Yeah, to be realistic, I don't think it makes sense to add any new succession laws that won't be used in vanilla. The only thing that might make sense would be to make the whole succession system more scriptable, if that would also simplify adding new vanilla laws and fixing bugs in the old ones.
A collection of requested succession types
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Yeah, to be realistic, I don't think it makes sense to add any new succession laws that won't be used in vanilla. The only thing that might make sense would be to make the whole succession system more scriptable, if that would also simplify adding new vanilla laws and fixing bugs in the old ones.
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Nomination could be used for the Byzantines to represent the various appointed positions of the Empire.
If I remember correctly, while the Emperor became fully hereditary, the Doux were still appointed to some degree at least in the early middle ages.
I'd also like a succession along the lines of "you kill the king, you become the king" if only for mods.
Maybe add a dueling system where you can challenge people to combat/joust/etc.
If I remember correctly, while the Emperor became fully hereditary, the Doux were still appointed to some degree at least in the early middle ages.
I'd also like a succession along the lines of "you kill the king, you become the king" if only for mods.
Maybe add a dueling system where you can challenge people to combat/joust/etc.
I'd like to see the Early Islamic elective used by the Rashidun Caliphate (The First Four Caliphs) I know it was not used in the game time frame but I think it could be used by someone who wants to restore the "United Caliphate".
In it a small elective council (about 10), composed by characters in the realm with highest Total Learning, Highest Learning Education and Traits like Zealous, Scholar, Hafiz and Faqih would choose the leader who is viewed as the most pious.
The would be Caliphs would be chosen according to the good traits they had (the seven virtues and also Honest, Brave, Zealous, Just, Hafiz, Faqih, Holy Warrior, Mujahid, Scholar, Genius, Quick and High Learning (3-4)) with some traits disqualifying them (Slothful, Proud, Greedy, Deceitful, Cynical, Craven, Arbitrary, Cruel, Hedonist, Impaler, Mystic, Imbecile, Incapable, Homosexual, Kinslayer, Drunkard, Lunatic and Possessed) and others adding a penalty to their score (Slow, Inbred, Gluttonous, Lustful, Envious, Wroth, Paranoid, Detached Priest and Indulgent Wastrel).
In it a small elective council (about 10), composed by characters in the realm with highest Total Learning, Highest Learning Education and Traits like Zealous, Scholar, Hafiz and Faqih would choose the leader who is viewed as the most pious.
The would be Caliphs would be chosen according to the good traits they had (the seven virtues and also Honest, Brave, Zealous, Just, Hafiz, Faqih, Holy Warrior, Mujahid, Scholar, Genius, Quick and High Learning (3-4)) with some traits disqualifying them (Slothful, Proud, Greedy, Deceitful, Cynical, Craven, Arbitrary, Cruel, Hedonist, Impaler, Mystic, Imbecile, Incapable, Homosexual, Kinslayer, Drunkard, Lunatic and Possessed) and others adding a penalty to their score (Slow, Inbred, Gluttonous, Lustful, Envious, Wroth, Paranoid, Detached Priest and Indulgent Wastrel).
Doux appointment is already moddable using the appointment law that holy orders use.
Something I always thought would be fun is a "might makes right" succession, based loosely on nomadic cultures like the mongols. Effectively, while the ruler is alive every vassal can nominate an heir from the list of vassals and also the King's heir. All vassals would do this and they'd be coded to vote for people with high martial and people closer to them. Then when the succession happens, the kingdom is split between the nominated heirs, who each get titular king titles (this is where it might need working) and are automatically at war with the other titular kingdoms. Vassals who weren't nominated would fight for their nominee. Each of the nominees are at war with each of the other ones, and when they reach 100% with one nominee, that nominee becomes a vassal. This would continue until there is only one "khan of khans" left at which point the winner is granted the king title.
A little complex, suggestions would be nice and I recognize that it's likely too far left field.
A little complex, suggestions would be nice and I recognize that it's likely too far left field.
Too complex and overcomplicated. As it was already suggested, 'might makes right' would be perfectly simulated by statistical succession by martial, with the children of the former ruler getting claims + again, the succession system would guarantee that the second and third strongest guys in the realm would become pretenders. If they want to challenge the new ruler, they are free to do so.
I am starting to get a feeling that this thread is becoming more and more cluttered with far-fetched ideas.
Ok, this is a bit fanciful, but how about a reincarnation succession. It could concievably be created by event. Instead of death, the ruler recieves an event that kills them and spawns a new character with a trait similar to "Born in the Purple" Upon death the new reincarnation inherits.
The very point of this is for these to be used in mods or for special titles, and are mostly not available for any ruler to use.
Unfortunately, Paradox has said many times that fully modable or scriptable succession is something that will never happen. It just slows the game down too much. Thus, I brought up the list of requested succession types.
Indeed. I'll try to clean things up later, with the simpler and more realistic ones first, and the more rediculous ones afterwards. Labeled of course.
I've reorganized the first post to make it more readable, and organized things so that the simplest stuff is at the top, and the most complex at the end.
Female heads of patrician families belong to the modding realm unless perhaps there are no males in the family.
This said, I support the nomination angle.
Also, the degree of male preference needs to be more specific. Right now the loading tip is misleading: since daughters inherit before brothers, it's not true that females inherit only when there are no viable males. We need a succession type that favours brothers over daughters while not excluding women altogether.
This said, I support the nomination angle.
Also, the degree of male preference needs to be more specific. Right now the loading tip is misleading: since daughters inherit before brothers, it's not true that females inherit only when there are no viable males. We need a succession type that favours brothers over daughters while not excluding women altogether.
I would like to see gavelkind distribute titles according to crown authority, so that as crown authority increases, the primary heir gets a greater share, and at max crown authority, other sons will receive only one county.
Mostly though, I would like to see tanistry clarified, as it stands I'm not even sure if it takes vassals' opinion of you into consideration, because it seems like it's just their opinion of that character which the ii makes very difficult to check. If I want to see a vassals opinion of my nominee first that nominee must be landed then I need to go to the "alliances" menu and see how much they like my nominee then check how much they like whomever they are supporting. This is a huge pain in the ***.
Tanistry would work much better if it worked more like elective and vassals opinion of you were a greater consideration. though with a substantial penalty if that successor is a close relative (-75 for offspring, -50 for siblings and grandchildren, -25 for nephews/nieces/uncles/aunts) and a bonus for potential heirs with a claim on the primary title. This would better let tanistry ensure that titles are rarely inherited by a single line of the family, and actually make it playable since vassals who like a lot you should generally support any nominee you pick as long as they are not a close family member.
Tanistry would work much better if it worked more like elective and vassals opinion of you were a greater consideration. though with a substantial penalty if that successor is a close relative (-75 for offspring, -50 for siblings and grandchildren, -25 for nephews/nieces/uncles/aunts) and a bonus for potential heirs with a claim on the primary title. This would better let tanistry ensure that titles are rarely inherited by a single line of the family, and actually make it playable since vassals who like a lot you should generally support any nominee you pick as long as they are not a close family member.
I like the nomination succession, and the others too, but what I would like to see is the ability to script your own succession types so that it becomes ever-growing.
-Firerougex
-Firerougex
One other possible alternative in the department of gender laws would be male-only matrilineal. That is, only men can inherit, but they inherit through the female line, presumably with a preference for matrilineal marriages. There could also be male-preference matrilineal or female-only patrilineal or female-preference patrilineal as well.
I would love a system where the succession laws were poorly defined. That you had to invest prestige and power into promoting one succession law over another, but those who normally would succeed by another succession law could still maintain claims. These systems frequently clashed after all, some candidates would claim rights to the kingship by virtue of primogeniture, others would maintain rights by virtue of elective.
In reality it would take generations for a succession law to become established.`
I would also like to see a sort of kingmaker in tanistry, where an overbearing vassal could pick his liege's successor.
In reality it would take generations for a succession law to become established.`
I would also like to see a sort of kingmaker in tanistry, where an overbearing vassal could pick his liege's successor.
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Unfortunately, Paradox has stated that doing this is unfeasible. If succession is made scriptable, they've said that it would slow the game to a crawl on most systems.
I totally support the addition of these for modding. I'd like to see one where the head of your religion picks the next ruler of your kingdom and an alternative where he picks who of your dynasty will inherit it. I guess it's similar to having the priests of the realm pick but it's only the top guy actually.
Oh and I know it's been touched on but some kind of elective succession that dissallows the same dynasty to inherit twice in a row that way you aren't always in power. Maybe it could be coupled with the last dynasty to rule gaining a claim on the title.
Oh and I know it's been touched on but some kind of elective succession that dissallows the same dynasty to inherit twice in a row that way you aren't always in power. Maybe it could be coupled with the last dynasty to rule gaining a claim on the title.
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Some of these are great. Power Succession and No Succession are of particular interest to me, and I feel like Empires should steer towards these types of laws. Groomed succession also seems pretty cool. I thought SoI would add some nice infighting and dog eat dog style stuff instead of just imprisoning your whole family, like a maniac. Perhaps these succession laws would bring back the chaos and ironic map stability that I desire XD
Religious succession would be great for restored Jews or reformed pagans.
Mystic succession sounds hilarious. I need that!
I want to see some more succession laws in the game which don't force you to be on top. Like a merchant republic, sometimes I like to sink down and be a vassal again, and work internal politics for awhile.
I want a gavelkind which gives out your titles to your heirs, making them large independent realms, even if you don't have same-tier titles.
Religious succession would be great for restored Jews or reformed pagans.
Mystic succession sounds hilarious. I need that!
I want to see some more succession laws in the game which don't force you to be on top. Like a merchant republic, sometimes I like to sink down and be a vassal again, and work internal politics for awhile.
I want a gavelkind which gives out your titles to your heirs, making them large independent realms, even if you don't have same-tier titles.