New possible Countries to realise and to form

[lukew]

After reading the topic, imho the best solution would be to make a mod for D&T, More nations D&T for example. Not just asking Luke to add more(i'm sure he got other "to-do" list), so people who wants it could download/install and play

That would be best. I have other stuff to focus on, but if you made a mini-mod then I'd be happy to add my favourite formables to the base D&T.

[Faeelin]

The HRE was basically a unification of the Kingdom of Italy and the Kingdom of Germany, plus some other neighboring areas. Any unified HRE would at least have a legitimate claim to Germany and Italy. On the other hand, neither of those two states could exist independently without the Emperor (whether willing or not) agreeing to it. This is one of the main reasons that neither Italy nor Germany formed during this period.

I think viewing them as not "forming" is a bit misleading, since the 12th century empire was easily as centralized as, say, France.

But things change; by the 16th and 17th centuries the Empire was really a German affair, as reflected in the makeup of its Diet and judiciary.

[Dafool]

I think viewing them as not "forming" is a bit misleading, since the 12th century empire was easily as centralized as, say, France.

But things change; by the 16th and 17th centuries the Empire was really a German affair, as reflected in the makeup of its Diet and judiciary.

It's really only after the 30 Years' War that the HRE is reduced mainly to its German areas, but this has more to do with the political outcome of the war than any inherently German nature of the Empire.

[Faeelin]

It's really only after the 30 Years' War that the HRE is reduced mainly to its German areas, but this has more to do with the political outcome of the war than any inherently German nature of the Empire.

How many Italians were at the Council of Worms or Diet of Augsburg in the 16th century?

[Dafool]

How many Italians were at the Council of Worms or Diet of Augsburg in the 16th century?

Once again, that's a political and religious point rather than a cultural one. The Catholic Church held much stronger sway in Italy than in Germany, thus far fewer Italians would have been able to embrace Protestantism without fear of extreme persecution. There was a lot less to worry about there. In Germany this wasn't the case. Ever since the Investiture Controversy, Germany had always had a shaking relationship with the Papacy and that, combined with the geographic distance, made it much harder for the Church to directly intervene. Hence the Reformation hits much harder there. The result is that the Emperor was forced to deal with the religiously rebellious German princes himself. This is why it was mainly Germans involved in the HRE's religious controversies of the day.

[Faeelin]

If you want another example, look at how was using the imperial courts, or who paid the the Gemeiner Pfennig. Or note that there was no imperial circle for Italy.

The actual reforms we have in game apply only to Germany.

[Dafool]

If you want another example, look at how was using the imperial courts, or who paid the the Gemeiner Pfennig. Or note that there was no imperial circle for Italy.

The actual reforms we have in game apply only to Germany.

Once more, political differences come into play more than anything else with those examples. The Imperial Circles did include some parts of Italy. Other parts of northern Italy were indeed absent though. But that doesn't have much to do with Italy itself. Switzerland, Bohemia, and Silesia were also absent. So why was part of northern Italy absent? Well, because making it an Imperial Circle would have subjected it to Imperial laws regarding defense and taxation. The Habsburgs were initially unwilling to subject even their own lands to these laws, which is why the Burgundian Lands and Austria only became Circles later on. At the time when they were created though, France was occupying much of northern Italy based on dynastic claims. France owning land within the nominal HRE was undesired, but not inherently problematic. On the other hand, the Emperor dictating the taxation and defense of French held lands would have caused a lot of friction and might have sped up the rate at which Italy was separating from the HRE. The Circles, Imperial Court, and Gemeiner Pfennig were all part of the same type of system, so using them as individual examples is rather pointless. The ultimate truth is that Italy wasn't considered a distinct part of the Empire due to its culture, but instead due to the political makeup of the Empire.

[SirWitan]

I really think there are missing a lot of possible countries.

So it is possible to form Assyria, but Kurdistan or a coptic Eagypt is missing totaly...

Also there are missing possible countries in north africa...

[Jango40]

I feel that there should be 1 or 2 zoroastrian provinces around persia. That religion was still quite strong in 1100, and the game starts just about 200 years later.

[SirWitan]

I know, but also i dont understand why they dont change it... how i said also orthodox religion was quite more in this time

[twcAxeman]

Perhaps Livonia?

Formable by Kurland or Riga or via unique decision by the Livonian Order? * Similar to how Prussia can be formed by the Teutonic Order* ?

[justin6477]

Perhaps Livonia?

Formable by Kurland or Riga or via unique decision by the Livonian Order? * Similar to how Prussia can be formed by the Teutonic Order* ?

There is a Livonia. However, it can't be formed by the Livonian Order. You need to be Baltic, so it's limited to Kurland and Latvia.

If Sun Wu decides to make a new Germanic culture for Riga and the L.O., it stands to reason that they could reform and form it post-reformation. It also needs a less awful color.

[Jango40]

I feel that there should be 1 or 2 zoroastrian provinces around persia. That religion was still quite strong in 1100, and the game starts just about 200 years later.

If this was added, though, I wonder if the pagan group would be appropriate for this...

EDIT: Well, I could add some new religions and perhaps nations myself and then release this here as a mod for D&T, but I don't have any idea on how to add religion icons. Tutorial pls?

[SirWitan]

EDIT: Well, I could add some new religions and perhaps nations myself and then release this here as a mod for D&T

That would be very nice