+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 31

Thread: North Africa Campaign and Infrastructure Help

  1. #1

    Question North Africa Campaign and Infrastructure Help

    Hello,

    I was hoping some of you could provide some advice in how to wage the North African campaign as the Axis or Allies. As far as I've read, logistics should be a huge issue in Africa. And while the infrastructure is low, in the games I've played supplies have rarely been an issue. I tried holding as the UK with a "modest" 12 divisions but was quickly crushed as he deployed a good 30 divisions. Only after I deployed more of the British Army was the front restored. He had improved Libya's infrastructure a bit (perhaps 10-20%) but it was still rather bad.

    I read on the forums that 5 divisions should be enough for North Africa. What tactics/strategies (units to moves) in that theatre? I tried making lighter armour units with 1 M Armour, 1 MOT 1 SP ART to reduce logistical difficulties but it wasnt needed it appears...

    Linked to the 1st question, how important is infrastructure? I've generally awarded it a high value, trying to make "highways" through Poland or China when I play major Axis powers. Does it make sense for a British player to improve Africa or East Asia? Should a Japanese player work on improving infrastructure? (especially when I'm trying to move through China to India?)

  2. #2
    BLACK I.C.E panzeroo's Avatar
    Crusader Kings IIDarkest HourEU3 CompleteFor the MotherlandHearts of Iron III
    HOI3: Their Finest HourHeir to the ThroneRome GoldSemper FiRome: Vae Victis
    Mount & Blade: Warband500k clubEuropa Universalis IV: Pre-order

    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    A Mountain top, outside Sydney, Australia
    Posts
    10,886
    The easiest way to win in North africa is to control the sea lanes. Use the Royal navy to cut the convoy routes and the axis forces will be starved of supplies very quickly.
    BLACK ICE FTM Mk VI ~ Based on Didays ICE
    NOW WITH 80 UNIQUE UNITS ADDED, OVER 80 NEW TECHS AND HUNDREDS OF NEW EVENTS


    BLACK I.C.E TFH Mk VII - A HOI3 Total Overhaul
    Now with 114 unique units added, over 100 new techs and hundreds of new events


  3. #3
    I have found that, as Germany, improving infrastructure (against an AI opponent) is very overrated. I tend to improve it a bit in Poland prior to the invasion of the USSR but rarely improve it as I move into the USSR. I advance faster than it can build and make a meaningful difference. I have tried to infrastructure improvement in China as Japan and it wasn't worth it. It took too much IC away from building other things (carriers). It was a better investment to build an army of CAV x2 divisions to operate in low infrastructure areas. I don't play Japan much though so others may have better advice in regards to them. I have never tried building infrastructure in North Africa as Britain or Italy. I am not sure it would be needed. If you control the sea lanes, as has been mentioned, then building more infrastructure in North Africa seems to be a case of 'winning more' rather than something that helps you win. If you don't control the sea lanes then better roads are not going to help you much.

    I suspect it all changes when you play human players but I rarely do that.

  4. #4
    I agree with Gpeterse. I do not improve infrastructure at all unless I have nowhere else use my IC. I actually prefer to see bad infrastructure for historical reasons.

  5. #5
    OK thanks for the advice.

    In one game as the USSR I tried making infrastructure a good deal behind my lines (say Moscow to Smolensk). I planned to hold much more Westwards... Does the USSR ever have logistics issues?

  6. #6
    I have never had them as the USSR in the USSR but I am sure it is possible.

  7. #7
    I read somewhere that owners of provinces have better throughoutput. So the Soviets suffer much less problems in Russia than Germans all thing equal.

  8. #8
    General
    For the MotherlandHearts of Iron IIIHOI3: Their Finest HourSemper FiEuropa Universalis IV
    EUIV: Wealth of NationsEUIV: Conquest of ParadiseEUIV: Res Publica

    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    SE Arizona, USA
    Posts
    2,297
    IMO the only places to build infrastructure are at major air and naval bases. The higher the infra the faster those bases will allow your units to regain org and strength. This is of particular importance to USA and JAP island bases. Other than that I long ago abondoned building infra anywhere else (unless of course I'm bored and have IC to burn!).

  9. #9
    Field Marshal CplKatie's Avatar
    Crusader Kings IIHearts of Iron IIISemper Fi500k club

    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Tokyo
    Posts
    3,839
    Africa can be taken out with 10 divisions or 2 corps. Control the med. Prevent reinforcements from arriving, and split the theatre in half, send 10 in from casablanca, and 10 in from el esk. The AI will ping pong half their forces between the fronts or focus on only one, and even then all you have to do is dig in with your 10 on the strong side and then steamroll the garrisons on the other side.

    Infrastructure upgrading is by far the worst supply strategy I have ever heard mentioned in these forums. It takes too long, it doesen't move with your lines, and it actually doesn't improve the problems, it only increases everything involved. Revoltrisk and transfer costs are % based. Infrastructure is simply raising your throughput. That is like making more money but taking more income tax. The real trick is to find a way to avoid the taxes....Air bridging. You take a hit on fuel, but between allied nations supply networks and a few less tanks, you should do just fine for fuel. Air bridging was made significantly easier with the airbases being faster to build too. Just keep the air bridges stored in deployment and wait for a need to lay down a new line of air bridging.

  10. #10
    you can hold N. Africa as the UK if you build a land fort (about level 3) at El Alamein. This
    fort is difficult to bypass due to the level 1 infrastructure to the South (as was in real life).
    Generally as the UK I have 3 Armored 2 Mot and 4-6 Inf div with aircraft (fighters and Tac).
    Be careful as i have known the IT AI to do some invasions behind your lines so keep a few
    GAR blocking ports behind your lines

    For the Axis if you want an Africa Korps prewar move a couple DDs and 3 transports into the
    med prewar and park them up near the top of the Italian boot. Then when the war starts
    you can move a small number of units (your DAK) down and hopefully shift them across to
    NA without getting nailed by the RN.

  11. #11
    General
    For the MotherlandHearts of Iron IIIHOI3: Their Finest HourSemper FiEuropa Universalis IV
    EUIV: Wealth of NationsEUIV: Conquest of ParadiseEUIV: Res Publica

    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    SE Arizona, USA
    Posts
    2,297
    Quote Originally Posted by plasticpanzers View Post
    you can hold N. Africa as the UK if you build a land fort (about level 3) at El Alamein. This
    fort is difficult to bypass due to the level 1 infrastructure to the South (as was in real life).
    Generally as the UK I have 3 Armored 2 Mot and 4-6 Inf div with aircraft (fighters and Tac).
    Be careful as i have known the IT AI to do some invasions behind your lines so keep a few
    GAR blocking ports behind your lines

    For the Axis if you want an Africa Korps prewar move a couple DDs and 3 transports into the
    med prewar and park them up near the top of the Italian boot. Then when the war starts
    you can move a small number of units (your DAK) down and hopefully shift them across to
    NA without getting nailed by the RN.
    For the Allies: never give your enemy the initiative, nor let them anywhere near Alexandria. Use naval and air to stop Italy from ever reinforcing. CplKaties ground force mix is really good.

    For the Axis: place the Afrika Korps in N. Africa BEFORE the start of hostilities. Leave them away from the border and one province inland so the AI has less chance to see it. Move them into position just before you call Italy to arms, then rush Alexandria. The UK won't know what hit it.

  12. #12
    true but the AI is easy to beat at times. i like to drag out the war more! LOL!

  13. #13
    General
    For the MotherlandHearts of Iron IIIHOI3: Their Finest HourSemper FiEuropa Universalis IV
    EUIV: Wealth of NationsEUIV: Conquest of ParadiseEUIV: Res Publica

    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    SE Arizona, USA
    Posts
    2,297
    Quote Originally Posted by plasticpanzers View Post
    true but the AI is easy to beat at times. i like to drag out the war more! LOL!
    Not everyone likes playing with their food before eating it

  14. #14
    "insert Renfew's laugh from orignial Dracula movie"

  15. #15
    General Big Nev's Avatar
    Hearts of Iron III Collection

    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Tellus, Sol III, Mutter's Spiral
    Posts
    2,039
    Quote Originally Posted by plasticpanzers View Post
    you can hold N. Africa as the UK if you build a land fort (about level 3) at El Alamein. This
    fort is difficult to bypass due to the level 1 infrastructure to the South (as was in real life).
    Generally as the UK I have 3 Armored 2 Mot and 4-6 Inf div with aircraft (fighters and Tac).
    Be careful as i have known the IT AI to do some invasions behind your lines so keep a few
    GAR blocking ports behind your lines.
    As Allies, you won’t need a fort at El Alamein & I certainly wouldn’t build one for the Axis to capture. Let them have the province and attack what they put there from the two provinces closer to Alexandria. I use infantry, some artillery, a couple of TD bgds & a little air support. They don’t stand a chance. Once you get them to retreat, run them over with LARM.

    One LARM division on the beach & one inland. Mobility is key and the speed that LARM moves at, once your infantry gets the enemy retreating it’s like PAC-Man all the way to Benghazi. Your infantry will barely be able to keep up. If you’ve got control of the Med’ & can keep your troops supplied by switching to their closest port you won’t have to stop until you reach the Atlantic. Bypass any strongholds & let your infantry deal with them by storm or starvation.

    Build infrastructure?

    I think CplKatie is dead right. By the time it’s finished, you’ve moved on.

    As Japan, it’s utterly pointless in either China, India or IMHO anywhere else. By the time you’re going through India your fleet should control the Indian Ocean and have sunk the French, the Dutch & half of the RN. Take the ports & islands to deny what’s left any bases. Once you control West Africa & Madagascar it’s simply too far for them to interfere & you can ship troops & supplies wherever you want.

    I’ve not played as the USSR, but from history, their scorched earth policy worked for them so I really don’t think building motorways for the Germans quite fits in with this policy.
    “You should not have any special fondness for a particular weapon, or anything else, for that matter. Too much is the same as not enough. Without imitating anyone else, you should have as much weaponry as suits you.”

    "It is a sin to carry a weapon in to battle & not use it."

    Miyamoto Musashi

    "I don't understand! Where's the tea?"

    Arthur P. Dent

  16. #16
    Field Marshal CplKatie's Avatar
    Crusader Kings IIHearts of Iron IIISemper Fi500k club

    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Tokyo
    Posts
    3,839
    Quote Originally Posted by Big Nev View Post
    I’ve not played as the USSR, but from history, their scorched earth policy worked for them so I really don’t think building motorways for the Germans quite fits in with this policy.
    History lessons aside. Transfer costs are % based taxes on the supply being transferred. There is a point on any supply pipeline where the supply stops providing 100% supply. The further into russia you go the less % of the transfer is for the troops and more is just to cover the transfer costs. Airbridging is the only way to reduce transfer costs at the cost of fuel. Yeah...it'll hurt the panzer general's feelings in this game, but hey...war is war right? Conquer russia with some horses...embarass em

  17. #17
    General Big Nev's Avatar
    Hearts of Iron III Collection

    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Tellus, Sol III, Mutter's Spiral
    Posts
    2,039
    Isn’t the point where a supply pipeline stops providing 100% the next province?

    Air bridge. The only way to keep troops fed a long way from a port or your borders.

    And capture some oil fields & a refinery so you can keep your aircraft flying.
    “You should not have any special fondness for a particular weapon, or anything else, for that matter. Too much is the same as not enough. Without imitating anyone else, you should have as much weaponry as suits you.”

    "It is a sin to carry a weapon in to battle & not use it."

    Miyamoto Musashi

    "I don't understand! Where's the tea?"

    Arthur P. Dent

  18. #18
    Field Marshal CplKatie's Avatar
    Crusader Kings IIHearts of Iron IIISemper Fi500k club

    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Tokyo
    Posts
    3,839
    Quote Originally Posted by Big Nev View Post
    Isn’t the point where a supply pipeline stops providing 100% the next province?

    Air bridge. The only way to keep troops fed a long way from a port or your borders.

    And capture some oil fields & a refinery so you can keep your aircraft flying.
    I think you are thinking backwards on the supply. Units do not order supplies. They simply modify the province they sit in. They modify the required daily supply value. The provinces then speak to each other from the point of demand(units or a shipping out port) all the way back to the landmass stockpile. Every Time a request is made it adds in a transfer cost for each province its demanding to. Then that next province sends a demand plus a new transfer cost, and so on and so on. Once the throughput is maxed, then the 100% supply per day starts to drop.

  19. #19
    I do my UK strategy long term so only plan on long term goals. N. Africa is a holding action
    unless I can put enough troops there early. I never send a force to France in 1940. I want
    to keep the Italians busy in N. Africa and later on when the US comes in land behind them
    after slowing grinding down the Italian Navy and take Tripoli. I rotate troops in and out of
    N. Africa to give them all combat training. El Alamein is simply the block I use to keep the
    Italians at arms length if i am too short of troops at the time.

  20. #20
    Field Marshal CplKatie's Avatar
    Crusader Kings IIHearts of Iron IIISemper Fi500k club

    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Tokyo
    Posts
    3,839
    If AI's could speak....I wonder what they would say about you Plasticpanzers. If I were france I'd have resigned if I saw my UK ally ignoring germany and sitting in africa cycling troops to get exp while not making any ground and opening a front in italy. I can understand historical reasons, but this thread is advice for how to take north africa, not game your exp on troops and let france fall.

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts