I am the Duke of Verona (de jure), vassal of the HRE and just conquered Venice. I did it in a previous game and mucked up because it turned into a regular county (castle as main holding). Unlike that previous game however I do not have the option to turn it into a Duchy (I didn't do it that time because I wasn't sure if it was a good idea). I browsed some older topics on the subject but most of them seemed to focus on creating new vassal republics. I'm not really sure what I need to do to make the most out of this situation so any help would be appreciated.
Question about vassalized merchant republic
- Thread starter JSmith0730
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So, you're a duke. You cannot have another duke be your vassal.
You'll have to become a king of somewhere first. Just leave the primary of holding of Venice as a city for now, and then once you're a king grant that mayor a duchy. Or revoke it and give the city to a dynasty member, and then the duchy. That way one of the patrician houses will be of your dynasty.
You'll have to become a king of somewhere first. Just leave the primary of holding of Venice as a city for now, and then once you're a king grant that mayor a duchy. Or revoke it and give the city to a dynasty member, and then the duchy. That way one of the patrician houses will be of your dynasty.
Well, isn't having patricians of your dynasty messing up your own successions all the time?
I really don't recommend reforming Venice into a republic when you can just use something like Ancona and get massive amounts of tax income from both and not just slightly more from a Venetian republic. Feudal Venice is incredibly useful to have. Plus if you ever become an emperor, there's a slim chance the Venetian doge will form MSR Venice, which I'm pretty sure means his successor will leave your realm because king-tier merchants become indie.
No. Since you're a republic, any vassal republic under you is just a large city state. I made my uncle the Serene Doge of Jerusalem, but because his republic was a vassal to my republic, his death meant regular mayoral elections and not running it through the family/patricians.
In a kingdom level Republic, your end up with ducal or count level patricians depending on the number of duchies with the primary duchy associated with the ruler of the kingdom always being in the hands of the doge and the various ducal and count titles passing along Patrician at least for 5 titles and the rest of the titles will be held by non-patrician mayors, bishops and lords.
Are you certain? When I was Serene Doge of Sicily, all my duke-level vassals were glorified mayors; when I was Grand Prince of Italia, all my Serene Doge vassals were glorified mayors. The only patricians were the non-landed families directly under me, unless they managed to come into a city or two on their own.
maybe they've changed it but when I formed the kingdom of Sicily the Primary title duchy shifted from Amalfi so when the current Dodge died my heir got Amalfi and the rest of the titles were divided up amongst the patricians. I might had to do with the fact I didn't give them the title but it was divided up on the death of the Serene doge, also Patrician families can't hold more than one Patrician title in any republic and only one feudal title.
There is nothing that inherently makes king-tier merchant republics go independent if they're the vassal of an emperor. If you're large enough to safely handle king vassals, then you can easily handle a vassal Most Serene Republic. Besides, just don't give Venice a second duchy and make sure your CA is large enough to stop them expanding easily and they'll never become a kingdom.
Where are you getting that the OP is a republic?
It varies. If you have a king tier MR then the various patricians can make their house dukes when they are doge or by you granting them appropriate lands/titles. Or you can hog the positions or grant them to non-patricians.
Weird. Might just be PB/HIB, but as Hamburg I formed Ireland and on my death, my son inherited and went indie.
You still don't want to give Venice to a doge, though, because dukes are easier to deal with kings. Only requirement for MSR Venice is be a republic in Venice.