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Thread: Ambitions and becoming more populist

  1. #1
    First Lieutenant Parzival2211's Avatar
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    Ambitions and becoming more populist

    I read in the Republics guide, that you can stop unemployed characters who want a certain title losing loyalty and gaining populist conviction by just giving them a minor title. After doing that, though, they still have that empty "job box" in their character window and the tool tip still says that they keep losing loyalty and gaining populist conviction.

    Could anyone clarify this, please?

    After thoroughly going thru the forum today and checking the game again:
    Unless I give a proper job to a character, he would always gain 0,05 populist conviction a month and lose 0,6% loyalty per month. Minor titles only give 5 points prominence, but that is all. That is not what I found in the forum, though. Could this be a change introduced with the 2.36 patch?

    No answers yet? Cheexsta to the rescue, please.
    Last edited by Parzival2211; 04-07-2012 at 16:21.

  2. #2
    First Lieutenant Parzival2211's Avatar
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    I found out something else. In my unpatched copy of EU Rome, populist conviction increases by 0,25 per month - in the 2.36 version, it's only 0,05. Maybe as a balancing measure, PI made it harder to prevent this small increase - maybe by making minor titles ineffective in this regard. Just a theory... still looking for help.

  3. #3
    Veni, vidi, vici Cheexsta's Avatar
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    I've tried to recreate this issue with the latest beta patch but can't - minor titles still cancel out the "Wants a Title" penalty for me. Is there a specific minor title you're trying, and which job(s) does your character want?
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    First Lieutenant Parzival2211's Avatar
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    In the first part of my OP I was wrong. The empty box does disappear when I give the character a minor title.

    But when I click the portrait and the more detailed character window opens, I still get the tool tip (gains populist conviction by 0,05 and loses loyalty by 0,1) when I hover the mouse over the section of the character window where the titles are normally shown.

    Not sure whether the loyalty loss is only for characters that don't belong to the consul's faction.

    I didn't notice a difference regarding the minor titles I gave or the job the character wanted.

    Thank you, Cheexsta.

  5. #5
    Veni, vidi, vici Cheexsta's Avatar
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    If you open the character browser, hover your cursor over the character's loyalty value. The resulting tooltip will tell you exactly which modifiers are affecting his loyalty. What does it say?
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    First Lieutenant Parzival2211's Avatar
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    Thank you, Cheexsta. Again a very helpful tip (you should be added to the Roman Pantheon!).

    Once I give characters a minor title, it doesn't show the 0,1 loyalty loss anymore when you hover the mouse over the loyalty value in the portrait window.
    If you hover the mouse over box in the portrait window where minor title icons are displayed, it still shows the loyalty loss of 0,1 and populist conviction gain of 0,05 gain (unless you give the character a job). This may be a bug, since the two things shown differ.
    Last edited by Parzival2211; 14-07-2012 at 12:02.

  7. #7
    First Lieutenant Parzival2211's Avatar
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    By the way: It's shocking what a huge negative loyalty effect cohorts loyal to a character have: One of my best generals had 10 loyal cohorts > the effect was 1,5 % loyalty loss per month > 18 % a year! After 3 years, he had become a real threat. I sent him barbarians hunting with a unit of velites. But this lucky devil has not been attacked yet.

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    Second Lieutenant fmurciap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Parzival2211 View Post
    By the way: It's shocking what a huge negative loyalty effect cohorts loyal to a character have: One of my best generals had 10 loyal cohorts > the effect was 1,5 % loyalty loss per month > 18 % a year! After 3 years, he had become a real threat. I sent him barbarians hunting with a unit of velites. But this lucky devil has not been attacked yet.
    And even then, you have no guarantee of him attaining a hero's death. He could well come back unscathed. Better to let him obtain a glorious (or easy, it's just the same) victory, give him a triumph, and with his 50% boost in loyalty, you can dismiss him. You could also give him command of a big fleet. Ships don't get loyal so easy, specially as there are not so many naval battles, and commanding non loyal units will boost his loyalty.

  9. #9
    First Lieutenant Parzival2211's Avatar
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    You are right. The velites died, he was back in the pool. Good thing: I wasn't the only one who wanted to see him dead. A rival murdered him :-P

  10. #10
    Veni, vidi, vici Cheexsta's Avatar
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    And therein lies the danger of loyal units. It gives a nice bonus to Discipline (and thus the units are better at killing the enemy), but the character loyalty penalty is a pain.

    The best way I've found to deal with it is to make sure that characters don't have permanent positions as generals, and create armies composed entirely of cohorts loyal to different characters if possible. Also, characters with high Charisma are more likely to gain loyal cohorts, so if you have a charismatic general it's often an idea to make him lead one of those armies. Troops won't gain loyalty if they're already loyal to a particular character.

    One other tip: instead of giving a good general a big army, split that army into two unequal parts. Make the smaller half consist of cohorts already with loyalties, if possible. Grant the smaller army to your good general, so he leads the battles with his Martial skill but won't gain any loyal cohorts; grant the larger army to someone else (preferably your ruler if you have a monarchy or tribe, or a character with low Charisma for republics), so that if the troops become loyal to anyone then at least it isn't towards your good general. This is also a great way to gain loyal troops for your ruler if you have a mission to gain them.

    Hope that helps.
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  11. #11
    First Lieutenant Parzival2211's Avatar
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    Thank you for the tips again. Highly appreciated.

    If there was a rep button here, you would have got plenty of it from me...

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