What decides which General controls a battle.

SpanglishEmpire said:

I have always wondered how to get say Rommel to always control the battle. If I attack with multiple divisions sometimes I will get a random commander say a commander from another country who is contributing one div and he will lead. Is there any way to always have the guy I want leading?

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im pretty sure its which unit instigates the combat

Rank and when ranks are equal AFAIK it’s random. That’s why it’s important to assign, except theatre command, the highest skill the highest rank. What I do with divisional combat is to have the HQ, I usually don’t add units to with combat width to HQ’s, support the attack. This guarantees that the highest skill lvl is in command. BTW Assiging Rommel to a division is a really bad decision, though it maybe historically accurate, because only the division benefits from his skill lvl and traits!

Basically my OOB starting set up looks like this:
A-Grp: lvl 5 or 4
Army: lvl 4 or 3
Corps: lvl 3 or 2
Div: lvl 3 or 2 and sometimes 1 (i.e. Russia or Japan).
The thing you need to keep in mind is that low skill lvl commanders easily gain experience at divisional lvl, but the higher they are in rank the longer it takes to gain experience. There are other major benefits to this set up, so you might wanna check this link: Leader Skills and Traits

The portion about skill levels is directly at the top, but the rest is really worth checking.


For my airforce is do the following:
4 star: lvl 5 or higher
3 star: Lvl 4
2 star: Lvl 3
1 star: Lvl 2 and 1

Naval combat is different story, but it does pay off to have the highest skill lvl commanders as four stars!

MICKY1UP said:

im pretty sure its which unit instigates the combat

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As far as I could tell - highest ranking, and with lowest ID number.

i think the question hes asking is at division level if you start an attack from say a rank 1 general and then attack with another division in the same action the first attacking division commander is in charge no matter what the ranks

Does it matter? If you have four division attacking simultaneously, all leader will earn exp right? Put the cursor on the division name on the battle window, and you can see each leaders level. I thought the feature "general who control the battle" is just for convenience and got nothing to do with the battle itself. Every leader only affect his own division. Am I wrong?

Nope, you're not wrong. Each Mj.Gen commands their own division and will get their skill bonus and all generals involved will get experience and gain traits. It really doesn't matter which general portrait is shown in the window.

GarfunkeL said:

It really doesn't matter which general portrait is shown in the window.

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110BSU said:

Does it matter? If you have four division attacking simultaneously, all leader will earn exp right? Put the cursor on the division name on the battle window, and you can see each leaders level. I thought the feature "general who control the battle" is just for convenience and got nothing to do with the battle itself. Every leader only affect his own division. Am I wrong?

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That depends on the amount of Div performing the attack. A divisional commander can only command a certain amount of Div in battle, don’t know the exact number, and if there are more then he command by rank, all units involved will receive a penalty. That’s why it’s important to have a good set up. As posted earlier I usually have my Corps commanders supporting the attack, yes I’m one of the few micromanagers, so I never suffer a penalty because the commander is commanding more forces then he can.

MICKY1UP said:

i think the question hes asking is at division level if you start an attack from say a rank 1 general and then attack with another division in the same action the first attacking division commander is in charge no matter what the ranks

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If multiple Div start the attack simultaneously, it’s random. If the attack starts with one Div, the commander of that Div is in charge. But, if a commander with a higher rank is involved, he’ll command the battle no matter what.

then why doesnt the game reflect that it always shows the portrait of the first to attack as the battle commander and from my experience that commader always gets the most exp from the engagement

A divisional commander can only command a certain amount of Div in battle, don’t know the exact number, and if there are more then he command by rank, all units involved will receive a penalty.

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Are you sure you're not confusing stacking penalty or something else with this? How is the tool tip named? I honestly cannot recall ever having come across this issue.

The general whose portrait is shown determines the odds of getting favorable combat events (Mass Assault, Ambush, Counter-attack, etc.). The individual divisions fight according to the stats and traits of their own divisional commander, Corps commander, etc.

GarfunkeL said:

Are you sure you're not confusing stacking penalty or something else with this? How is the tool tip named? I honestly cannot recall ever having come across this issue.

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No I’m not confusing it with the stacking penalty. You can see it in the battle screen if it happens, because there is a symbol stating that the commander is commanding more units then his rank allows him. I haven’t had it in ages, and never really paid that much attention to it, cause almost all my attacks are supported by Corps, Army or Army Group commanders.
As said the vast majority of my attacks are supported by commanders with a higher rank so I am not sure if its still applicable because I don’t encounter it. It could also have been something that was applicable in an earlier version, like FTM or SF. I cant find anything about it on HOI Wiki, but that doesn’t mean much, since a lot of in battle modifiers aren’t mentioned on HOI Wiki. The only thing that can be done is testing it in game I guess (which is problematic right now since Im at work…not working ) Just open an old saved game and attack a province with something like 12 divisions without support and go to the battle screen. I’ll try to have a go at it tonight as well.

MICKY1UP said:

then why doesnt the game reflect that it always shows the portrait of the first to attack as the battle commander and from my experience that commader always gets the most exp from the engagement

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Please reread my earlier post as it clearly states that “If the attack starts with one Div, the commander of that Div is in charge”. Only when multiple units attack simultaneously, it’s random. The exception for both being that a higher rank commander, as in Corps/Army/Army Group/Theatre commander, is also involved in battle.

The one with highest rank, and the first in alfabet will take the overall lead. Silly but true. The subordinates only affect their own units.

I will use Rommel as a division commander as long as I can. Why? Because he will gain even higher skill level that way. You don't seriously need any more gallant guy than Liebermann or von Fritsch to lead campaign against Poland and Yugoslavia. Blaskowitz, von Arnim, Geyr von Schweppenburg, Hausser and Falkenhorst in my game have advanced to level 7 while leading divisions or corps.

SpanglishEmpire said:

Its more a flavor thing for me, I like Manstein to be leading if I can!

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Yes of course, I love him too, I've even read his book. In my game I only forgot Manstein and left him to guard Poland.

I did a trial Friday and there doesn’t seem to be a modifier that a general commands more units in battle then his rank allows him. I was confusing it with the skill level and whether it’s used to good effect in battle.

Pacius Ferox said:

The one with highest rank, and the first in alfabet will take the overall lead. Silly but true. The subordinates only affect their own units.

I will use Rommel as a division commander as long as I can. Why? Because he will gain even higher skill level that way. You don't seriously need any more gallant guy than Liebermann or von Fritsch to lead campaign against Poland and Yugoslavia. Blaskowitz, von Arnim, Geyr von Schweppenburg, Hausser and Falkenhorst in my game have advanced to level 7 while leading divisions or corps.

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IIRC the commanders you are naming have a skill level 4 at best and some even have a lower skill. It’s a bit of waste. Though your high level commander gets more experience quickly, your lower level commanders don’t, cause they are higher up the ladder and earn skill far more slower. You probably end up with a few high skilled commanders and lots of “low” skill commanders. Just a though…

Besides the leaders and traits link in my post of 30-10-2014, there are quite a few strong arguments not to assign him at divisional level but at least at army lvl:
Traits trickle down and the amount of commanders with more than 2 traits and a high skill level are limited. When assigned at army lvl, a maximum of 25 divisions benefit from his traits!
The skill lvl of an army commander increases org levels by 1% per skill level. In Rommels case that’s 5% for 25 divisions. This indirectly also means a faster org recovery after battle!
Assign your highest skill lvl commanders to command an Army Group. Per skill lvl they reduce supply consumption for their subordinate units by 5%! A lvl 5 commander reduces this by 25%! That’s a lot of IC that doesn’t need to be invested in supplies.

If you wanna increase the skill level of commanders, you can also assign them to support attacks or add units to their HQ. Using this method, Rommel usually has a skill lvl of 6 or 7 by the time I attack Russia. So basically I get the same results as you do. You can add any unit to a HQ but a Germany I usually add the LARM units available at the start of the scenario to my Army and Army Group HQ’s. This way I don’t have to upgrade them to ARM and still get a very good use out of them. Especially for the commanders involved and when HQ speed starts to near 8 mph. But you can add any unit with combat width to an HQ.
If you wanted to do something similar, at the start of the scenario I set up my OOB in such a way that it’s ready for the attack of France. So my OOB in the east has one Army Group and five Armies. In the West I have one Army Group and one Army. For the attack on Russia I only need one extra Army Group and Army.

Anyway it’s your game…

It's not a waste, just an optimization of the better future leaders. Geyr von Schweppenburg for example starts out as level 4 commander, but he can advance as high as 8. Rommel starts with level 5 but he can get 9. The lower level generals will never reach high values, and the good leaders won't reach high levels at all if you put them into high headquarters right from the start. Like in real war, the frontline is where the leader is the most effective and not the chartroom.

My game, your game too.

That's why you attach an INF brigade to the HQ and use them to support the attack by the other INF divisions. The higher level HQ commander gains experience not only from the attached units in combat, but from direct combat as well, and increases in skill VERY quickly in comparison to just one or the other. If you're going to "maximize" the situation, don't just maximize half of it.