• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
Status
Not open for further replies.
Wunderwaffen called Wunderwaffen because they are key techs to turn the tide ( or supposed to). My suggestion was that the loosing side get a bonus to research such stuff to make the game more exciting in the late game and give it more tournarounds

Wunderwaffen aren't typically as clear cut as you'd think. For the resources that it used, the Manhattan Project could be potentially seen as a massive waste of resources considering it was only used at the very end of the war and that other conventional endeavours such as the Firebombing of Dresden were far more cost effective / arguably did more damage. If you consider that the majority of Japanese cities of the time were made largely of wood and paper; an enterprise of firebombers might have had similar/increased damage to a nuke.

I would like Wunderwaffen in the game in order to add some sense of investing resources for potentially limited returns. As the megalomaniac leader of X country, I want to develop Churchill's Ice Carrier or Hitler's V3 Cannon. Americans can develop Firebats and the Russians had their Anti-Tank dogs.
 
Wunderwaffen called Wunderwaffen because they are key techs to turn the tide ( or supposed to). My suggestion was that the loosing side get a bonus to research such stuff to make the game more exciting in the late game and give it more tournarounds

In that case you need to find a way to make the AI use them in a way that will impact the game's balance. Personally, I would be very happy if the AI used, say, paratroopers, in a meaningful way. Still, I think it's too much effort for something that is equally well represented in the game by statistical improvements for existing units. I admit that the sight of the Royal Navy invading Norway in 1945 screened by ice-carriers is an impressive imagery, but we all know that this is not going to happen.
 
Wunderwaffen aren't typically as clear cut as you'd think. For the resources that it used, the Manhattan Project could be potentially seen as a massive waste of resources considering it was only used at the very end of the war and that other conventional endeavours such as the Firebombing of Dresden were far more cost effective / arguably did more damage. If you consider that the majority of Japanese cities of the time were made largely of wood and paper; an enterprise of firebombers might have had similar/increased damage to a nuke.

I would like Wunderwaffen in the game in order to add some sense of investing resources for potentially limited returns. As the megalomaniac leader of X country, I want to develop Churchill's Ice Carrier or Hitler's V3 Cannon. Americans can develop Firebats and the Russians had their Anti-Tank dogs.

My point was that nations THINK they can turn the tide with these weapons. And the loosing side has a big pressure to find a technology to start winning which should be represented with a tech boni. These technologies dont have to be really strong, they could be crazy & waste of ressources. Thats not the point. It is about giving the loosing side some tech advantage in some NEW fields ( doesnt have to be better ).
 
Suprised nobody mentioned the missile developments. The Wasserfall was probably one of the first surface to air missile systems in existance.



Eh, only impressive thing about it was the lack of backblast making it easier to use in structures and ideal for stealth teams. Otherwise the PIAT was just a mediocre anti-tank weapon, the Bazooka, Panzerschreck, and Panzerfaust were far superior weapons.

I wouldn't claim the PIAT was a wunderwaffen but saying it was inferior to the bazooka is a gross understatement. the bazooka was incredibly flawed during WW2.

As far as other weapons go I always wanted to know how the Goliath did as an anti tank weapon, I think 6k or so were produced how successful it was I have never found any stats.
Though whether it would just be classed as a part of an AT unit and not a specific weapon just a +1 hard attack or so.
 
My point was that nations THINK they can turn the tide with these weapons.
I don't know much history, but aren't there examples of technology turning the tide during wars that would otherwise be lost? The Korean Kobukson turtle ships come to mind; the common narrative is that the Koreans were losing the war, but managed to turn the tables by basically inventing ironclad warships.
 
I don't know much history, but aren't there examples of technology turning the tide during wars that would otherwise be lost? The Korean Kobukson turtle ships come to mind; the common narrative is that the Koreans were losing the war, but managed to turn the tables by basically inventing ironclad warships.

If they realy help or not; it doesnt matter. But a loosing country will have a high pressure to find new weapons. Calling them wunderwaffe is part of propaganda.
In game it could be modeled that the loosing faction gets a research boni on techs it declares as wunderwaffen and a little moral boosts after the research is finished.
 
If they realy help or not; it doesnt matter. But a loosing country will have a high pressure to find new weapons. Calling them wunderwaffe is part of propaganda.
In game it could be modeled that the loosing faction gets a research boni on techs it declares as wunderwaffen and a little moral boosts after the research is finished.

So Ethiopia should get a research bonus on technology it declares as wunderwaffen as well as moral boosts when it's about to loose the war against Italy? I don't think this sort of technological and cultural relativism is appropriate for this kind of game, even if politically correct.
 
  • 1
Reactions:
So Ethiopia should get a research bonus on technology it declares as wunderwaffen as well as moral boosts when it's about to loose the war against Italy? I don't think this sort of technological and cultural relativism is appropriate for this kind of game, even if politically correct.
Well the technological bonus, could be scaling with the technological abilites of the country to start with.
ie.
countries like Germany/USA will get a large bonus , if they are losing a lot of ground. (The bonus should still not be able to put them ligthyears ahead of other nations, but a decent boost here and there, could be interesting).
countries like Ethopia (no offence against Ethopia), which did not introduce many new inventions in the war, would only get a small bonus barely making a difference.

I'm really just thinking out loud here, but perhaps there could also be someway to get a temporary tech-boost for winning a battle. I mean, after each battle there could be a chance to capture crucial tech, like the Enigma machine (which will give the winning side a temporary bonus to Encryption/decryption. Enabling them to get more accurate intelligence.). Likewise capturing a region, with high-level radar-infrastructure, from a nation with high radar-tech, could potentially give you a radar-tech boost. I believe, it could provide some interesting scenarios, sometimes (like with the Enigma) a bit of luck, could really help a nation (alliance) out.
I think this would be even more interesting, if it was not just random-chance-based. I'm not sure exactly how, the player could interfere with it (without making it too much of a hazzle), but perhaps the nation could issue how 'secret/important' a specific tech is. ie. Germany could declare the Enigma machine for 'top secret', this decreases the effectiveness, since it is less widespread, but makes it much less likely to fall into enemy hands (since there are less of them, and everybody would be instructed to dispose of the machines if in danger).

Speaking of all this, the player could also INTENTIONALLY decide to 'feed' false information/tech to the enemy. It is my understanding that misinformation played a extremely large role in the war, I hope we will be able to place phoney-armies , deliver false battle-plans (this requires that real battle-plans will be implemented) to the enemy.

/Fumle
 
Can we can a sneakpeak ( correct word? ) about how many "wunderwaffen" will make it into the game?
1945 germany has a lot of projects. Many of them were waste but some are interesting: Stealth Fighter, "Modern" Submarine , Rockets , (Surface-Air)Missile , "Fliegerfaust" .
I think there should be a modifier that boosts tech if you are loosing ground. That helps the SU to research the T34 and gives the Player an option to fight longer as Germany( the loosing side )

stealth figter ? which ones ? use of wood was forced due to lack of alumunium. modern submarines ? mk 21/23 were allways in game - as latest subs tech for all nations. rokects ? v1/2 were allways in game, same for x4. which wepon you meaned with fligerfaust ?
 
Wunderwaffen aren't typically as clear cut as you'd think. For the resources that it used, the Manhattan Project could be potentially seen as a massive waste of resources considering it was only used at the very end of the war and that other conventional endeavours such as the Firebombing of Dresden were far more cost effective / arguably did more damage. If you consider that the majority of Japanese cities of the time were made largely of wood and paper; an enterprise of firebombers might have had similar/increased damage to a nuke.

I would like Wunderwaffen in the game in order to add some sense of investing resources for potentially limited returns. As the megalomaniac leader of X country, I want to develop Churchill's Ice Carrier or Hitler's V3 Cannon. Americans can develop Firebats and the Russians had their Anti-Tank dogs.

not enntirely true, for destoing city with nuke you needed only one bomber, compared to thousands with conventioanal bombing(which costed a lot of resources), not counting material needed to bombs alone.
Once all infrastukture for nujke was builded, nuke bomb alone become one of most economic weapons used. And lot of money were used for converting/building new ammo/planes factories too.
 
I don't know much history, but aren't there examples of technology turning the tide during wars that would otherwise be lost? The Korean Kobukson turtle ships come to mind; the common narrative is that the Koreans were losing the war, but managed to turn the tables by basically inventing ironclad warships.

They had a superb admiral, one of the best in history. It´s not only about the tech.
 
Can we can a sneakpeak ( correct word? ) about how many "wunderwaffen" will make it into the game?
1945 germany has a lot of projects. Many of them were waste but some are interesting: Stealth Fighter, "Modern" Submarine , Rockets , (Surface-Air)Missile , "Fliegerfaust" .
I think there should be a modifier that boosts tech if you are loosing ground. That helps the SU to research the T34 and gives the Player an option to fight longer as Germany( the loosing side )

The Type XXI submarine should definitely be in since they actually built those and deployed them (although the 2 deployed didn't see combat). Heck I'm pretty sure the Soviet "Romeo" class was directly based on the Type XXI (or at least largely influenced).

Me262 should obviously be in also since it was real

However, the Allies should have their "wunderwaffen" also since the british also had a jet fighter. (granted the allies wouldn't get all the benefits of capturing german tech if the war doesn't end in 1954 in game)
 
Wunderwaffen aren't typically as clear cut as you'd think. For the resources that it used, the Manhattan Project could be potentially seen as a massive waste of resources considering it was only used at the very end of the war and that other conventional endeavours such as the Firebombing of Dresden were far more cost effective / arguably did more damage. If you consider that the majority of Japanese cities of the time were made largely of wood and paper; an enterprise of firebombers might have had similar/increased damage to a nuke.

I would like Wunderwaffen in the game in order to add some sense of investing resources for potentially limited returns. As the megalomaniac leader of X country, I want to develop Churchill's Ice Carrier or Hitler's V3 Cannon. Americans can develop Firebats and the Russians had their Anti-Tank dogs.

I used to kind of think that way - but I recently finished reading Beevor's World War 2 and he claims that the development of the Atomic bomb was a major factor that stopped Staling from continuing on to overrun all of western europe.
 
I used to kind of think that way - but I recently finished reading Beevor's World War 2 and he claims that the development of the Atomic bomb was a major factor that stopped Staling from continuing on to overrun all of western europe.
stalin overuning wester europe in 1945 without nukes ? only in his dream. In 45 russians scraping end of bootom to get man to frontlines. as matter on fact, in 45 soviets sending human mapower to frontlines to that degree so they hurted themslef in long term production and sustanability of war production.
 
stealth figter ? which ones ? use of wood was forced due to lack of alumunium. modern submarines ? mk 21/23 were allways in game - as latest subs tech for all nations. rokects ? v1/2 were allways in game, same for x4. which wepon you meaned with fligerfaust ?

The Ho 229
And the Fliegerfaust was a portable surface to air missile launcher. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fliegerfaust
 
I can't help but notice some people here are using "Wunderwaffen" wrong. It's just a propaganda term used to refer to high-tech, experimental weapons that could give a big military advantage. This applies to any kind of weapon, from submarines to stealth bombers, from ballistic rockets to super-heavy tanks, from assault rifles to mobile anti-air launchers. You get the idea.
When we expand that idea further than just Nazi-Germany, quite some other countries were developing similair weapons, like Japan, the Soviet Union and the United States.

I'd love to see more of these weapons in HoI4. As far as I recall, HoI3 only really had 2; Ballistic rockets (e.g. V2) and ofcourse the atomic bombs. As these weapons are very exotic, you'd need to put a lot of resources and time into these projects, but when your nation completes the project, the result should be subtantial. Not just a small stats modifier as an upgrade over an existing unit (e.g. stealth bombers shouldn't have just a bit more air defence than jet bombers).
 
Things I would like to see:

- The Aggregat series, rockets from A1 to A12.
- Jet and rocket fighters
- Early stealth fighter (Horton 229)
- Transport subs
- Ballistic submarine
- Carrier submarine (with floatplanes)
 
Status
Not open for further replies.