A.I. Muslims

[ywhtptgtfo]

For those of you who played D&T 5.xx and D&T 7.xx/8.xx, what's your opinion on the relative strengths of the A.I. Muslims? Do you think there's a big difference? Which setup do you prefer?

As I've said in other threads, I consider the Muslims in 5.xx to be far more powerful than the Muslims in later versions. Do you think A.I. Muslims need to be tweaked to be more threatening? If so, what are some of the possible ideas that can be considered?

Note: This is a casual discussion thread. It is not necessarily a feature request. If certain parties disagree with the ideas, please ignore this thread and refrain from launching a tirade and say "End of Discussion". Thanks.

[cacra]

I think the Ottomans in particular should be more powerful especially into the middle of the 16th century. After all it took most of central eurpe and spain to defeat them. But apart from them I don't think the rest of the muslim world really needs to be more powerful.

[ywhtptgtfo]

I think the Ottomans in particular should be more powerful especially into the middle of the 16th century. After all it took most of central eurpe and spain to defeat them. But apart from them I don't think the rest of the muslim world really needs to be more powerful.

I say the Mamluks and the dominant Ilkhanate successor state should be stronger.

[cacra]

The mamluks were getting pushed around by the ottomans by the 16th century but before that they were fairly equal. And I couldnt comment on the persian region, I really dont know much about it.

[ywhtptgtfo]

What happens in the 16th century is not that important anyway, since the issue is that both are pretty weak even in the 1400's (during game).

[birdboy2000]

Depends on when you start. Playing from 1356 they're way too weak. Playing from 1453 they do fine.

But yeah, most games are from 1356, and there the Ottomans need beefing up if they're ever going to be more than another Anatolian beylik. (I haven't played in long enough that I don't want to make comparisons, though.) Russia rolled over the hordes and into Persia/Afghanistan too easily, too, but that's more lopsided tech than anything.

[ywhtptgtfo]

Depends on when you start. Playing from 1356 they're way too weak. Playing from 1453 they do fine.

But yeah, most games are from 1356, and there the Ottomans need beefing up if they're ever going to be more than another Anatolian beylik. (I haven't played in long enough that I don't want to make comparisons, though.) Russia rolled over the hordes and into Persia/Afghanistan too easily, too, but that's more lopsided tech than anything.

Russia usually gets beaten into a pulp by Lithuania.

[birdboy2000]

Does Lithuania also roll over the hordes and start causing problems for Persia? I've only played one recent 1356 game, where the two partitioned them but then Russia turned and beat Lithuania.

[ywhtptgtfo]

Does Lithuania also roll over the hordes and start causing problems for Persia? I've only played one recent 1356 game, where the two partitioned them but then Russia turned and beat Lithuania.

Muscovy usually gets beaten into a pulp by TGH and/or Lithuania. Usually, the only thing that can destroy Lithuania is a war with Austria or an emperor Blobhemia.

Persia usually gets conquered by the Ilkhanate successor.

[cacra]

I've never seen that happen, in my games Muscovy or Novogrod either dominate each other or end up in status quo. Although once I did see Brandenburg touch the North pacific. However I am going to change my opinion i think in the earlier game the muslim nations should be beefed up. Not only would it arguably be more historically accurate it would represent the struggles between east and west and could possibly lead to parts of Europe being conquered by the muslims which imo was not entirely out of the realm of possibility.

[moldeh]

I just had the Ottomans conquer themselves a pretty nice empire, keeping up in tech with Austria and France. In any case, having them in the same culture group as the greeks is probably not helping them. There's only a handful of greek provinces, while the number of arab provinces is far greater. If they don't time things properly, they end up not accepting the mashriqis and sometimes not even the egyptians (because they often don't conquer egypt proper) and the bedouins never gain accepted status. They also don't get cores from PUs. Pretty massive nerf right there. They do have the azeris in their culture group now, but that's pretty inconsequential, since they never conquer any of their stuff. Still, they're doing ok-ish. As for the other Muslims, it's not as easy for them (crappy tech and not as many free cores and stuff).

[Sybreal]

I think there should be an optional mode where the muslim AIs are out to get Christian Europe. Just to see what happens.