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Norman culture? scandinavia or normandy?

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Davetheterror

Davetheterror

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Historians says the norman culture came from scandinavia to normandy when they raided and took advantage of weaker nobles and claimed their land, so my question is, do the norman culture happens in scandinavia or normandy? can it happen if you are a frankish dukes in normandy who recently accepted the french culture through the caroligian decision(or whatever) ?
 
Norman culture didn't "come from Scandinavia". It originated in Normandy (northern France) due to syncretism between norse settlers and french natives who started to intermarry immediately.
 
Norman culture occurs in game after MTTH of 100 years when a Norse culture character is:
1: Independent (I think this is a must)
2: Personally holding a county of Frankish, Occitan, or Breton culture.

Yes, I think the easiest way to do this is to either control a county in Cornwall or in Brittany.
 
Mageknight said:
Norman culture occurs in game after MTTH of 100 years when a Norse culture character is:
1: Independent (I think this is a must)
2: Personally holding a county of Frankish, Occitan, or Breton culture.

Yes, I think the easiest way to do this is to either control a county in Cornwall or in Brittany.
Click to expand...

Actually, since Charlemagne I'm pretty sure it's French, Occitan, and Breton.
 
SovereignGrave said:
Actually, since Charlemagne I'm pretty sure it's French, Occitan, and Breton.
Click to expand...

Correct. Since Charlemagne it's also enough for the province owner to be Norse, the top liege needn't be (so a Norse vassal of a French king can get Norman culture provinces).
 
It's still hard to replicate history, since now there's no "liege doesn't give a damn, so no help arrives to defend vassal when he is attacked" like it was in the case of the norse attacks on frankish lands.
 
Sunspawn said:
It's still hard to replicate history, since now there's no "liege doesn't give a damn, so no help arrives to defend vassal when he is attacked" like it was in the case of the norse attacks on frankish lands.
Click to expand...

It might be interesting if very low Crown authority also made it so that the liege wasn't obligated to help his vassals. Basically make it vassal-in-name-only. That way might actually have vassals like at least SOME CA.
 
SovereignGrave said:
Normandy is irrelevant. Just go for Cornwall or Brittany if you want Norman culture.
Click to expand...

Absolutely not. Corwall and Brittany have celtic cultures.

Norman means "North men", it was the name given by the christians to the raiders from the North (the Vikings). There were originally three Norman establishments: the Kingdom of York, the Norman establishment in Nantes, and Normandy. The only one that remained after the VIIIth century in Normandy. You can search the ancestors of Guillaume the Conqueror in Wikipedia if you want more details on how Normandy has been incorporated into the french kingdom, while York and Nantes have been reconquered.
 
Ezumiyr said:
Absolutely not. Corwall and Brittany have celtic cultures.

Norman means "North men", it was the name given by the christians to the raiders from the North (the Vikings). There were originally three Norman establishments: the Kingdom of York, the Norman establishment in Nantes, and Normandy. The only one that remained after the VIIIth century in Normandy. You can search the ancestors of Guillaume the Conqueror in Wikipedia if you want more details on how Normandy has been incorporated into the french kingdom, while York and Nantes have been reconquered.
Click to expand...

Well, there was the kingdom of the isles too, and smaller entities in Ireland beyond that

EDIT: And he's still right. It might not be correct, but if you as a Norse take and hold Cornwall, you'll very likely have norman culture pop up quite quikcly
 
Ezumiyr said:
Absolutely not. Corwall and Brittany have celtic cultures.

Norman means "North men", it was the name given by the christians to the raiders from the North (the Vikings). There were originally three Norman establishments: the Kingdom of York, the Norman establishment in Nantes, and Normandy. The only one that remained after the VIIIth century in Normandy. You can search the ancestors of Guillaume the Conqueror in Wikipedia if you want more details on how Normandy has been incorporated into the french kingdom, while York and Nantes have been reconquered.
Click to expand...

I was talking about in-game, not real life. If someone only cares about getting Norman culture then taking Brittany or Cornwall are the best bet, since they both have Breton culture and are relatively small and easily conquered. And, for whatever region, a Norseman ruling over Bretons forms Norman culture.
 
Sunspawn said:
It's still hard to replicate history, since now there's no "liege doesn't give a damn, so no help arrives to defend vassal when he is attacked" like it was in the case of the norse attacks on frankish lands.
Click to expand...
Maybe when the top liege is busy fighting wars? Or through adventurers?

Anyway, this shouldn't be too impossible to make this happen. Norse character gets county in Normandy using CB while liege is distracted elsewhere, French king tries holy war so Norse guy converts, French king uses de jure CBs and it's done, Norse/normal liege

Might still need a bit of tweaking here and there, but that might lead to too much railroading. I'm not opposed to a special type of Rollo of Normandy adventurer event á la Seljuk. Or heck, just make Norse adventurers more likely to target Normandy.
 
Thure said:
Normandy. Because Normans are French speaking Scandinavians. Norman culture in this sense didn't exist before the Scandinavians moved into France and take the French language.
Click to expand...

Well damn next time I go to Normandy, I'll see the Normans in a different light that's for sure. :rofl:
 
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