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Thread: Magna Mundi cancelled

  1. #1821
    Quote Originally Posted by Tomn_Peng View Post
    Mallorie: Yeah, I did see the reply. Interesting, that.
    'kaykay . Like I said, it wasn't important, just wanted to address your curiousity .

    Quote Originally Posted by Konstantinos XV View Post
    Still.

    Meanwhile

    That's for "confirmation bias" bit.
    Well, like I said in the open letter thread... Where in that letter did he mention promise to provide a product of acceptable release quality? He didn't promise to improve the game at all (a key reason it was cancelled, I might add), just promises of a release date with insinuations that it was being cancelled because it conflicted with the dates of other paradox games.

    "UV will continue to assume its responsibilities from then on." reads pretty vaguely to me. Given Ubik's overly optimistc view of the game's quality already, who's to say he'd admit the recognize ongoing bugs? If he's being honest about its current state (which sounds implausible to me), I don't trust him to fix bugs, and if he's being decietful, I don't trust him to not just walk away.

    And as for the "If you want us to stop supporting Magna Mundi" bit, why would you even bring that up? Why would you be talking expansions when you can't even get the core product released? Or is that some sort of really weird horse trading, offering to let Paradox make the expansions if they also handle the patching?

    All that aside, though, he's already talking about how he, personally, is planning on moving on to a new game, while seeking fresh investors. If he cares that much about Magna Mundi, why isn't he going to personally involve himself with ensuring its ongoing support?

  2. #1822
    General Bloodmerchant's Avatar
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    So apparently sometime after MM had started its Paradox beta, I occasionally checked back just to see some glimmer of hope. Then one day, Ubik was planning to give its Paradox beta testers a chance to receive an SVN version of the game, updated every day. Everyone replied just so they got the latest version, including myself, just so I hope the game doesn't lag or crash. On my end, the game still unbearable to play. On my newer computer it lagged and lagged, a day in the game on super fast speed seemed like a minute at best, and the 'beta' simply crashed whenever I tried to run it on my laptop. By the time when UV wanted to release the game, no more updates were done and the SVN release was pulled. By that time, I was fully convinced that ubik, along with the core UV leadership, didn't seem to care for the Paradox betas at all.
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  3. #1823
    Captain Buckley's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mallorie View Post

    All that aside, though, he's already talking about how he, personally, is planning on moving on to a new game, while seeking fresh investors. If he cares that much about Magna Mundi, why isn't he going to personally involve himself with ensuring its ongoing support?
    +1

    And if he has any real legal council why aren't they telling him to keep his trap shut? I mean, the first rule of legal proceedings is that anything you say can and will be used against you. The only thing you can achieve by speaking out is damning yourself. ANY lawyer worth his salt gets that.

  4. #1824
    From the Universo-Forum :

    Fredrik Wester,

    I am publicly addressing you as I feel it’s my duty to the Magna Mundi fans to do the utmost to save the game and allow them to experience the work of the very special and talented team I have the pleasure to lead.
    I also feel I have the duty to the team I lead to try to save Magna Mundi. The involvement of the team on the project and how all worked together towards the single objective of delivering the game was impressive. I was still deciding things minutes before I was warned by a Spanish team member that the game had been cancelled.
    After reading that you were the one coming up with the idea of turning Magna Mundi into a commercial project, I feel we stand exactly at the same level of responsibility towards the fans: I created the brand and coordinated both the amateur and the professional projects and you decided to take advantage of it by producing a commercial game and in the process take ownership of the brand.

    In the first scenario everybody wins. This scenario demands leadership, charisma and ability to compromise. And those are exactly the qualities I am asking for you to show while trying to summon them myself. It’s a scenario where, to put it simply, a normal release date is set (I have no problem about a release in two or three months time to accommodate your release schedule), the game gets normally released and UV will continue to assume its responsibilities from then on. If for any reason you want UV to stop supporting Magna Mundi after the release thus allowing Paradox to take control of any future development within the scope of Magna Mundi, we can certainly talk about that.

    At present the situation is clear. Your decision to cancel the game will lead to a legal battle where Universo Virtual will try its best to beat Paradox, while Paradox will be doing the same to Universo Virtual. All the while I will neither give you the Magna Mundi engine nor return to you a single euro that you spent financing the development of the game.
    Courts apart, I am not one who fears the judgement of the public. I invite everyone who can come to Lisbon to check for them the game and make a judgement about it.

    In my book, cancelling a game at this stage and in these conditions while demanding back the money used for funding its development for two and a half years, demanding also the engine of the game, continuing to enjoy the ownership of the brand and retaining the possibility of releasing Magna Mundi for you, has a far uglier name than “cancellation”.
    Oh Ubik...
    I think hes bluffing with his "lawsuit".
    Last edited by Mushro0m; 28-06-2012 at 04:49. Reason: link deleted

  5. #1825
    Mwahahahahaha s1234567890m's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bloodmerchant View Post
    So apparently sometime after MM had started its Paradox beta, I occasionally checked back just to see some glimmer of hope. Then one day, Ubik was planning to give its Paradox beta testers a chance to receive an SVN version of the game, updated every day. Everyone replied just so they got the latest version, including myself, just so I hope the game doesn't lag or crash. On my end, the game still unbearable to play. On my newer computer it lagged and lagged, a day in the game on super fast speed seemed like a minute at best, and the 'beta' simply crashed whenever I tried to run it on my laptop. By the time when UV wanted to release the game, no more updates were done and the SVN release was pulled. By that time, I was fully convinced that ubik, along with the core UV leadership, didn't seem to care for the Paradox betas at all.
    Well no, i got the impression from MM devs that they didnt like the paradox betas
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  6. #1826
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    Quote Originally Posted by s1234567890m View Post
    Well no, i got the impression from MM devs that they didnt like the paradox betas
    Well its quite simple really MM devs get paid alot for sitting and doing nothing for 2 years Paradox wonder whats going on lets send in some beta testers... NNdevs actuly have to work for the money they get paid the horror. trough the paradox Betas the Paradox management finds out nothing gets done or fixed while Paradox money is going down the drain... Paradox Cancells all hell breaks lose when the MM devs find out they wont get paid for typing 1 word per hour anymore Code wise
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  7. #1827
    Captain Buckley's Avatar
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    Careful, you can't link to other forums bud.

    But yea... and how 'bout the whole "far uglier name than 'cancellation'." And what name would that be Ubik?

  8. #1828
    Am I reading the last paragraph of Ubik's letter correctly? Is Paradox demanding their money back, the MM engine from him, and the right to eventually release it?

  9. #1829
    General Bloodmerchant's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by s1234567890m View Post
    Well no, i got the impression from MM devs that they didnt like the paradox betas
    That too, but maybe a bit of both. I could figure out that they did have a sense of resentment for the Paradox beta itself.
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  10. #1830
    Quote Originally Posted by vengen View Post
    Am I reading the last paragraph of Ubik's letter correctly? Is Paradox demanding their money back, the MM engine from him, and the right to eventually release it?
    We're not privy to their contract, and Paradox hasn't made a public statement (nor should they), but that's what Ubik seems to be claiming.

    The first is a pretty standard clause (from what I've heard, I'm not a lawyer), though, basically just a "Give us back our money if you're not doing your job" thing, while the third has been the case ever since they made the mod (you give them the right to anything you write on their forums). The second clause is likely standard as well, though I wouldn't be able to support this claim; it makes sense because MM is based on EU3's engine, though, and in the absence of such a clause, if Paradox ever implented anything that sounds like something related to an idea MM came up with, UV could sue them for it.

    Basically - when he phrases it like that, it sounds terrible, but it's all actually very reasonable, and standard for the industry.

  11. #1831
    I'm just happy to see that #2 and #3 are being pursued.

  12. #1832
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    Quote Originally Posted by vengen View Post
    Am I reading the last paragraph of Ubik's letter correctly? Is Paradox demanding their money back, the MM engine from him, and the right to eventually release it?
    we can also call it: the price for breach of contract and failure to deliver the product

    In all honesty what Buckley said in post #1816 is most probably pretty accurate, particularly the part about his track record as a modder, ubik was always more intrested in adding new features at the price of game stability and prestanda rather then to fix longstanding problems and bugs during the the eu3 mod days (in particular there was an issue that made the mod unplayable in multiplayer pretty much all the way to HttT before it was sorted, and this issue also made it impossible to play the game in multiplayer on vanilla on the same instal), so it would not be a massive shock if the same attitude was carried over to the game development

  13. #1833
    Lost in Time Ashantai's Avatar
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    The modder can take time with things, releasing them a bit at a time, adding in all the wonderful features without much of a delay or overhead. When it is down to designing a game though for profit, with someone else publishing, there is a difference in philosophy. Suddenly you have to gear and prepare everything for one single day, get it all perfect for release, and only then work on possible new features for the future.
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  14. #1834
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyoumen View Post
    Well, to further hammer my point home, I think the fact that almost everyone was taken completely off-guard at the thought that Paradox might be demanding money back, and that nobody actually knows if they're doing so, how much they are demanding, or even if that's what Ubik was actually saying rather than making a rhetorical point (and the fact that several formerly fully pro-Paradox people abruptly got uneasy about the ethics of the situation if it is true)
    Erm, why would this make anyone uneasy? He was paid to do a job and he didn't deliver. Any reasonable person would want (and expect) their money back in such a case.

  15. #1835
    Also check :

    pcgamer(dot) com/2012/06/27/magna-mundi-cancelled-by-publisher-developers-promise-legal-response/

  16. #1836
    Lost in Time Ashantai's Avatar
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    I notice this forum has been moved into all other games and has the (Cancelled) edit in the description.
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  17. #1837
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    Looks like we were moved to make it more hidden from people. I see this as a sign that everything is done and the project has been wrapped up and put into the PI vault forever.
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  18. #1838
    On Probation Petrarch's Avatar
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    Truly now the Magnatanic is in the deep atlantic, I am just curious if anyone will ever find up what once was the "uncancelable game".

  19. #1839
    General Bloodmerchant's Avatar
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    No one can make a publisher cancel a game as fast as Ubik. He thinks too highly of himself and should act more humble and try to understand that more features isn't necessarily better.
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  20. #1840
    Lost in Time Ashantai's Avatar
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    Though it's not always in the new place. It's a bit confusing, it's going back and forth.
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