Most challenging country to play?

[homy_dog34]

Well, I've been looking for a challenging country to play recently.

So far, I think the the hardest nation to play as is Epirus, considering that Every. Single. Game. I am annexed by Naples within a year.

Do you guys think any other nations are more challenging? If so, please explain, because I'm pretty sure Epirus is the epitome of futility.

[brifbates]

Well, I've been looking for a challenging country to play recently.

So far, I think the the hardest nation to play as is Epirus, considering that Every. Single. Game. I am annexed by Naples within a year.

Do you guys think any other nations are more challenging? If so, please explain, because I'm pretty sure Epirus is the epitome of futility.

There are a number of OPM nations that are regularly subject to day 1 DoWs like Epirus. Some of those are in worse positions due to lacking forts. As Epirus your best hope is that France quickly DoWs Provence dragging Naples in due to the PU. Once that happens you should be able to get some sort of peace agreement with them.

Other fairly hopeless nations include Pskov, Yaroslav'l, Chimu, and Bar...

Among European non-OPMs I would say Ryazan is probably the most hopeless. Obviously sub-Saharan and American natives have major survivability issues as well.

[Slym]

If we go into non-1399 starts, I believe that Smolensk in 1404 or something like that is probably the hardest.

2 Provinces.

Starts at war with the GH.

One of those provinces doesn't have a fort.

GH will not accept tribute.

[sprites]

try Arakan or Maldives , too
I'm not sure they start with a fort and Arakan is bound to get at least one DoW .
Or 1453 Serbia , good luck against the ottomans!

[ZZMitch]

There are a number of OPM nations that are regularly subject to day 1 DoWs like Epirus. Some of those are in worse positions due to lacking forts. As Epirus your best hope is that France quickly DoWs Provence dragging Naples in due to the PU. Once that happens you should be able to get some sort of peace agreement with them.

Other fairly hopeless nations include Pskov, Yaroslav'l, Chimu, and Bar...

Among European non-OPMs I would say Ryazan is probably the most hopeless. Obviously sub-Saharan and American natives have major survivability issues as well.

Pskov isn't that bad, I did a playthrough with them recently. I did have some luck though and was able to capture Novgorod pretty early when Novogord (the nation) got stuck in a war with the Teutonic Order and Sweden. They may be easier on Death and Taxes, that is all I play these days. Have not played the other ones before though.

[Junuxx]

Placing my bets on Arakan.

[homy_dog34]

Seems like Arakan is a popular choice. I'll play a quick game, and post the results here.

[Junuxx]

Well if you put it that way... Playing a quick game is pretty easy with Arakan.

[n0thin]

Well if you put it that way... Playing a quick game is pretty easy with Arakan.

Well, Bar is also not that bad. Burgundy has a load of missions and won't declare war on you first every time. And if you manage to survive, your sliders are incredible awesome for building up a trade empire similar to what you do with Holland or Navarra. Pskov is somewhat similar, it has quite good trade sliders iirc.
Maldives is also not that bad, since no one will declare war on you. You have a lot of time till you are finally troubled by outsiders.

Arakan and Chimu on the other hand are just incredible. You always get early DoWs as Arakan and you don't have a fort. And with Chimu the problem is basically: If you manage to survive and overcome the Incas then you are in the same or even a worse position then the Incas are usually. Which may be manageable but still really sucks. If you overcome Burgundy as Bar on the other hand, your position is pretty awesome.

[homy_dog34]

Alright, I tried to play as Arakan, and here are the results:

Attempt 1: Annexed soon after DoW's from Pegu and Taungu.
Attempt 2: Same as above.
Attempt 3: Same as above.
Attempt 4: Same as above.
Attempt 5: Only attacked by Taungu, and occupied a couple provinces. Would not accept a peace offer, though. Army was killed. Annexed.
Attempt 6: Same as the first.
Attempt 7: Attacked by Taungu. They spammed troops, and slaughtered me.
Attempt 8: Same as the first.
Attempt 9: Same as the first.
Attempt 10: Attacked by Taungu. Occupied 3 of their 5 provinces(4 have no forts). But, lost army. Annexed.
Attempt 11: Same as the first.

Before I go into attempt 12, let's go over my strategy for every single attempt I made.
Step 1. Buy 3 division of infantry mercenaries.
Step 2. Send an alliance offer to Malacca.
Step 3. Change ruler to a leader. Make him general of my 1000 infantry army.
Step 4. Unpause the game. This is where things split into 2 different paths.
*Malacca always accepted the alliance offer.
4a. Pegu and Taungu both attack me. I am annexed shortly after.

4b. Only Taungu attacks. I try and somehow find a way to beat them.

Anyways, on to attempt 12:

Taungu attacks me, Pegu leaves me alone.
They start to move towards my province, but stop once I get all 4 of my mercs completed.
I send my entire army into the province they own immediately to the northeast.
I occupy that, and the province behind it as well. Then, I try to get peace, since their army is incoming towards me.

This is what happens next:


I am shocked right now, but I continue playing.
After that, I wait around for a while, using my magistrates to build up my cultural tradition. Once I have 100%-ish tradition, I recruit a Master of Mint. I don't bring him to my court, I just let him go, turning in a profit of around 15 ducats.
Eventually, someone else puts their eye on me.


I somehow manage to take over one of their forts while my ally Bengal destroys their army in a ping-pong game.
I then concede defeat. I had to get out while I still could.

Soon after that, I get enough money to build a fort in Arakan, my capital. I hoped that I would eventually build another in my other province as well.
That's when I got this event.

+100 ducats, straight to the treasury. Am I good, or what?

After that, I build the second fort. Then, I use my allies in Brunei and Malacca to attack the nations around me with the alliance casus belli.
After a little while, my position looks like this:
I have 3 provinces, and 4 vassals. Things are looking up!


For some reason I can't really turn a yearly profit, but that's what advisers are for, right?
Anyways, I don't know if I'll keep playing this. It's a real struggle, lemme tell you.
Fun, but a struggle.

[Ashantai]

I think that Chimu or Kongo are some of the hardest nations to play. They have literally nothing going for them.

[PiriReis]

Oo Thats very mediocre. What about Granada, Chimu, Ryzan

[homy_dog34]

Oo Thats very mediocre. What about Granada, Chimu, Ryzan

Well, Ryazan and Chimu are naturally very tough.

As for Granada, having a higher tech, and with VERY careful management, a success can be achieved.

[magritte2]

I just played a hands-off game where the A.I. Pskov was almost as large as the empire posted by ZZMitch...well, half the size anyway.

[Slym]

The difference is that that Pskov probably got annexed by someone who couldn't deal with the rebels then the rebels rampaged across all of Russia. Pretty much any Russian minor can and will do that all the time.

[midget_roxx]

Ryuku or Granada

[Falahk]

Umbrino is probably still silly hard

[ulgurstasta]

Jalayirids is my current pet project, 1399 start date, you start the game at war with the Timurids, half your provinces are wrong religion, your state culture is Mongolian and your located right in the middle-east surrounded by The Mameluks to the west, Ottomans to the north and the Timurids to the east.

It's hard but doable. Had one game where I was so close to conquer Inca and start up a Mongolian South America but, alas regency council then Spain swoops in

Edit: And you're tribal too

[brifbates]

The difference is that that Pskov probably got annexed by someone who couldn't deal with the rebels then the rebels rampaged across all of Russia. Pretty much any Russian minor can and will do that all the time.

Aye, I had one game where the dark blue blob in Scandinavia was Murom, who revolted with most of Novgorod then went on a conquest spree...

[Swistaczek]

try Arakan or Maldives , too
I'm not sure they start with a fort and Arakan is bound to get at least one DoW .
Or 1453 Serbia , good luck against the ottomans!

Maldives are easy country, nobody will DoW you since you are far away and poor, the only problem is it is hard to expand.

But it's possible.
If we talk about 1399 start only, I vote for Arakan, Chimu,Benin, Eprius,Georgia (Not OPM but between 3 hordes, extermaly hard situation).
Homy_dog, nice job with this Arakan, it seems like it is possible to do something with every country.

Also Albania at 1453 is fun, you start at war with Ottomans but can concede defeat easy, after that you have 5 years to ran away from there beacuse they WILL DoW you.

There is also some India minors to try, I dont remember all names. There is small OPM between Delhi and Deccan, there is also Kashmir - 2pm with Timurdis near them.