizatch Haderach; fortunately I softcoded most of the modifiers.

I'll look into Suez and Persia - that should never happen, to coin a phrase.

Finally, Hungary can certainly convert to Austria - no problem.

[EarendilHE]

we use agceep right? what version? im not up to date...btq, i thought we would only use mymap...not agceep...

do we get leaders determined by the martial skill? the monarch skills are determined anyway...dont change it!

[King of Men]

After dling MyMap, my version of EUII opens on a new intro screen, with a tiger superimposed on a Mercator projection map; the title is 'MyMap-AGCEEP'. If you have a different version of MyMap, we may have some trouble.

I would like to get leaders based on your dynasty, but I didn't have time to finish that feature, so you only get the built-in leaders. Still, they seem to be quite numerous in AGCEEP.