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anomanderus

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Jan 26, 2010
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In the course of Charlemagne we know that Norse paganism will be tweaked in some way to represent the somewhat different Saxons who shared belief in similar Germanic gods but had their own local beliefs separate from Scandinavia.

What I see here is the possibility of text and name changes being added. Being that paradox absolutely loves the Norse faith I see it as a possibility that another religious event could be added for the Saxons, though this is just my own speculation.

In the course of this I would like paradox not to forget about the other pagans, who lack many events and love that the other faiths have. Obviously there has been some complaining that the Zunists will be added as just another generic pagan faith (though I don't know whether they begin reformed or not). And obviously paradox has seen players make their own suggestions about other pagans. Personally I've suggested that when Suomenusko is reformed only provinces of the ruler's culture should become reformed Suomenusko, while others should remain unreformed- representing that the establishment of, say, Ukko as a chief god doesn't make sense in the pantheons of the other Finno-Ugric peoples being that they each have their own local beliefs. I have also suggested that because Zun is a justice giver who apparently had a gold statue with ruby eyes (which sounds a lot like a pagan god from a mystery novel I read once, which may mean that the author actually knew about Zun back in the 1960s or whenever the novel was written) that the Zunists should have an event similar to the Blot whereby captives are judged by Zun, with multiple outcomes.
 
I agree, and I don't. On the one hand, the Non-norse pagans are ridiculously barebones and are in dire need of fleshing out in terms of the wider scope of the game. But on the other hand, this DLC is focused on Charlemagne and the Saxons were probably his most famous enemies so I see a need to prioritise them in the context of this specific DLC. The fact that the Saxons are Norse is gonna irritate me to no end while playing the game. I think simply renaming the whole religion "Germanic" would probably be helpful. Since Germanic is the umbrella "parent" religion and can be a valid term for the Norse beliefs - but it doesn't really work the other way around.
 
At the least I'd like to see each pagan faith getting their own specialty when reformed. As of now only Tengri and Norse are really worth bothering with as a reformed faith.
 
What do Tengri get as reformed that other pagans do not?
Maybe not Tengri per se, but the the fact they are Mongol's religion thus gain tribal cb? Thus relatively stronger than other pagan when they are reformed?
I mean when I think of 'reformed Tengri' I think of Mongol most of the time...
Just my thought...
 
Maybe not Tengri per se, but the the fact they are Mongol's religion thus gain tribal cb? Thus relatively stronger than other pagan when they are reformed?
I mean when I think of 'reformed Tengri' I think of Mongol most of the time...
Just my thought...

That's just thing from Altaic culture and nothing to do with religion.
 
That's just thing from Altaic culture and nothing to do with religion.
Reformed tengri retain the invasion CB. It means that there's a real decision point between catholics and tengri at that point. Invasion CB, or the 90 things that catholics get? Suomenesko get uh... nothing. Neither does Slavic, or Romuva. I've never played North African but I imagine it's similarly boring.
 
Reformed tengri retain the invasion CB. It means that there's a real decision point between catholics and tengri at that point. Invasion CB, or the 90 things that catholics get? Suomenesko get uh... nothing. Neither does Slavic, or Romuva. I've never played North African but I imagine it's similarly boring.

Good to know.

And yes, West African is most boring of them all. We really need Kanem to map for some variety, not to mention mechanics.

Time to resurrect the old thread I guess :D
 
This DLC might be well focused on Charlemagne and Saxons and whatnot, but non-norse Pagans getting more fleshed out is something long overdue and its lack is an oversight. Right now the only character Slavic, Romuva and Suomenusko have in the game is being annoying to conquer by the big boys. Other than that it's just a subjugation/conquest/holy war spam game as there's nothing else to do.
 
This DLC might be well focused on Charlemagne and Saxons and whatnot, but non-norse Pagans getting more fleshed out is something long overdue and its lack is an oversight. Right now the only character Slavic, Romuva and Suomenusko have in the game is being annoying to conquer by the big boys. Other than that it's just a subjugation/conquest/holy war spam game as there's nothing else to do.

Well, raid mechanic is interesting way to do "military interventions" but that's about it sadly. I can live with fact that game is mainly intended for Christians and Muslims but please give us something little to differ the pagans a bit from each other. Tribal holdings and Saxons are good excuse to revamp Suomenusko, Slavic, Romuva, Tengri and West Africans.
 
Well, raid mechanic is interesting way to do "military interventions" but that's about it sadly. I can live with fact that game is mainly intended for Christians and Muslims but please give us something little to differ the pagans a bit from each other. Tribal holdings and Saxons are good excuse to revamp Suomenusko, Slavic, Romuva, Tengri and West Africans.

I think if they had really fleshed out Catholics and Muslims and left pagans unplayable that that would've been best. I'd have liked to see a fully functioning ERE or HRE. I'd have liked to see Heresies fleshed out more in particular also.
 
I think if they had really fleshed out Catholics and Muslims and left pagans unplayable that that would've been best. I'd have liked to see a fully functioning ERE or HRE. I'd have liked to see Heresies fleshed out more in particular also.

Why can't they do that? Also doesn't the centralization mechanic more properly represent the Byzantine empire as a real empire rather than a feudal realm in addition to the free revocation of dukedoms (themes)?
 
The problem with making the Saxons Norse Pagans is that they have the horrid Raven. As far as I know the Raven being associated with Woden is only a Norse thing. Plus the Saxon patron god was Seaxnet and I don't think he's on the Norse god list.
 
Pretty sure the dev said in the livestream something like "we wanted to do a germanic paganism for saxons but it's so close to norse we just made them norse". Note i said he said SOMETHING LIKE that. not a direct quote. So yeah, pretty sure saxons are just gonna be norse. But they did keep stating that anything can change before release!
 
The problem with making the Saxons Norse Pagans is that they have the horrid Raven. As far as I know the Raven being associated with Woden is only a Norse thing. Plus the Saxon patron god was Seaxnet and I don't think he's on the Norse god list.

I like the Raven though. But now that I think of it, they could redo the Norse symbol as being the World Tree instead of a Raven just like the Jews have the Hannukah candle holder instead of the six pointed star. Irminsul was the Saxon holy tree, after all.

But then the Vikings might feel too "nice".

Maybe paradox should make add the ability for religions to change their icon and description, so that if the Saxons fall the faith changes to Norse and the Raven from Germanic and the World Tree

Though I'm not sure how that would be different from making a separate Germanic faith from which Norse branches off of