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Thread: HOI 3 vs HOI 2

  1. #1
    Corporal Userunknown's Avatar
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    HOI 3 vs HOI 2

    I have no idea where to post this but I guess this might be it, since the HOI3 forum requires me to own it to post (according to it's rules), and I couldn't find if someone already made this post.
    Anyways, I have HOI 2 with the expansions, and was wondering if I should get HOI3. Could anyone tell me what the differences are? What is better or different about it? Should I just continue with HOI2?
    Also, what is with the Expansions? On Steam, Semper Fi is listed as a seperate game, and For the Motherland is listed as a DLC for Semper Fi, and Finest Hour is listed (Sort of) as DLC for For the Motherland (Sort of).
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  2. #2
    Moderator Moderator AndrewT's Avatar
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    You should be able to post in the main HoI3 forum without registering, can you not?
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  3. #3
    Corporal Userunknown's Avatar
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    Didn't try, as the forum rules said:
    Anyone that wants to start a new thread in this forum, must either..

    1) Be a registered HOI3 customer.
    2) Have been a member here for a while already.
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    Moderator Moderator AndrewT's Avatar
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    Well, that is from 3 years ago, and you have been a member for 7 months. Give it a go, hey, I'm sure temperatures have reduced since those early days of HoI3.
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  5. #5
    Lt. General xcrissxcrossx's Avatar
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    HoI 3 has more micromanagement. That's pretty much the most major change. It's also much more beautiful. both are fun, and I'd say you should try HoI 3 if you are interested in a more micro-oriented HoI 2.

  6. #6
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    hoi2>>>hoi3
    hoi3 has so many provinces that you have to rely on ai who sucks hard. i often ragequit playing hoi 3
    hoi2, on the other hand, very refined and fun game
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by xcrissxcrossx View Post
    HoI 3 has more micromanagement. That's pretty much the most major change. It's also much more beautiful. both are fun, and I'd say you should try HoI 3 if you are interested in a more micro-oriented HoI 2.
    if you use Ai controls (I do for most military maneuvering, mostly for RP reasons) I would say that it has less micro management, so it depends on how you want to play.

    My suggestion is to search for some Lets Play videos of HoI3 on youtube. Compared to HoI2, HoI3 is much more of a wargame. More detailed units and smaller provinces (about halfway to a hex based battlefield), so i think if you enjoy the wargame aspect of HoI2 you will like HoI3. It can be a bit daunting to get into because there is just more of everything, but being able to automate parts of your army, diplomacy, trade etc means you can focus on learning one thing at a time. I know that people who get over the initial learning hump never really go back to HoI2 once they get hooked on HoI3.

    As for expansions, they all depend on each other so you need the whole chain to play the latest one (their finest hour). Your best bet would be to get one of the HoI3 collection packs and extend it with Their Finest Hour for best playing experience and bang-for-buck.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thracian View Post
    hoi2>>>hoi3
    hoi3 has so many provinces that you have to rely on ai who sucks hard.
    Learning to play together with the AI takes some practice, the best tip is to be clear to it what you mean. This is best done by splitting theaters so you can assign regions to the AI and oversee how many units it gets etc and dont end up with conflicting goals where you thought it would read your mind. Still there are of course screwups that happen. I kinda like it as it feels more like being the top general where I dont have 100% control over every little thing and focus more on larger operations rather than trying to optimize attack delay to encircle an enemy somewhere. But its totally up to your playstyle what you enjoy here.
    Last edited by podcat; 07-12-2012 at 14:22.
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  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Thracian View Post
    hoi2>>>hoi3
    hoi3 has so many provinces that you have to rely on ai who sucks hard. i often ragequit playing hoi 3
    hoi2, on the other hand, very refined and fun game
    Play FTM - with the latest patch it's reached that polished state you praise in HOI2 (which was not always the polished article it appears now).
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  9. #9
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    Darkest Hour is the best. Builds on Hearts of Iron 2.

    Could never get into HOI3. Was incredibly difficult to get into, and the tutorials are next to useless. I couldn't even figure out how to invade Poland in the tutorial.

  10. #10
    What bums me out about HoI3 (as an owner of HoI2 and having played the 3 demo) is that it did nothing to remove the incredible imbalance between small countries, medium countries and great countries. Berlin and Munchen have a greater IC manpower and leadership than all of Persia (or at least so I presume) and many medium countries that aren't in the epicenter of World War 2. I can't ask for buffing up Albania to Italy's strength but giving appropriate strength to countries that aren't Italy and Germany would really go a long way towards making playing with countries that aren't Germany and Italy a realistic possibility.

  11. #11
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    HoI3 is all about warfare, while HoI2 had a higher focus on state-management, i prefer HoI2.
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by L Lawliet View Post
    What bums me out about HoI3 (as an owner of HoI2 and having played the 3 demo) is that it did nothing to remove the incredible imbalance between small countries, medium countries and great countries. Berlin and Munchen have a greater IC manpower and leadership than all of Persia (or at least so I presume) and many medium countries that aren't in the epicenter of World War 2. I can't ask for buffing up Albania to Italy's strength but giving appropriate strength to countries that aren't Italy and Germany would really go a long way towards making playing with countries that aren't Germany and Italy a realistic possibility.
    that all depends on your perspective, I think. No offense, but I really don't think that, say, Turkey or Belgium could have done in 1940 what Germany did. There is simply no comparison between the British Empire and Bulgaria.
    Fact is that these countries ARE weaker, by their very nature of being small countries. But I played Romania just a couple of days ago and I conquered Hungary, Bulgaria, Austria and yugoslavia by 1938 (I used the noneutrality cheat), making them into a regional power. In other words, to get the most out those small countries, it DOES require abusing/bending/breaking the rules, but it's a game. Having fun is what it is all about, right?

    @ OP:
    pro-HOI3: more provinces means easier to fight a war of maneuver.
    A real OOB with divisions that take orders from corps, who take orders from armies, etc.
    More detailed division building allows you to come up with a solution for every situation.
    Dynamic enemies that don't just sit there and watch Germany conquer the world.
    Since TFH a really hefty Pacifc theater, if you're into naval stuff.

    pro-HOI2: Simpler interface. Much easier to find what you're looking for, like empty airbases or number of divisions you've build.
    If you don't care that the corps meant to attack in the north ends up putting a city in the south under siege, then HOI2 is easier that way.
    More provinces mean more micromanagement when fighting under manual control.
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  13. #13
    that all depends on your perspective, I think. No offense, but I really don't think that, say, Turkey or Belgium could have done in 1940 what Germany did. There is simply no comparison between the British Empire and Bulgaria.
    That's not at all what I meant. What I meant was it didn't make the incredible imbalance credible. It kept the status quo much to the detriment of those who want to try something that isn't Hitlering their way to Vladivostok or Stalining their way to Portugal. In 2, for example, every nation that isn't a part of the majors (or major minors such as Hungary) had a maximum of 10 generals none of which went past level 1 and maybe one mediocre research team. I don't want to even get started about technologies (but I will) with everyone that isn't Germany, Russia and USA having literally next to nothing on airplanes, land doctrines and troop technologies, let alone the IC to build them up. And finally, IC and infrastructure are scandalously expensive in both time and industry. I'm going to pull the numbers out of my ass and say that in HoI2 it would take about a century of game time to bring, say, Persia up to Germany's technological and infrastructural level in 1936 and I could bet my ass on it that it's the same, if not worse in 3.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by L Lawliet View Post
    What bums me out about HoI3 (as an owner of HoI2 and having played the 3 demo) is that it did nothing to remove the incredible imbalance between small countries, medium countries and great countries. Berlin and Munchen have a greater IC manpower and leadership than all of Persia (or at least so I presume) and many medium countries that aren't in the epicenter of World War 2. I can't ask for buffing up Albania to Italy's strength but giving appropriate strength to countries that aren't Italy and Germany would really go a long way towards making playing with countries that aren't Germany and Italy a realistic possibility.
    Quote Originally Posted by L Lawliet View Post
    That's not at all what I meant. What I meant was it didn't make the incredible imbalance credible. It kept the status quo much to the detriment of those who want to try something that isn't Hitlering their way to Vladivostok or Stalining their way to Portugal. In 2, for example, every nation that isn't a part of the majors (or major minors such as Hungary) had a maximum of 10 generals none of which went past level 1 and maybe one mediocre research team. I don't want to even get started about technologies (but I will) with everyone that isn't Germany, Russia and USA having literally next to nothing on airplanes, land doctrines and troop technologies, let alone the IC to build them up. And finally, IC and infrastructure are scandalously expensive in both time and industry. I'm going to pull the numbers out of my ass and say that in HoI2 it would take about a century of game time to bring, say, Persia up to Germany's technological and infrastructural level in 1936 and I could bet my ass on it that it's the same, if not worse in 3.
    Well, first of all, Persia had ~12mil population(at least that is what wiki graph about Iran population in 1930s sugests), while Berlin alone had 4.8 millions.
    Considering the economy of scale, and the fact that the majortity of persian population were occupied growing food(that would me my assumption, feel free to prove me wrong) it is not nearly unreasonable to assume that Berline alone had more scientists, and industrial capacity than Persia as a whole.

    Also, considering statistic of German invasion to Poland(1.6 germans per pole), France(1:1), and Barbarossa,(1.3 Axis soldier per 1Soviet in the opening stage of Barbarossa) and consecutive Soviet offencives in 43-45, you need a global numerical superiority of roughtly ~1.3 or more to uterly crush the opposition thrugh consentrating your superiour part of forces.

    It is true that you can develop your country much faster by importing foreign equipment and technologies(see Japn and Meigi restoration, USSR and industrialisation in 30s), and later in cold war, China, Taiwan, and such.
    But that is not developing them from scratch by any means.

    Now, considering that most of industrial nations will be occupied by their own economical&military expancion, not a lot countries would be willing to trade their equipment(Well exept for UK, German and US export to USSR in 30s, but SU had a lot of natural resourses and agriculture to trade), and the price could be prohibitive for smaller nations.

  15. #15
    Field Marshal TheBromgrev's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by L Lawliet View Post
    What bums me out about HoI3 (as an owner of HoI2 and having played the 3 demo) is that it did nothing to remove the incredible imbalance between small countries, medium countries and great countries.
    Play Victoria 2 and you'll understand why the imbalances are there and why they make sense.
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  16. #16
    Hey devs, not everybody complaints about micromanagement. What I loved about HOI3 was precisely this. A lot of micromanaging your troops, just like you said, almost like a wargame.

    I loved to re-organize all my troops in Theaters, Army Groups, Armies, Corps. And I loved all the care you have to put in this and in the battles. Much more realistic.

    Just in case when you make HOI4... don't come back to a less complicated game. There are some of us (I bet a lot of us) who liked the path you took and wouldn' t come back to HOI2.

  17. #17
    Field Marshal misterbean's Avatar
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    I tried a while back. It just wouldn't work for me anymore.
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  18. #18
    HoI3 is IMO strictly better in almost every meaningful way.
    The only thing I miss is the expanded timeline available in Arma/DH.

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