Regarding Elvira Jimenez, countess of Zamorra

[binTravkin]

There are 2 daughters of King Ferdinand 'The Great' Jimenez ingame:

- Elvira, countess of Zamorra (a lustful, cruel and deceitful monster if memory serves me)
- Urraca, courtier in Kingdom Of Castile (a chaste and pious character)

It appears that scenario maker has mistaked here for following reasons:

Ferdinand died on the feast of Saint John the Evangelist, 24 June 1065, in León, with many manifestations of ardent piety, having laid aside his crown and royal mantle, dressed in the robe of a monk and lying on a bier covered with ashes, which was placed before the altar of the church of Saint Isidore. At his death, Ferdinand divided up his kingdom between his three sons: Sancho, who received Castile; Alfonso, who received León; and Garcia, who received Galicia. His two daughters each received cities: Elvira received Toro and Urraca received Zamora.

source

Sancho however resolved to rule over his father's entire kingdom and made war on his siblings. By 1072, Sancho had overthrown his youngest brother Garcia, and forced his other brother Alfonso to flee to his Moorish vassal city of Toledo. Toro, the city of Sancho's sister Elvira, fell easily. But in a siege of Urraca's city of Zamora, King Sancho was stalled, and mysteriously assassinated on October 7, 1072. It was widely suspected that the assassination was a result of a pact between Alfonso and Urraca. There were even rumours of an incestuous relationship between the pair.

source

In other words, it appears that the characters have been swapped as:
- Urraca was countess of Zamorra
- Elvira was countess(?) of Toro, soon to be deposed by eldest brother Sancho
- Urraca is rumoured to have 'incestuous relationship' with Sancho which means she is actually the lustful one, not Elvira.
- Urraca is rumoured to have killed Sancho, so she is actually the deceitful one, not Elvira.


It would be very nice that this little mistake be fixed as part of 1.5
It's not much of work swapping them back anyway.

[binTravkin]

Doesn't this really matter anyone or am I simply posting wrong info?

[The Phoenix]

It has either been overlooked or is too late to make it into 1.05; it is a change that should be done, though.

[binTravkin]

Umm, the only thing that actually needs to be done is to switch names 'Urraca' and 'Elvira' as their descriptions fit to how they are represented in-game, only their names have been swapped.

Certainly a change that does require less than 1 minute of work.

[Veldmaarschalk]

Originally Posted by binTravkin

Umm, the only thing that actually needs to be done is to switch names 'Urraca' and 'Elvira' as their descriptions fit to how they are represented in-game, only their names have been swapped.

Certainly a change that does require less than 1 minute of work.

But there are so many things that only need 1 minute of work to change. This is just one of those things that doesn't have the highest priority I think

[binTravkin]

Umm, well okay.
I hope the responsible persons will put this in checklist for next beta then.
If we're checking when exactly someone dies and marriages which were started and annuled, then a member of major dynasty being swapped with other member doesn't seem that minor.

[The Phoenix]

Originally Posted by binTravkin

Umm, well okay.
I hope the responsible persons will put this in checklist for next beta then.
If we're checking when exactly someone dies and marriages which were started and annuled, then a member of major dynasty being swapped with other member doesn't seem that minor.

The checking as a whole is more like a major project, however, and was requested as something to be done pre-1.05 if possible.

Just remember to submit this proposal for a change after 1.05 is out and I'm sure that it will be included in the first beta.

[binTravkin]

Also by this source it appears that the other daughter of Ferdinand 'The Great' Jimenez, Elvira, should reside in the court of Zamorra.

Toro is a town in the province of Zamora, Spain.

As capital of Zamora is also Zamora, therefore even if those days the city of Toro wouldn't be dependant on city of Zamora, it would surely be dependant on count(-ess) of Zamora.

[Gaute65]

Originally Posted by binTravkin

Umm, the only thing that actually needs to be done is to switch names 'Urraca' and 'Elvira' as their descriptions fit to how they are represented in-game, only their names have been swapped.

Certainly a change that does require less than 1 minute of work.

Copy in the correct characters and MrT will probably change the setup.

[binTravkin]

k, will do once I get home to my CK install.

[Damocles]

The beginning spanish situation doesn't really do justice to how much it rapidly consolidated over the next few years.

[MrT]

IF it's a matter of swapping those 2 names in one file; and IF you give me the ID's in the next 4 hours, I will make the change. If not, it will wait for 1.06.

[binTravkin]

character = {
	id = { type = 10 id = 108501 }
	name = "Urraca"
	gender = female
	dynasty = { type = 12 id = 442 }
	father = { type = 10 id = 107510 }
	mother = { type = 10 id = 107511 }
	country = C191
	religion = catholic
	culture = Castillan
	score = { gold = 25 prestige = 100 piety = 100 }
	birthdate = { year = 1033 month = january day = 1 }
	dna = "90608724033615"
	attributes = {
		martial = 2
		diplomacy = 6
		intrigue = 9
		stewardship = 6
		health = 5
		fertility = 4
	}
	traits = {
		lustful = yes
		vengeful = yes
		deceitful = yes
		flamboyant_schemer = yes
	}
}

character = {
	id = { type = 10 id = 107501 }
	name = "Elvira"
	gender = female
	dynasty = { type = 12 id = 442 }
	father = { type = 10 id = 107510 }
	mother = { type = 10 id = 107511 }
	country = C191
	religion = catholic
	culture = Castillan
	birthdate = { year = 1034 month = january day = 1 }
	dna = "13544779116432"
	attributes = {
		martial = 2
		diplomacy = 7
		intrigue = 4
		stewardship = 3
		health = 6
		fertility = 2
	}
	traits = {
		chaste = yes
		sceptical = yes
		amateurish_pettifogger = yes
	}
}

Here are their respective entries in 1066_scenario_characters.inc

Changes:
- Changed Elvira, countess of Zamorra (C191) to 'Urraca'
- Changed Urraca, courtier in Kingdom of Castile (CAST) to 'Elvira'
- Changed new Elvira's location to be in county of Zamorra (C191) as mentioned source suggest she was in posession of city of Toro which in turn is in the modern province of Zamorra.

EDIT: Changes have been bolded.

[MrT]

Done

[binTravkin]

Nice. Thanks!