I don't get this conquest CB. Sometimes it lets me attack counties that have like 2 or 3 borders and other times it doesn't let me attack random islands that only have a border with the sea.
Conquest for single border counties(that border like 3?)
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I can't do it for all coastal provinces though, not even all islands.
Have to say, this is a pretty lame CB. In my mind, holy war is the baseline which if you don't have is BAD for you. Norse can make up for it with coastal county CB and prepared invasion CB. But other pagans are basically impossible to play as. In my observe game, a large and powerful Mali attacked the Ummayad blob for one county, and after years, won. But Ummayads can take it back and more in a holy war or worse, entirely conquer Mali with the invasion. Ditto Suomenusko, ditto Romuva, ditto Slavic. Those four seem to be the pagan religions paradox just felt obligated to put in, since they do so without any love.
All pagans have the subjugation CB which more than makes up for the lack of holy war CB. I agree that Mali is very frustrating to play, but that is more because of the lack of detail in that part of the map.
Yeah, but that's a once in a life-time cb or maybe twice if the kingdom is large enough and your small enough. But it can sustain growth like holy wars can, or even allow it in places where lots of non pagans are.
The thing is though, in the ToG starting date there is not a single starting position, except for Mali, where the holy war CB would be better than the subjugation CB. And as soon as you can't use subjugation anymore, expansion through conquest and fabricated claims should be good enough. I mean, it's not like christians spread like mad thanks to their holy war CB.
I think that having a special expansion for those four faiths would have been much, much better than simply "give them Norse mechanics, take all the fun out of it and viola".
Take the ambition to be king of X and you can pound the shit out of them every 10 years. If they hold multiple kingdoms you can take 1 shot for each and you get all occupied lands (though trying to take on The Ummayads for Granada and then just trolling desert provs will mean you lose over time for not occupying any holdings in the 'target' zone)
No, you can can't subjugate each of their kingdoms. You can subjugate anyone in one kingdom with the ambition and only use the subjugation CB ONCE more on whatever other random guy in a lifetime. You can't take one shot you each as one character and you don't get out of kingdom occupied lands.
How about you actually play as Norse before judging their CBs?
The CBs were designed to work well for the Norse and they do. The other pagan groups were designed to be defensive, so apparently Paradox didn't think they needed special CBs.
In the hands of the human playing as a Norse, these CBs are ridiculously OP. If you start in Scandinavia, you start with a kingdom subjugation CB that can be used to quickly get a kingdom. Finland and the Baltics are a bunch of tiny states. You can initiate conquest after conquest and never have to break a truce. Meanwhile, you can fabricate claims in one of the other Scandinavian kingdoms and pick off its territory. When you have it all, you can then use the subjugation CB to take the remaining kingdom in one war. Enjoy your gigantic Norse empire. Now, you just need to figure out what you want to do in the remaining 550 years in the game.
The other thing is that your Old Norse vassals do not really care about trucebreaker and don't cause many problems as long as you are at war. In an Ivar start, I grouped retinues with some mercs and marched from Brittany to Nassau with conquest war after conquest war. Basically, I took every county from the coast to about four counties deep. I broke truce after truce. Diplomacy was at a permanent zero. My vassals never rebelled. Then, the bastards in Sweden ruined my fun by reforming the faith.
The other pagans, of course, don't have it so easy. Something should be done to make them more fun to play, but not still not OP in the hands of the AI.
In the hands of the human playing as a Norse, these CBs are ridiculously OP. If you start in Scandinavia, you start with a kingdom subjugation CB that can be used to quickly get a kingdom. Finland and the Baltics are a bunch of tiny states. You can initiate conquest after conquest and never have to break a truce. Meanwhile, you can fabricate claims in one of the other Scandinavian kingdoms and pick off its territory. When you have it all, you can then use the subjugation CB to take the remaining kingdom in one war. Enjoy your gigantic Norse empire. Now, you just need to figure out what you want to do in the remaining 550 years in the game.
The other thing is that your Old Norse vassals do not really care about trucebreaker and don't cause many problems as long as you are at war. In an Ivar start, I grouped retinues with some mercs and marched from Brittany to Nassau with conquest war after conquest war. Basically, I took every county from the coast to about four counties deep. I broke truce after truce. Diplomacy was at a permanent zero. My vassals never rebelled. Then, the bastards in Sweden ruined my fun by reforming the faith.
The other pagans, of course, don't have it so easy. Something should be done to make them more fun to play, but not still not OP in the hands of the AI.
One thing that does need to fixed is the Krivichi attacking the Baltic pagans. Polotsk really shouldn't be a part of Lithuania.