United Kingdom Manpower Question

[son of liberty]

Originally Posted by noobermenschen

???? Yes they are volunteers. I volunteered many years ago and can vouch for it. Even guys who wussed out during boot camp could get out of the service (though usually with a less than honorable discharge).

If you are following the line of "The Military uses unethical and deceptive recruiting practices to lure the poor, the uneducated and the brainwashed" then you have been misled.

Absolutely correct! I did 6 years of voluntary duty, and when my time was up I unvolunteered and went home.

[mlipo]

I believe the US Army went all volunteer in 1974 or 75. When I was in Iraq, I met a crusty old Command Sergeant Major who was the last soldier to be drafted who remained on active duty since his draft. Did that sentence make sense? Of course, he voluntarily re-enlisted many times after he was initially drafted.

[TxJackalope]

From Salvationarmyusa.org:

The Salvation Army’s membership consists of 3500 officers, 60,000 employees, 113,000 soldiers, 430,000 adherents , and more than 3.5 million volunteers.

Gimme my points

[noobermenschen]

Originally Posted by TxJackalope

From Salvationarmyusa.org:



Gimme my points

LOL! And we have a winner!

[blue emu]

Originally Posted by TxJackalope

Gimme my points

TxJackalope is awarded one Emu-point.

[LM+]

Originally Posted by blue emu

Hmmmm... just tested it with Japan and you seem to be correct. Apparently, those existing Japanese AI-events for Chinese Manpower have no effect at all.

The solution for England/India, then, would be to divide India up into portions that yield integral Manpower boosts... there would probably be about three of them.

Japan/China should be re-written, the same way.

Agreed on India, but I'm not sure that Japan was able to use Chinese manpower in anything other than militia or garrisons, which makes it fairly iffy to include it in all-purpose manpower. But I could easily be wrong!


Oh, and as for the American Army: Yes, not only is it honest-to-God volunteer, you would be surprised how hard it can be to get in. My brother's been kicking at the door for three years now, but they refuse to accept him, due to concerns that his extremely poor eyesight might someday return after LASIK treatment. Picky, picky, picky!

[TallyHall]

Wait, I'm confused.

At what point do you not gain foreign manpower? When it's overseas and there is a war period? So Germany can use Russian manpower, but Japan can't use Korean?

Agreed on India, but I'm not sure that Japan was able to use Chinese manpower in anything other than militia or garrisons

If it's that they can't use Korean manpower, I think that's a bigger issue than not being able to use Chinese.
Also militia and garrisons are very useful when fighting in soviet or Asian territory.
Garrisons deal with partisans and can be stationed in key provinces to prevent loosing key ground/ground in general.
And militia's are useful when fighting a mostly militia army.

[Borsook]

I know I'm lazy but has anyone completed those events for all the india/korea?

[Waffen9999]

I too always thought it was rather stupid that just because you go war you lose the ability to recruit soldiers from overseas colonies. This is particularly detrimental to the UK in the game. I'm not up to date on population figures but Germany's population couldn't have been THAT much bigger then Britain, but in the game they grow far higher. I understand some semblance of balance is in order but its kinda flaky that the British lose the manpower in India. And then you have Japan which I do believe actually had MORE people then Germany and yet also dont' gain as many people.

[Wobbler]

Here are a few; quite crude, but making them well-balanced would require an insane amount of work.

#####################################
# Japanese section
#

#
### Korea 
event = {
	id = 332200
	persistent = yes
	random = no

	trigger = {
		atwar = yes
		NOT = { local_flag = KoreaManpower }
		control = { province = 1196 data = -1 } # Busan
		control = { province = 1189 data = -1 } # Seoul
		control = { province = 1201 data = -1 } # Pyongyang
	}

	country = JAP
	date = { year = 1936 month = 0 day = 0 }
	offset = 10
	deathdate = { year = 1953 month = 11 day = 92 }

	name = "Manpower Event"
	desc = "Receive some Korean manpower despite the game engine flaw."

	action_a = {
		name = "OK"
		command = { type = local_setflag which = KoreaManpower }
		command = { type = free_manpower value = 1 }
	}
}

event = {
	id = 332201
	persistent = yes
	random = no

	trigger = {
		local_flag = KoreaManpower

		OR = {
			atwar = no
			NOT = { control = { province = 1196 data = -1 } } # Busan
			NOT = { control = { province = 1189 data = -1 } } # Seoul
			NOT = { control = { province = 1201 data = -1 } } # Pyongyang
		}
	}

	country = JAP
	date = { year = 1936 month = 0 day = 0 }
	offset = 10
	deathdate = { year = 1953 month = 11 day = 92 }

	name = "Manpower Event"
	desc = "Turns off the simulated Korean manpower."

	action_a = {
		name = "OK"
		command = { type = local_clrflag which = KoreaManpower }
		command = { type = free_manpower value = -1 }
	}
}


########################################
# United Kingdom section
#

#
### East Indian area
event = {
	id = 332210
	persistent = yes
	random = no

	trigger = {
		atwar = yes
		NOT = { local_flag = IndiaManpowerE }
		control = { province = 1285 data = -1 } # Dhaka
		control = { province = 1457 data = -1 } # Calcutta
	}

	country = ENG
	date = { year = 1936 month = 0 day = 0 }
	offset = 10
	deathdate = { year = 1953 month = 11 day = 92 }

	name = "Manpower Event"
	desc = "Receive some Indian manpower despite the game engine flaw."

	action_a = {
		name = "OK"
		command = { type = local_setflag which = IndiaManpowerE }
		command = { type = free_manpower value = 1 }
	}
}

event = {
	id = 332211
	persistent = yes
	random = no

	trigger = {
		local_flag = IndiaManpowerE

		OR = {
			atwar = no
			NOT = { control = { province = 1285 data = -1 } } # Dhaka
			NOT = { control = { province = 1457 data = -1 } } # Calcutta
		}
	}

	country = ENG
	date = { year = 1936 month = 0 day = 0 }
	offset = 10
	deathdate = { year = 1953 month = 11 day = 92 }

	name = "Manpower Event"
	desc = "Turns off the simulated Indian manpower."

	action_a = {
		name = "OK"
		command = { type = local_clrflag which = IndiaManpowerE }
		command = { type = free_manpower value = -1 }
	}
}

#
### Central Indian area
event = {
	id = 332212
	persistent = yes
	random = no

	trigger = {
		atwar = yes
		NOT = { local_flag = IndiaManpowerC }
		control = { province = 1468 data = -1 } # Jaipur
		control = { province = 1467 data = -1 } # Indore
	}

	country = ENG
	date = { year = 1936 month = 0 day = 0 }
	offset = 10
	deathdate = { year = 1953 month = 11 day = 92 }

	name = "Manpower Event"
	desc = "Receive some Indian manpower despite the game engine flaw."

	action_a = {
		name = "OK"
		command = { type = local_setflag which = IndiaManpowerE }
		command = { type = free_manpower value = 1 }
	}
}

event = {
	id = 332213
	persistent = yes
	random = no

	trigger = {
		local_flag = IndiaManpowerE

		OR = {
			atwar = no
			NOT = { control = { province = 1468 data = -1 } } # Jaipur
			NOT = { control = { province = 1467 data = -1 } } # Indore
		}
	}

	country = ENG
	date = { year = 1936 month = 0 day = 0 }
	offset = 10
	deathdate = { year = 1953 month = 11 day = 92 }

	name = "Manpower Event"
	desc = "Turns off the simulated Indian manpower."

	action_a = {
		name = "OK"
		command = { type = local_clrflag which = IndiaManpowerE }
		command = { type = free_manpower value = -1 }
	}
}

#
### South Indian area
event = {
	id = 332214
	persistent = yes
	random = no

	trigger = {
		atwar = yes
		NOT = { local_flag = IndiaManpowerS }
		control = { province = 1511 data = -1 } # Bangalore
		control = { province = 1514 data = -1 } # Cochin
		control = { province = 1509 data = -1 } # Madras
	}

	country = ENG
	date = { year = 1936 month = 0 day = 0 }
	offset = 10
	deathdate = { year = 1953 month = 11 day = 92 }

	name = "Manpower Event"
	desc = "Receive some Indian manpower despite the game engine flaw."

	action_a = {
		name = "OK"
		command = { type = local_setflag which = IndiaManpowerS }
		command = { type = free_manpower value = 1 }
	}
}

event = {
	id = 332215
	persistent = yes
	random = no

	trigger = {
		local_flag = IndiaManpowerS

		OR = {
			atwar = no
			NOT = { control = { province = 1511 data = -1 } } # Bangalore
			NOT = { control = { province = 1514 data = -1 } } # Cochin
			NOT = { control = { province = 1509 data = -1 } } # Madras
		}
	}

	country = ENG
	date = { year = 1936 month = 0 day = 0 }
	offset = 10
	deathdate = { year = 1953 month = 11 day = 92 }

	name = "Manpower Event"
	desc = "Turns off the simulated Indian manpower."

	action_a = {
		name = "OK"
		command = { type = local_clrflag which = IndiaManpowerS }
		command = { type = free_manpower value = -1 }
	}
}

#
### West Indian / Pakistani area
event = {
	id = 332216
	persistent = yes
	random = no

	trigger = {
		atwar = yes
		NOT = { local_flag = IndiaManpowerW }
		control = { province = 1494 data = -1 } # Karachi
		control = { province = 1481 data = -1 } # Sukkur
		control = { province = 1480 data = -1 } # Hyderabad
	}

	country = ENG
	date = { year = 1936 month = 0 day = 0 }
	offset = 10
	deathdate = { year = 1953 month = 11 day = 92 }

	name = "Manpower Event"
	desc = "Receive some Indian manpower despite the game engine flaw."

	action_a = {
		name = "OK"
		command = { type = local_setflag which = IndiaManpowerW }
		command = { type = free_manpower value = 1 }
	}
}

event = {
	id = 332217
	persistent = yes
	random = no

	trigger = {
		local_flag = IndiaManpowerW

		OR = {
			atwar = no
			NOT = { control = { province = 1494 data = -1 } } # Karachi
			NOT = { control = { province = 1481 data = -1 } } # Sukkur
			NOT = { control = { province = 1480 data = -1 } } # Hyderabad
		}
	}

	country = ENG
	date = { year = 1936 month = 0 day = 0 }
	offset = 10
	deathdate = { year = 1953 month = 11 day = 92 }

	name = "Manpower Event"
	desc = "Turns off the simulated Indian manpower."

	action_a = {
		name = "OK"
		command = { type = local_clrflag which = IndiaManpowerW }
		command = { type = free_manpower value = -1 }
	}
}

Edit: Just noticed I've used 92 instead of 29; it works as it should anyway since it's a deathdate.

[Borsook]

@Wobbler - I've been playtesting the Japanese events, while they run fine they give +1 manpower daily growth. This is an insane amount that triples Japan's peacetime manpower growth. Wouldn't it be more logical to make the events give let's say 1 MP every fortnight or so?

[Wobbler]

1 is far less than the sum of the events in japanmanpower.txt, had they worked; on the other hand, the UK only gets 0.18 daily manpower from all of its overseas holdings even with a man of the people security minister, which is only a fraction of what they ought to get from their national provinces in India, containing a great deal more manpower than the British Isles... leading me to think all overseas holdings count as either non-national or colonial, national provinces or not.

Does the Peacetime IC modifier affect manpower growth?

[Borsook]

Originally Posted by Wobbler

1 is far less than the sum of the events in japanmanpower.txt, had they worked; on the other hand, the UK only gets 0.18 daily manpower from all of its overseas holdings even with a man of the people security minister, which is only a fraction of what they ought to get from their national provinces in India, containing a great deal more manpower than the British Isles... leading me to think all overseas holdings count as either non-national or colonial, national provinces or not.

Does the Peacetime IC modifier affect manpower growth?

Ok, now I know what the problem is - the manpower gain from this event is not affected by difficulty settings so it gives me more manpower that I'm normally getting while at peace...

[Permanganate]

Originally Posted by Wobbler

...leading me to think all overseas holdings count as either non-national or colonial, national provinces or not.

You're missing another number from misc.txt - the Colonial Province Manpower Multiplier, 0.1 by default. All overseas core province manpower is multiplied by this number before being added to the dialy manpwoer increase. So, 1MP in London is worth 10x 1MP in Calcutta when at peace, and overseas gives nothing when at war.

[xtfoster]

Originally Posted by noobermenschen

???? Yes they are volunteers. I volunteered many years ago and can vouch for it. Even guys who wussed out during boot camp could get out of the service (though usually with a less than honorable discharge).

If you are following the line of "The Military uses unethical and deceptive recruiting practices to lure the poor, the uneducated and the brainwashed" then you have been misled.

He might also be referring to the fact that some soldiers are not being allowed to leave the military when their enlistments are up. (stop-loss measures)

[Junkyard_Pope]

Is there any way you can just change the multiplier for overseas manpower when at war? Like keep it at .1 or make it .2 when at peace and .1 when at war?

[Ericus1]

Wow dude, congrats on the necromancy. I knew this thread had to be old when I saw a post by Permanganate.

No, there are no event commands that allow you to change many of the settings that are part of the misc.txt file, including that one.

The best and most realistic solution is to add in the non-passable strait connection, as described earlier in the thread.

[redrabbit2009]

Originally Posted by blue emu

TxJackalope is awarded one Emu-point.

Psh that's all you're gonna give him? I think as a winner he deserves two, at least