• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.

DocDesastro

Lt. General
65 Badges
Jul 2, 2011
1.256
1.051
  • Hearts of Iron Anthology
  • Hearts of Iron IV: By Blood Alone
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Imperator: Rome - Magna Graecia
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Crusader Kings III: Royal Edition
  • Battle for Bosporus
  • Island Bound
  • Empire of Sin
  • Empire of Sin - Deluxe Edition
  • Hearts of Iron III Collection
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Darkest Hour
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Cities in Motion
  • Cities: Skylines Deluxe Edition
  • Cities: Skylines
  • BATTLETECH
  • Crusader Kings Complete
  • Cities: Skylines - Mass Transit
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Age of Wonders
  • Cities: Skylines - Green Cities
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Prison Architect: Psych Ward
  • Cities: Skylines - Natural Disasters
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • BATTLETECH - Digital Deluxe Edition
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Cities: Skylines Industries
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Prison Architect
  • Cities: Skylines - Campus
  • BATTLETECH: Heavy Metal
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • 500k Club
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Cities: Skylines - After Dark
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Cities: Skylines - Snowfall
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
I had an idea which I drew from my experience with HoI 2. Remember you could equip ships with all kinds of upgrades? Like Radar systems, ASW equipment and stuff? Why not do something like that for land units and Air units as well?
There are some threads concerned with stuff like fighting in deserts or other terrain and whether unit XP should solve the things or doctrines or a combo.

In my view a combined approach could be made. Let's try to talk about desert equipment as example.
First, you want to research a desert fighting doctrine if you do not have it already because of colonial background and/or living just there. This doctrine will unlock the equipment 'desert gear kit '36 (Infantry)', 'desert gear kit '36 (tank)' and desert kit '36 (air)'. The doctrine will unlock certain tactical decisions for the commanding general present at corresponding battles. Maybe this also will reduce attrition to a certain rate. Now this is what the doctrine does. Colonials or countries which happen to have deserts could have auto-unlocked 'Desert kit '18 (Inf)' but need to advance in doctrines to unlock higher tiers. This might give colonials a sligth edge as existing militia/inf could be already equipped with this from start.

I was always intrigued, why newly built units automatically had the correct equipment for free and existing units were upgraded, wherever they happen to be. Sure, you could prioritize or block upgrading but you might concur, that this is silly if you research the skiing kits at the same time as desert equipment. So your mountaineers located in Bergen, Norway would also be equipped with desert gear or not at all.

Now the kits come into play. You could build them and assign them to units in the field. They should raise the supply/fuel demand of the unit by an appropriate margin and add tonnage for transport purposes as the new stuff also needs maintenance and replacements and weighs something. So in that case, you will be able to decide efficiently, what units will have certain kits and modify later like removing kits into strategical reserve and redistribute. This comes with an extra micromanagement penalty.

And now for the wonderful, optional stuff: Now what if you can research the desert kits, but the refinement will go automatically? And will not work magically at once? Imagine this scenario.
A unit freshly issued with the new gear will not profit from anything. 'Huh?! Doc's crazy?' you might say?
Now, for each day in service a kit is in service with the unit the improved stats will raise from 0 to the maximum that piece of gear offers. Like 'reduce attrition in deserts by X, speed in deserts + Y, desert fighting penalty -Z%'. It also will have an increased supply demand as new things break down more often because the soldiers using it make mistakes as it is new. Let's start at 200% supply demand and trickle back to 100%
This simulates that the unit's soldiers need to get used to that kind of stuff to use it properly and cannot do that magically at once. Each day in combat might speed this up by some % as the guys are forced to do something with that finally reaching optimum efficiency. This also might put a lid on the tiring discussions elsewhere whether a unit should have terrain related skill or skills at all.

Now let us talk about improving it. Each day some XP trickle into a certain hidden pool and will unlock the next tech tier once a threshold is reached. The the next tier of equipment is unlocked and can be built like 'Desert kit '39 (INF)
You get points for:
- Having a kit in the field - the more kits are used simultaneously, the quicker will be the advancements as more are produced which stimulates industry where that stuff is bought to improve (capitalism for dummies, lection I), flaws are ironed out and soldiers giving feedback.
- Having a General with the 'desert fox' trait. This could open some improved tactical decisions for the genral, but mainly improves tech advancement as the commanding general of an army is required to evaluate the performance of his troops and can give his XP for fighting in that terrain to research - figure of speech-wise. Let your generals fight in different terrain to let them learn something those guys in the lab-coats could use.
You see, nations employing certain tactics and favoring certain terrain wil improve more quickly than others in certain fields. But you do not need a tech team for everything and this 'magical unlock skill nonsense' stops. War is not a computer game...waaaaaaaait o_@

The question would be: how will units upgrade? Is IC-wise possible?

This could give raise to other upgrades nicely ironing out some 'balancing' issues like AT ammo for AA-units. HEAT-Ammo for certain tank divisions. Improved AT-Equipment for Infantry clearing the need for having all explained by having 'specialist battalions' giving raise to trollfests of discussion why such units did not fight as battalions and bla.

And yes, go ahead and mod your 'giant rocket bicycle upgrade' ;)

This for starters, constructive feedback encouraged :)
 
Last edited:
I'd really like to see more information on the production queue and lines because we don't even know how infantry etc is put together yet.

There are a lot of possibilities with adding in such functionality, such as another discussion about aircraft weapons (air to surface, and air to air missiles) being construct able addons to planes.

While realistic I think this pushes us a little too far down the micro management industrial simulator 2000 route in having to manually build desert, winter, jungle, amphibious, etc kits.
 
Well, you could make it to order the units already with the equipment on them like checkboxes for those things in the production queue. Extra kits are only needed for equipping already existing units.
 
Well, you could make it to order the units already with the equipment on them like checkboxes for those things in the production queue. Extra kits are only needed for equipping already existing units.

Yes but thats the whole point I'm trying to make is how does this happen? We have seen nothing on infantry or even land production except a very few examples. We know there are "kits" grouping up everything a unit would need like supply trucks, mortars, etc, but nothing has been shown on this, and barely even discussed.

Even if we add in a checkbox, now you have to add in some kind of mechanism for the templates, does this require different templates? How do we known a unit has desert versus jungle, versus winter, etc.
 
That might be a tad too much micromanagement, while the current abstraction is quite fine imho. During the time the tech team will research the tech, they will in fact develop the kit and distribute it relatively widely (through cost of tech teams, and abstraction of having some industry comprised in the tech team but usable only for research).