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congrats on your victory. given the situation, a small para abuse is forgiven.
the Aliens quotes reminded me just how many times I've seen that film. man, I'm getting old.
the Aliens quotes reminded me just how many times I've seen that film. man, I'm getting old.
good to see just how tight it got at the end, reads a lot like Surt's old epic when it seemed he played the last 3 game months purely on the supply mapmode
Are you kidding me??!! This is OVER??!! Or almost over? In 5 pages?? I was still looking forward to finding time to catch up on my reading!
At least from my brief skimming, it appears to at least partly be a comedy AAR. lol
I'll find time to read in the next week or two, I hope! Looks like a rollicking good time!
Renss
At least from my brief skimming, it appears to at least partly be a comedy AAR. lol
I'll find time to read in the next week or two, I hope! Looks like a rollicking good time!
Renss
Nah. House rules say I can't initiate any wars. I'm the good guy, remember? I initiate fewer wars in my game as Germany than Winston Churchill does historically. (Persia, anyone?
)I'd like to think that if you use PARA with the goal of always linking up to it in a reasonable amount of time, it's not abuse. That's how I like to roll, and MECH is fast enough to expand the Market Garden window quite a bit. It felt good to drop PARA multiple times in the game and have friendly forces link up in week or less, but they would never have reached the last drop zone in my lifetime. There wasn't enough fuel on the planet to sustain that offensive.
the Aliens quotes reminded me just how many times I've seen that film. man, I'm getting old.
I love that movie. In fact, Hudson's line about "game over!" was what got me and my beloved interested in each other romantically. I used it in the context of a project we were working on, and she was the only one who got it.
I thought about posting screens from the supply mode, but they were too depressing.
I've wondered if the season would have made a difference. I suspect that delaying the offensive until summer would not have helped that much.
This was quite epic indeed.
Not as epic as the video game that resulted from Germany winning the war. Read about it below.
Yeah, not a full blown AAR, just a how-to with some skits in between. It's light reading, I assure you.
Chapter 8: An Excerpt from The Goebbels’ Experiment (Narrated by Kenneth Branagh in association with PBS)
Diary entry: December 5th, 1975
Hess died today. I thought that old dinosaur would never go. I can’t say that I miss that old bastard, but it got me thinking about 1935 again. At the time, I never really understood the long-term significance of the Führer’s stroke. I just figured that allying with Hess meant getting that flying fat man [Goering] out of my way, politically. I still bought into the Führer’s vision in both Mein Kapmf and Zweites Buch. I was still heady with the fire of anti-Semitism and the covert planning of a war with the Soviets and, eventually, the United States. All the old party tropes stayed on my lips. We needed room for the people, the Communists were coming to get us, degenerates were warping the good German volk, and all that other crap. It wasn’t until after the war that I realized what an idiot anyone was for thinking along those lines. The only thing Hitler ever got right was our struggle against Communism, but he even screwed that up. Alliance with the British Empire? Bah. The French contributed more to troops and material to the Great Crusade than the British ever did. A war to conquer the Soviets? What a laugh. The war would never have happened if Chamberlain hadn’t dragged everyone kicking and screaming into a major European war. I still remember the damning evidence pulled from the Kremlin’s archives. Stalin’s orders to mobilize for war came completely out of the blue to even his closest allies in the party. Everyone remaining on the Red Army’s general staff had planned on preparing for a war in 1945 at the earliest, and they were planning on an intervention in China. His dispatch to STAVKA in February war translated as “We might as well grab Poland while the western capitalist pig-dogs are otherwise occupied.”
And Hitler’s predictions about history and economics were equally incompetent. An eventual war with the United States? Sure, mein Führer, and while we’re at it, let’s let the Greater East Asian Co-Prosperity Sphere annex India and the rest of Europe’s colonial empires in Asia while we’re busy. And while we’re doing that, I can just stab out my own eyeballs. A decadent United States, degenerate and rotten? Not after Japan conquered China and spawned a decades long cold war in the Pacific. And on that note, how could he have been blind to the importance of Japan’s conquest of China? This single event, coupled with our defeat of the Soviets, has shaped the world for decades. His blindness to the capabilities of educated and driven political elites of any race would have resulted in a series of wars that no one would have won, even if nuclear weapons were never employed.
But I still marvel at how wrong he was about living space and non-Germanic peoples. Schacht’s program of state sponsored industrial growth, coupled with technological improvements, forced the exact opposite of a living space problem. Our industrial production almost doubled by the end of the war, but continued industrial growth after the war dwarfed even that figure. German factories rebuilt France, Britain, Ukraine, Poland, Belarus, Crimea, Novgorod, and Muscovy using funds borrowed from German banks and with natural resources harvested from those countries we rebuilt. By 1950, I had to deliver a series of speeches stating the government’s case for a guest worker program because of a looming labor shortage. Rather than moving into conquered regions as colonists, the German people stayed in Germany earning high wages and starting businesses while people we used to call undesirables came into the country to fill our factories. The economy was doing so well that men avoiding conscription reached record highs in 1953 before Hess gave in and raised military wages by 150%. German hegemony was assured not by living space and wars, but by the image of Europe’s masses moving to Germany for work while the rest of the EA [European Axis] found their economies bound inextricably to the Reich.
The only thing I don’t think Hitler could be blamed for is failing to predict the Cold War. I don’t think anyone could have predicted it. Centuries of complicated European politics hadn’t prepared any of us for a world with only three major powers, all of whom possess the military strength to wipe out the entire planet. While we still help garrison the colonies of our allies with troops, it’s our air force, navy, and nuclear assets that ensure perpetual status quo on the world stage. The United States can complain about free trade this and open markets that, but our limited autarky within the EA, coupled with Japan’s absurdly high tariffs, means that 99% of the world’s population is economically bound to a major power. It’s too bad, really. I wanted to vacation in Hollywood with Magda and Leni and visit all of the old movie studio lots before they were torn down.
I suppose I could worry that someday my diary will be read and the Abwehr will have me dealt with, but at my age, who cares? I’m just an old propagandist who wisely invested in shipbuilding industries before the naval building plan was unveiled back in 39. I’ve had all the women, wine, and song I could ever want. It’s been a good life. Besides, I know all the dirt on the Abwehr and their “assimilation” of the SS in 46. I even knew about Canaris and his involvement in the “steering” of the Führer after his stroke. If they won’t let me retire in peace and try to have me killed, I’ll just tell their little secrets.
I wonder if that blonde nurse will be giving me my sponge bath tonight. She reminds me of an old mistress. I’m really too old for that sort of thing, but I can remember. Oh yes, I can remember.
[The following postscript is given via subtitles against a backdrop of his first speech for the Nazi Party.]
Goebbels was removed from his home on December 6th, 1975 by Abwehr agents and forcefully given cyanide tablets. His death was reported as a heart attack and he was given a state funeral for his services to the Reich. His murder was unrelated to his diary; it was Hess’s last official act as Führer.
Excerpt from the game manual for Hearts of Iron 3: War is a Dish Best Served Cold (An Electronic Arts game)
Chapter 4: Factions
In HOI3, there are three factions: The European Axis (EA), the East Asian Co-Prosperity Sphere (EACPS), and the North American Treaty Organization (NATO). Each faction has a leader: Germany (EA), Japan (EACPS), and the United States (NATO). Most of the countries in the world start the game in 1950 already bound to a faction, but they can drift over time and either become neutral or join another faction. Faction leaders cannot leave their faction except as a result of losing a war.
Each faction has a special power in HOI3, reflecting its place in the Cold War.
NATO: All members of NATO are forced to accept the “Radical Laissez-Faire Economy” strategic effect. While at peace, all NATO countries have three times the normal consumer demand for an economy; however, they also enjoy a permanent 35% increase in IC efficiency and production efficiency. If NATO countries are attacked, they lose the Radica Laissez-Faire economy effect and get war-time increases to National Unity, ruling party support, and manpower generation.
Pro-tip: NATO does not change strategic effects if NATO nations declare offensive wars.
EA: Members of EA can gift technology and blueprints to one another. This represents the wunderwaffe exchange programs implemented in the wake of the Great Crusade. While early in the game, Germany will do most of the gifting, later in the game, her allies can help shore up technological shortfalls in certain categories.
Pro-tip: Germany should always gift resource gathering technologies to her puppets Ukraine, Belarus, Novgorod, Muscovy, and Poland because puppets transfer resources to their masters.
EACPS: All members of EACPS gain a +20% bonus to all effects from all occupation policies. This effect includes both beneficial effects (resources, IC, manpower) and detrimental effects (partisans). This represents Japan’s use of divide and conquer in places like China, where the military administration would deliberately favor one faction and persecute another faction.
Pro-tip: China, Korea, Manchuria, and Mongolia do not have Japanese cores. As a result, Japan must set occupation policies in all of these places. A smart Japanese player will triple their garrisons throughout Asia during the first year of the game to counteract the partisan effect.
Chapter 9: Nukes
Germany, Japan, and the United States all have nuclear weapons in 1950. But, because of historical restrictions on military policy each country faced, each faction has its own special conditions that require fulfillment before any nukes can be employed.
NATO: NATO nations cannot use nuclear weapons unless they are 20% occupied, victimized by a first strike, or the entire faction has a 300% advantage in warheads.
EA: Among EA nations, only Germany can authorize the use of nuclear weapons. Regardless of authorization, nuclear weapons cannot be used in Europe unless Berlin is occupied.
Pro-tip: If a human is playing a non-German member of the EA, be warned that the German AI will not authorize nukes unless Berlin has fallen to prevent ahistorical nuclear spam.
EACPS: Members of EACPS can freely use nuclear weapons at their discretion; however, Japanese military policy forbids the use of nuclear weapons anywhere the empire has vital interests. For the purposes of the game, this includes all provinces tied to the Pacific Ocean, regardless of ownership or occupation.
Pro-tip: Nukes cannot be used against Hawaii, Brunei, Australia, New Zealand, or Singapore. But nukes can be used against targets in India, Alaska, and Diego Garcia.
Diary entry: December 5th, 1975
Hess died today. I thought that old dinosaur would never go. I can’t say that I miss that old bastard, but it got me thinking about 1935 again. At the time, I never really understood the long-term significance of the Führer’s stroke. I just figured that allying with Hess meant getting that flying fat man [Goering] out of my way, politically. I still bought into the Führer’s vision in both Mein Kapmf and Zweites Buch. I was still heady with the fire of anti-Semitism and the covert planning of a war with the Soviets and, eventually, the United States. All the old party tropes stayed on my lips. We needed room for the people, the Communists were coming to get us, degenerates were warping the good German volk, and all that other crap. It wasn’t until after the war that I realized what an idiot anyone was for thinking along those lines. The only thing Hitler ever got right was our struggle against Communism, but he even screwed that up. Alliance with the British Empire? Bah. The French contributed more to troops and material to the Great Crusade than the British ever did. A war to conquer the Soviets? What a laugh. The war would never have happened if Chamberlain hadn’t dragged everyone kicking and screaming into a major European war. I still remember the damning evidence pulled from the Kremlin’s archives. Stalin’s orders to mobilize for war came completely out of the blue to even his closest allies in the party. Everyone remaining on the Red Army’s general staff had planned on preparing for a war in 1945 at the earliest, and they were planning on an intervention in China. His dispatch to STAVKA in February war translated as “We might as well grab Poland while the western capitalist pig-dogs are otherwise occupied.”
And Hitler’s predictions about history and economics were equally incompetent. An eventual war with the United States? Sure, mein Führer, and while we’re at it, let’s let the Greater East Asian Co-Prosperity Sphere annex India and the rest of Europe’s colonial empires in Asia while we’re busy. And while we’re doing that, I can just stab out my own eyeballs. A decadent United States, degenerate and rotten? Not after Japan conquered China and spawned a decades long cold war in the Pacific. And on that note, how could he have been blind to the importance of Japan’s conquest of China? This single event, coupled with our defeat of the Soviets, has shaped the world for decades. His blindness to the capabilities of educated and driven political elites of any race would have resulted in a series of wars that no one would have won, even if nuclear weapons were never employed.
But I still marvel at how wrong he was about living space and non-Germanic peoples. Schacht’s program of state sponsored industrial growth, coupled with technological improvements, forced the exact opposite of a living space problem. Our industrial production almost doubled by the end of the war, but continued industrial growth after the war dwarfed even that figure. German factories rebuilt France, Britain, Ukraine, Poland, Belarus, Crimea, Novgorod, and Muscovy using funds borrowed from German banks and with natural resources harvested from those countries we rebuilt. By 1950, I had to deliver a series of speeches stating the government’s case for a guest worker program because of a looming labor shortage. Rather than moving into conquered regions as colonists, the German people stayed in Germany earning high wages and starting businesses while people we used to call undesirables came into the country to fill our factories. The economy was doing so well that men avoiding conscription reached record highs in 1953 before Hess gave in and raised military wages by 150%. German hegemony was assured not by living space and wars, but by the image of Europe’s masses moving to Germany for work while the rest of the EA [European Axis] found their economies bound inextricably to the Reich.
The only thing I don’t think Hitler could be blamed for is failing to predict the Cold War. I don’t think anyone could have predicted it. Centuries of complicated European politics hadn’t prepared any of us for a world with only three major powers, all of whom possess the military strength to wipe out the entire planet. While we still help garrison the colonies of our allies with troops, it’s our air force, navy, and nuclear assets that ensure perpetual status quo on the world stage. The United States can complain about free trade this and open markets that, but our limited autarky within the EA, coupled with Japan’s absurdly high tariffs, means that 99% of the world’s population is economically bound to a major power. It’s too bad, really. I wanted to vacation in Hollywood with Magda and Leni and visit all of the old movie studio lots before they were torn down.
I suppose I could worry that someday my diary will be read and the Abwehr will have me dealt with, but at my age, who cares? I’m just an old propagandist who wisely invested in shipbuilding industries before the naval building plan was unveiled back in 39. I’ve had all the women, wine, and song I could ever want. It’s been a good life. Besides, I know all the dirt on the Abwehr and their “assimilation” of the SS in 46. I even knew about Canaris and his involvement in the “steering” of the Führer after his stroke. If they won’t let me retire in peace and try to have me killed, I’ll just tell their little secrets.
I wonder if that blonde nurse will be giving me my sponge bath tonight. She reminds me of an old mistress. I’m really too old for that sort of thing, but I can remember. Oh yes, I can remember.
[The following postscript is given via subtitles against a backdrop of his first speech for the Nazi Party.]
Goebbels was removed from his home on December 6th, 1975 by Abwehr agents and forcefully given cyanide tablets. His death was reported as a heart attack and he was given a state funeral for his services to the Reich. His murder was unrelated to his diary; it was Hess’s last official act as Führer.
Excerpt from the game manual for Hearts of Iron 3: War is a Dish Best Served Cold (An Electronic Arts game)
Chapter 4: Factions
In HOI3, there are three factions: The European Axis (EA), the East Asian Co-Prosperity Sphere (EACPS), and the North American Treaty Organization (NATO). Each faction has a leader: Germany (EA), Japan (EACPS), and the United States (NATO). Most of the countries in the world start the game in 1950 already bound to a faction, but they can drift over time and either become neutral or join another faction. Faction leaders cannot leave their faction except as a result of losing a war.
Each faction has a special power in HOI3, reflecting its place in the Cold War.
NATO: All members of NATO are forced to accept the “Radical Laissez-Faire Economy” strategic effect. While at peace, all NATO countries have three times the normal consumer demand for an economy; however, they also enjoy a permanent 35% increase in IC efficiency and production efficiency. If NATO countries are attacked, they lose the Radica Laissez-Faire economy effect and get war-time increases to National Unity, ruling party support, and manpower generation.
Pro-tip: NATO does not change strategic effects if NATO nations declare offensive wars.
EA: Members of EA can gift technology and blueprints to one another. This represents the wunderwaffe exchange programs implemented in the wake of the Great Crusade. While early in the game, Germany will do most of the gifting, later in the game, her allies can help shore up technological shortfalls in certain categories.
Pro-tip: Germany should always gift resource gathering technologies to her puppets Ukraine, Belarus, Novgorod, Muscovy, and Poland because puppets transfer resources to their masters.
EACPS: All members of EACPS gain a +20% bonus to all effects from all occupation policies. This effect includes both beneficial effects (resources, IC, manpower) and detrimental effects (partisans). This represents Japan’s use of divide and conquer in places like China, where the military administration would deliberately favor one faction and persecute another faction.
Pro-tip: China, Korea, Manchuria, and Mongolia do not have Japanese cores. As a result, Japan must set occupation policies in all of these places. A smart Japanese player will triple their garrisons throughout Asia during the first year of the game to counteract the partisan effect.
Chapter 9: Nukes
Germany, Japan, and the United States all have nuclear weapons in 1950. But, because of historical restrictions on military policy each country faced, each faction has its own special conditions that require fulfillment before any nukes can be employed.
NATO: NATO nations cannot use nuclear weapons unless they are 20% occupied, victimized by a first strike, or the entire faction has a 300% advantage in warheads.
EA: Among EA nations, only Germany can authorize the use of nuclear weapons. Regardless of authorization, nuclear weapons cannot be used in Europe unless Berlin is occupied.
Pro-tip: If a human is playing a non-German member of the EA, be warned that the German AI will not authorize nukes unless Berlin has fallen to prevent ahistorical nuclear spam.
EACPS: Members of EACPS can freely use nuclear weapons at their discretion; however, Japanese military policy forbids the use of nuclear weapons anywhere the empire has vital interests. For the purposes of the game, this includes all provinces tied to the Pacific Ocean, regardless of ownership or occupation.
Pro-tip: Nukes cannot be used against Hawaii, Brunei, Australia, New Zealand, or Singapore. But nukes can be used against targets in India, Alaska, and Diego Garcia.
- 2
Chapter 8: Wrap up and analysis of failures.
Let’s look at what went right, first.
Trust me, the Soviets didn’t have that small of an army in 43. Also, notice how many GAR the Soviets have remaining in their army.
The AI, given units with plenty of speed, adequately performed encirclements. I suspect that Soviets lost a bunch of divisions in Poland and in Bessarabia as we advanced. I can’t really ask more of the AI in this regard.
And I can’t complain about my allies not helping. The French Army isn’t too bad, all things considered. Capturing most of it intact and telling them to go help Romania was probably the smart move.
So Germany won the war. Woo hoo? Not really. The war almost ended in a total disaster from which no one could have recovered. What did I do wrong?
1) No suppression along supply arteries.
Yes, I built my awesome MECH/TD/SPARTY divisions to conserve threat and manpower since I had the time and manpower to do so. But once the war started, I should have dropped some GAR/MP into the queue for partisan suppression. After the UK DOWs, threat isn’t really an issue. Even a few of them might have made a big difference in throughput. Yes, I still would have burned all my fuel, but it would be used more efficiently to overrun the Soviets. Since I played defense for a few months, I had the time to get suppression units ready for the big push into the Ukraine.
Note that in late-war games where I let Poland live, the situation is much worse and we never make it to Moscow or Leningrad.
2) I should have built another CTF of 6 CVs.
Here’s the thing. You don’t really need a navy to take out the Soviets. But if you puppet the UK, you have tons of juicy naval bases to use. And a CTF based out of a level 10 port in the Med can bypass all that supply nastiness. With only one CTF, it spent most of the war supporting amphibious operations. I could have posted a second CTF permanently in the Black Sea and moved some of the wings in that area back to Berlin to bypass supply problems. CAGs aren’t TACs, but a CAG operating with full fuel and supply hits harder than a TAC with no fuel or only 25% of its supply quota.
I’ve done this before and it works fairly well until we are out of CAG range.
3) I researched armor techs.
I discussed this already, but my divisions lost a ton of speed because of light and medium armor upgrades. There’s no telling just how much better things would have gone if my divisions were running at 11 kph instead of 8 kph.
4) I researched jet engines.
This was a really bad decision. Normally, I don’t bother with jet engines because, in a standard game, the war is usually over before they can make a difference. Besides, the bonuses from jet engines aren’t really that great. But I couldn’t resist the picture of ME-262s fighting over France during Fall Rot, so I went ahead and got them done. The loss of range was a bit of a pain once we got close to Moscow, but the increased fuel consumption was a contributing factor to my fuel use. Take the fuel consumption increase for jets and multiply it by 140 wings (my end-game total). We’re talking about 14 or more extra fuel per day, nevermind the added draw on the network.
EDIT: Ignore this entry. I keep forgetting that fuel consumption isn't increased by either engine tech these days.
5) I built STR.
The original plan was to cut Soviet supply lines in Poland in a repeat of what we did in France. This never happened because when I unleashed the AI in all its fury after Poland went GiE, it advanced so quickly and efficiently that it was better to just capture Soviet fuel and supplies than to bomb it. So, the STR sat out most of the war. If I had turned those 8 wings of STR into TRA, I could have airbriged in more places.
6) I should have used PARA on Moscow.
My assumption was that Rommel would hit Moscow without too much difficulty, but that Stalingrad would be past the line where logistics would collapse. After multiple failed attempts to just literally drive into Moscow, I now know that Stalingrad could have waited. Even one division of PARA could have seized Moscow and made it easier for MECH to get there. We were literally sitting at the city limits and failing to gain entry because of lack of fuel, so turning the province friendly would have been very helpful. We could always have rebased TRA to Moscow and then dropped on Stalingrad.
7) I should have transferred a MECH corps to Vladivostok once we took it.
This would have eased the supply situation in the west a bit while letting us grab some of the tiny VPs out there. It may have been easier to ship fuel and supplies by convoy than forcing more through the network in Russia.
8) I didn’t research refinery techs.
I didn’t research further techs for turning crude into fuel. Given the exhausted fuel supply and the pile of crude I still had, this seems to be an obvious issue to correct for next time.
So I won WWII after waiting to 1943. Big deal. What other strategies could I have employed by delaying the war? I just showed the MECH approach, but there are other possibilities.
1) Prep for war with the USA.
If you want a war with the USA, waiting until 43 means you have more time to generate CV practicals. Another run of 6 CVs and CLs means you are now set up to get some serious naval production. Yes, ships generate threat, but if you budget accordingly, you could get an awesome navy in play. Combined with UK naval bases after you puppet them, you could put several powerful CTFs off the coast of the USA. Remember that the USA will spam CVs too, but they have plenty of crappy old ships that are easy to sink. You’d have to build fewer aircraft in Europe (IC limitations), but we already saw that there is only a finite amount of assets you can put into Barbarossa anyway.
2) Nukes.
Look, if the war starts in 43, that’s enough time for a dedicated Germany to make real progress on the bomb. And if you do my Kinder, Gentler approach, you end up with uranium and heavy water. The moment the war starts, those strategic resources take effect even if Belgium and Norway won’t outright join the Axis right away. That’s a big boost to research. Furthermore, nuclear reactors generate no threat. Hypothetically, I could have responded to Neville “Munich is for scrubs” Chamberlain’s DOW with a nuclear strike on London. That would be worth having a couple of STR around just for the range.
3) All subs, all the time.
I’ve done this one before and it was a hoot. Instead of building a regular navy, build over 100 subs. Put them in multiple stacks of 20 and set them loose in the Atlantic. Sink the RN and French Navy. Then call them to the Channel for Sealion. Yeah, you lose a bunch to land based air when you do this, but who cares? With 50% or better impact from practicals, you can spam subs faster than the enemy can sink them. And since they are really high tech, they have better range than most SAGs or CTFs. About the only thing they can’t handle is the USN and CTF Death Stars.
You could also use different house rules than I did. If you have a real navy, allying with Japan is less useful than invading and annexing Japan.
I’m sure I haven’t covered everything, but are there any questions?
Let’s look at what went right, first.
Trust me, the Soviets didn’t have that small of an army in 43. Also, notice how many GAR the Soviets have remaining in their army.
The AI, given units with plenty of speed, adequately performed encirclements. I suspect that Soviets lost a bunch of divisions in Poland and in Bessarabia as we advanced. I can’t really ask more of the AI in this regard.
And I can’t complain about my allies not helping. The French Army isn’t too bad, all things considered. Capturing most of it intact and telling them to go help Romania was probably the smart move.
So Germany won the war. Woo hoo? Not really. The war almost ended in a total disaster from which no one could have recovered. What did I do wrong?
1) No suppression along supply arteries.
Yes, I built my awesome MECH/TD/SPARTY divisions to conserve threat and manpower since I had the time and manpower to do so. But once the war started, I should have dropped some GAR/MP into the queue for partisan suppression. After the UK DOWs, threat isn’t really an issue. Even a few of them might have made a big difference in throughput. Yes, I still would have burned all my fuel, but it would be used more efficiently to overrun the Soviets. Since I played defense for a few months, I had the time to get suppression units ready for the big push into the Ukraine.
Note that in late-war games where I let Poland live, the situation is much worse and we never make it to Moscow or Leningrad.
2) I should have built another CTF of 6 CVs.
Here’s the thing. You don’t really need a navy to take out the Soviets. But if you puppet the UK, you have tons of juicy naval bases to use. And a CTF based out of a level 10 port in the Med can bypass all that supply nastiness. With only one CTF, it spent most of the war supporting amphibious operations. I could have posted a second CTF permanently in the Black Sea and moved some of the wings in that area back to Berlin to bypass supply problems. CAGs aren’t TACs, but a CAG operating with full fuel and supply hits harder than a TAC with no fuel or only 25% of its supply quota.
I’ve done this before and it works fairly well until we are out of CAG range.
3) I researched armor techs.
I discussed this already, but my divisions lost a ton of speed because of light and medium armor upgrades. There’s no telling just how much better things would have gone if my divisions were running at 11 kph instead of 8 kph.
4) I researched jet engines.
This was a really bad decision. Normally, I don’t bother with jet engines because, in a standard game, the war is usually over before they can make a difference. Besides, the bonuses from jet engines aren’t really that great. But I couldn’t resist the picture of ME-262s fighting over France during Fall Rot, so I went ahead and got them done. The loss of range was a bit of a pain once we got close to Moscow, but the increased fuel consumption was a contributing factor to my fuel use. Take the fuel consumption increase for jets and multiply it by 140 wings (my end-game total). We’re talking about 14 or more extra fuel per day, nevermind the added draw on the network.
EDIT: Ignore this entry. I keep forgetting that fuel consumption isn't increased by either engine tech these days.
5) I built STR.
The original plan was to cut Soviet supply lines in Poland in a repeat of what we did in France. This never happened because when I unleashed the AI in all its fury after Poland went GiE, it advanced so quickly and efficiently that it was better to just capture Soviet fuel and supplies than to bomb it. So, the STR sat out most of the war. If I had turned those 8 wings of STR into TRA, I could have airbriged in more places.
6) I should have used PARA on Moscow.
My assumption was that Rommel would hit Moscow without too much difficulty, but that Stalingrad would be past the line where logistics would collapse. After multiple failed attempts to just literally drive into Moscow, I now know that Stalingrad could have waited. Even one division of PARA could have seized Moscow and made it easier for MECH to get there. We were literally sitting at the city limits and failing to gain entry because of lack of fuel, so turning the province friendly would have been very helpful. We could always have rebased TRA to Moscow and then dropped on Stalingrad.
7) I should have transferred a MECH corps to Vladivostok once we took it.
This would have eased the supply situation in the west a bit while letting us grab some of the tiny VPs out there. It may have been easier to ship fuel and supplies by convoy than forcing more through the network in Russia.
8) I didn’t research refinery techs.
I didn’t research further techs for turning crude into fuel. Given the exhausted fuel supply and the pile of crude I still had, this seems to be an obvious issue to correct for next time.
So I won WWII after waiting to 1943. Big deal. What other strategies could I have employed by delaying the war? I just showed the MECH approach, but there are other possibilities.
1) Prep for war with the USA.
If you want a war with the USA, waiting until 43 means you have more time to generate CV practicals. Another run of 6 CVs and CLs means you are now set up to get some serious naval production. Yes, ships generate threat, but if you budget accordingly, you could get an awesome navy in play. Combined with UK naval bases after you puppet them, you could put several powerful CTFs off the coast of the USA. Remember that the USA will spam CVs too, but they have plenty of crappy old ships that are easy to sink. You’d have to build fewer aircraft in Europe (IC limitations), but we already saw that there is only a finite amount of assets you can put into Barbarossa anyway.
2) Nukes.
Look, if the war starts in 43, that’s enough time for a dedicated Germany to make real progress on the bomb. And if you do my Kinder, Gentler approach, you end up with uranium and heavy water. The moment the war starts, those strategic resources take effect even if Belgium and Norway won’t outright join the Axis right away. That’s a big boost to research. Furthermore, nuclear reactors generate no threat. Hypothetically, I could have responded to Neville “Munich is for scrubs” Chamberlain’s DOW with a nuclear strike on London. That would be worth having a couple of STR around just for the range.
3) All subs, all the time.
I’ve done this one before and it was a hoot. Instead of building a regular navy, build over 100 subs. Put them in multiple stacks of 20 and set them loose in the Atlantic. Sink the RN and French Navy. Then call them to the Channel for Sealion. Yeah, you lose a bunch to land based air when you do this, but who cares? With 50% or better impact from practicals, you can spam subs faster than the enemy can sink them. And since they are really high tech, they have better range than most SAGs or CTFs. About the only thing they can’t handle is the USN and CTF Death Stars.
You could also use different house rules than I did. If you have a real navy, allying with Japan is less useful than invading and annexing Japan.
I’m sure I haven’t covered everything, but are there any questions?
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well that was really impressive, its fascinating to see a strategy put together with such care and then developed in practice. As to your alternatives, they all look fascinating.
The only problem is it adds to my current 'problem' with HOI3 which is that for a competent player with one of the majors is that the game still doesn't really generate a challenge. I still wonder if the non-cheating AI will carry on hampering the game in this respect?
The only problem is it adds to my current 'problem' with HOI3 which is that for a competent player with one of the majors is that the game still doesn't really generate a challenge. I still wonder if the non-cheating AI will carry on hampering the game in this respect?
During cold weather or snow, speed drops 4 times, I think. So you MECs were moving at speed 2.
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I don't know is TDs really benefited as they were slowing down MECs and ate a lot of fuel.
Were your armies led by AI or you did it manually?
Apparently, for the Soviet war part, yes.
I really enjoyed seeing how a late war played out.
I really enjoyed seeing how a late war played out.
Well, he played the game, knowing exactly what would happen beforehand. The AI can't do that really as it is scripted to react in certain ways. Secondly, I assume SM played on normal difficutly. Increasing the difficulty level would make it more challenging too.
@ Secret Master:
You might want to link the last two chapters in your initial posting.
You might want to link the last two chapters in your initial posting.
Err... don't think so. You'll be caught with your pants down and a player run country would be a lot better prepared than the AI run countries.
I tend to agree with you, though I did play it on normal. On Very Hard, I don't think we would have made it two province past Poland.
But you know what's funny? At least once a month, we get a "I can't be France/Germany is too weak" thread in the HOI3 forum. And about once a month we get a "The USA is nerfed" thread as well, nevermind the 600 IC even the AI can squeeze out before Pearl Harbor.
Once you understand how certain mechanics work, the game is much easier. But I do wonder if making HOI3 more difficult overall would make the game too difficult to get decent sales.
AI control for all ground forces except during PARA and MAR attacks. The AI controlled some aircraft while I kept some for my use (the AI is never aggressive enough with planes for my taste).
Without the TDs, I would lose the CA bonus. It's really as simple as that. Even with 1946 technologies, 2xMECH/3xSPARTY just doesn't have enough softness to get there.
Yeah, I had done a number of other late games. Some ended in total disaster, like the game where I raised threat on the UK.
Done.
Here's the problem.
A human player, unless house rules prohibit it, will run raise threat on an appropriate minor to put good laws into place. So, if a human is running the UK, they just raise threat until they can DOW Germany or someone else. If a human is running the Soviets, they just raise threat and initiate ahistorical wars in Eastern Europe. A human USA has a harder time getting into the war by raising threat because of how regions work, but I think even a smart USA could foil this gambit.
Another problem is that humans in MP, unless house rules force them to, are not going to trade with Germany. This negates any significant increase in IC, since Germany can't even feed IC in 1936. Trying to feed expanded IC into 43 would be impossible (and it's hard enough to do with an AI willing to trade as is).
Still another problem is that the gambit is telegraphed pretty obviously by the lack of decisions being fired, so it's hard to be sneaky with it.
However, a game with human Germany and Japan might make this strategy interesting if Germany doesn't want to play nice with Japan. Sure, Japan can DOW Germany at some point, but doing so doesn't get Japan the resources or naval bases from the colonial empires of the Allies. It might work in a competitive Germany/Japan game.
Heck unless they prevent usage of the "Prepare for war"decision its ridiculously easy to get the US into great laws by mid-late '36. Just raise dissent until the usable IC falls below the decision threshold (I believe its 30-50 IC) and fire away. Sure, you'll spend the next few months bleeding dissent but that coincides nicely with the lowered neutrality. Dissent hits zero around the time youc an start enacting the best pre-war laws so instead of 150 or so IC you can churn away at 350+ and it only gets crazier from there.
AFAIK, usable IC and dissent have no bearing on neutrality,which is a sign of how threatened a nation feels by its NEIGHBOURS, not by its own malcontent citizens.
unless I missed a whole section of game rules somewhere?
unless I missed a whole section of game rules somewhere?
That is the point that Peter Ebbeson has made a few times. In effect Paradox has to make games that can be broken if you really pay attention or they won't sell. I think my issue with HOI3 is that it has become a strange mix of very complex mechanics (so quite daunting to someone new or someone who just wants to dip in and out) surrounding an AI that is still hit and miss. I've found if the AI has the tools it wants, it can be very creative in its usage of them, which more or less points in the direction of the mechanisms around build/allocation/goal selection.