Please Put Sea Zones around the Arabian Peninsula?

Cetan

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• Dec 12, 2013

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• #1

Title says it all.

I'm aware that there was an issue with the engine, that requires all sea zones to be connected or something. Coupled with the whole "There's no real Suez Canal" issue that would be the logical sea zone connection... I can see why there hasn't been any put in.

* Would a small "Suez" river zone count to link up the two sea areas, and disallow most ships to pass through?

* Is there a way to make a teeny sea zone that doesn't allow ships to cross?

* Could we just stick the canal there (as a navigable sea zone) regardless, using the claims that there was a basic canal and call it good?

 

Last edited: Dec 13, 2013

Thure

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• Dec 12, 2013

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• #2

Cetan said:

Would a small "Suez" river zone count to link up the two sea areas, and disallow most ships to pass through? Is there a way to make a teeny sea zone that doesn't allow ships to cross? Could we just stick the canal there regardless, using the claims that there was a basic canal and call it good?

Click to expand...

The problem is, that the AI can't handle unconnected seazones... And this problem would still e xist with an unpassable sea zone.

 

Vokasak

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• Dec 12, 2013

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• #3

make the Nile a sail-able river, and have a portage to connect to the red sea?

 

Aardvark Bellay

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• Dec 12, 2013

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• #4

Nah, often discussed and it seems it needs a sea zone and there seems to be no solution currently for the problem as far as i know.


In the mean time , there's a mod for that, but you get the Suez-Canal effect as well. You might know about it already. I know you want a dev to respond, but well it's just a tip by me. My 2cents.
http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?707075-MOD-Red-Sea-Persian-Gulf-Seazones-Mod

 

VolitionNewlove

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• Dec 12, 2013

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• #5

There's no simple way to do so with modding, however, surely it was Paradox whom made the naval AI in the first place? Surely the AI could be improved to handle discontiguous sea-zones?

This affects Europa Universalis IV, as well, in the case of the Mamluks, and any other nation which may controls Suez without exploring the Cape of Good Hope first.

 

Lysistrata

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• Dec 12, 2013

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• #6

Here's a fresh idea - make a sea zone that's actually about as big as a river. Problem solved.

 

scelestus13

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• Dec 13, 2013

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• #7

My question would be why the AI can't be changed. I mean, is it really that hard? Land AI handles non continuous lands...

 

Vokasak

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• Dec 13, 2013

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• #8

scelestus13 said:

My question would be why the AI can't be changed. I mean, is it really that hard? Land AI handles non continuous lands...

Click to expand...

Not particularly well. Ever seen a 867 boat-less France try to shoo away rebels on mallorca?

 

scelestus13

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• Dec 13, 2013

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• #9

Vokasak said:

Not particularly well. Ever seen a 867 boat-less France try to shoo away rebels on mallorca?

Click to expand...

Oh god I forgot about that. Point taken.

 

wilcoxchar

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• Dec 13, 2013

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• #10

Pte Baldrick said:

There's no simple way to do so with modding, however, surely it was Paradox whom made the naval AI in the first place? Surely the AI could be improved to handle discontiguous sea-zones?

Click to expand...

Paradox has tried. The devs said they just could not get it to work. The problem is with the AI sending ships to load troops in a province the ships can't reach.

 

unmerged(133356)

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• Dec 13, 2013

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• #11

I guess put a long portage there or something...

 

generalolaf

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• Dec 13, 2013

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• #12

KristopherWG said:

I guess put a long portage there or something...

Click to expand...

This. I can't see how there would be a problem with putting in a portage, especially since IIRC one actually existed there.

 

Cetan

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• Dec 13, 2013

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• #13

Lysistrata said:

Here's a fresh idea - make a sea zone that's actually about as big as a river. Problem solved.

Click to expand...

One of my ideas (or using an actual river; I don't know if that counts as connecting the unconnected sea zones AI-wise.)

Vokasak said:

Not particularly well. Ever seen a 867 boat-less France try to shoo away rebels on mallorca?

Click to expand...

Well, what would the player do? Not much better until either side gets boats.

Thure said:

The problem is, that the AI can't handle unconnected seazones... And this problem would still exist with an unpassable sea zone.

Click to expand...

My idea was that the sea zones would be connected, but somehow flagged to not allow any ships to enter. I don't know the nuts and bolts of the AI, but that was my idea of "connecting" it.

wilcoxchar said:

Paradox has tried. The devs said they just could not get it to work. The problem is with the AI sending ships to load troops in a province the ships can't reach.

Click to expand...

Now they have Wiz working wonders with the AI... perhaps the new fresh team (as mentioned by Doomdark) could be able to tackle it?

 

Vokasak

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• Dec 13, 2013

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• #14

Cetan said:

Well, what would the player do? Not much better until either side gets boats.

Click to expand...

I guess you haven't seen it, then. the AI keeps levies raised on the coast, waiting for boats that aren't coming (or hoping the army learns to swim?)

 

R

remagynona

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• Dec 13, 2013

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• #15

Umbra Spherae has an OK compromise. A ship that wants to get around Africa effectively goes off the map, past the southernmost point and reemerges in the Indian Ocean after a long transit.

 

TeutonicDane23

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• Dec 13, 2013

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• #16

Signed.

 

Vokasak

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• Dec 13, 2013

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• #17

remagynona said:

Umbra Spherae has an OK compromise. A ship that wants to get around Africa effectively goes off the map, past the southernmost point and reemerges in the Indian Ocean after a long transit.

Click to expand...

I'm not sure how rounding the cape 600 years early is an OK compromise. I'd rather take the suez canal option.

 

Unready

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• Dec 13, 2013

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• #18

Even more: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canal_of_the_Pharaohs

 

V

VienLa

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• Dec 13, 2013

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• #19

Even if muslims or christians wouldn't be able to create such canal, I'm sure there is someone in the timeframe that could.

 

fridabina

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• Dec 13, 2013

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• #20

A portage would be the best option IMO.
There might be problems with Vikings invading the Arabian peninsula during the 9th century though.