Most Complicated unintuitive game released

Jck2

First Lieutenant

76 Badges

Feb 19, 2012

215

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• Jun 16, 2012

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• #21

Zealuu said:

Surely it's in everyone's interest to try and attract more people to PI games as they are, rather than driving them off with ridicule?

I mean, yes, the original post is pretty confrontational - but really.

Click to expand...

I posted an honest opinion based on the information the OP provided. I don't claim to be the best player in the genre, but if I have a problem I ask questions. The OP seems to have no interest in the game though so I offered an alternative. It was not my intention to ridicule anyone.

 

Pyriel

Libertarian Super Villain

98 Badges

Mar 10, 2003

1.008

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deagfa

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• Jun 16, 2012

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• #22

Isn't the general idea of most paradox games that you are more likely to fail than accually win?

I rather enjoy the challenge myself

 

RedRooster81

Modding Paladin

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Feb 16, 2010

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• Jun 16, 2012

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• #23

It's a character-driven dynastic simulator, so for me, producing an heir who can inherit is the challenge. Anything else is just gravy. And then we get better gravy. With bits of carrot, and mushrooms, and onions. But not everyone likes onions in their gravy and that's fine.

But the goal is to keep the game going. Day one: your ruler is unmarried. Maybe you should get married. Sounds pretty intuitive to me.

Day two: You do not have an heir of your dynasty . . .

But it is not a world conquest game, the whole Medieval 2 idea of conquering everything then becoming emperor of the world or whatever. :wacko:

 

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natmeister

Corporal

70 Badges

Dec 13, 2009

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• Jun 16, 2012

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• #24

Just stick with it, you will be glad you did in a few weeks.

 

CB60

Second Lieutenant

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Jun 4, 2012

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• Jun 16, 2012

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• #25

Ah Navarre...just tried playing as Navarre and it's tough. But I was able to muddle along - even thrive for a time - as the the duke of Brittany with an incomplete understanding of the game mechanics.

 

Stauffenberg13

noobsauce

98 Badges

Apr 30, 2004

370

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• Jun 16, 2012

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• #26

I find the CKII UI infinitely better and more user friendly than the one in the campaign game in the TW games from Rome and forward, and it just gets worse for every game. The battles are nice, but the campaigns in Empire and Napoleon are unplayable for me.

 

Sarenarass

Major

47 Badges

Sep 28, 2011

690

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• Jun 16, 2012

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• #27

I was a growing fan of Paradox games when I discovered CKII, and it seemed like another good one. So I bought it and I was instantly overwhelmed by everything. So after about three minutes I stopped playing. Then I got on again after having a new interest in the game, to be overwhelmed again. I watched every single tutorial and then resumed playing, to be overwhelmed and leave. Eventually I got the hang of everything and am extremely glad I did as it is once of my favorite games. Just give it some time, took me about two weeks.

 

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Eyegor

Corporal

13 Badges

Mar 12, 2011

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• Jun 16, 2012

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• #28

For me, the complexity of Paradox games is what intrigues and attracts me. I've been gaming for 30+ years and a while back had begun to feel a bit jaded, having dipped in and out of various genres, each of which I have multiple titles. I had started to feel that I had seen it all before.
Then I happened upon a site with a review of EU 3. After some reading and research, I bought the game and, upon first acquaintance, experienced serious brain-melt. Despite my best efforts, I just could not get my head round what you were meant to do, never mind what buttons to press. I felt like an onlooker rather than a participant, having only a marginal effect on anything that actually happened. The whole game just seemed to be a semi-random clickfest.
Paradoxically (), this is probably the best way to approach these games initially - muck about with the interface, don't get bogged down in worrying about 'losing' anything, immerse yourself in the atmosphere. Slowly but surely, things will take shape and you'll start to grasp the nuts and bolts of what's going on.
CK2 is a magnificent game, and one for which I feel The Sims, rather than M2TW, to be a better conceptual starting point, strangely.

 

R

Ratlegion

Colonel

105 Badges

Aug 29, 2010

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• Jun 16, 2012

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• #29

I agree with most of the people here. When I got started with EU3 Heir to the Throne, I read ALL of the manuals, and struggled with the broken tutorial, and still didn't understand the game. I was horribly frustrated, but when I finally got it, I got it. Crusader Kings II was the same. I bought it and let it sit for 2 weeks before I read the manual, and still didn't understand it after the tutorials, which I thought was even worse than EU3, but at least it was functional. Unfortunately Paradox does a generally poor job of helping people learn how to play their games and that can trick many new players into thinking that the game isn't actually there, but I promise you, it is. It's just buried, like a diamond in the rough. It's a long climb, but when you get to the top, you'll know it and appreciate the trouble you took.

When you start these PI games, the whole world is available to you, and it gives the impression that any realm is good, but the reality is that is completely false. The interesting characters can be a fierce challenge, and you're actually better off going with an 80% very hard difficulty in Ireland, rather than a game in one of the empires. Pretty much, stay away from anyone but Ireland, at least until you've conquered Albion. You're asking for it starting with anyone else, in my opinion, although with the right degree of patience, you can make anyone work much of the time, eventually.

 

flame7926

Benevolent Imperialist

11 Badges

Mar 26, 2011

2.202

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• Jun 16, 2012

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• #30

I found the tutorials really helpful for first learning the game. All I did was read some of the developer diaries, and the tutorial, and I could play.

 

GAGA Extrem

Per Ardua Ad Astra

QA

External QA

121 Badges

Mar 19, 2004

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• Jun 16, 2012

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• #31

Learn step by step.
Start a game as a count or duke in Ireland. Then try more difficult locations.

 

U

unmerged(126218)

Corporal

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Nov 23, 2008

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• Jun 16, 2012

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• #32

Hmm maybe your IQ just isn't up to it? I think its a great game and its not REALLLLLY that hard to understand once you have spent sometime in it.

 

U

unmerged(126218)

Corporal

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Nov 23, 2008

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• #33

I think this post reflects most people under 30 today. They just want instant gratification and success at the press of a button. Sit back, imagine the medieval world, and then play my friend play...

 

U

unmerged(501314)

Recruit

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Jun 4, 2012

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• Jun 16, 2012

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• #34

I feel with you. I'm on my first playthrough as an irish count and I don't click every button to see what happens. (Just hate to make mistakes because I don't understand mechanics. Mistakes due to bad strategy are ok, but mistakes due to mechanics suck.) It is hard to get into but very fun and rewarding! I think the most important lesson for me was: Take your time. Don't rush, it is no problem to wait out 10 years to build cash and good opinion on vassals before going to war. Marry for claims and wait. It is no problem if it takes time in the beginning, you don't have the money to create titles anyway.

 

AVD29

Recruit

67 Badges

Jun 21, 2010

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• Jun 16, 2012

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• #35

One of the best games I have played in years simple quick reply but not really anything else I can say.

 

Dearmad

Lt. General

72 Badges

Feb 16, 2001

1.527

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forum.paradoxplaza.com

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• Jun 16, 2012

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• #36

bilugo said:

I thought by now Paradox would release a game that was easy too get in, but as usual it requires deep searching on the internet to find basic instruction on what to do, started a few empires in Spain with my brother attacking me wit a bigger army than my in Navarre. Lucky I paid $10 for this on steam so I can't be that disappointed with the price, but honestly could Paradox make 1 game that a casual game player can get into and not just the die hards. I'll go back to Medieval 2 at least that doesn't require a degree in playing.

Maybe I'll get flamed and fair enough but I don't think I am the only one having problems with understanding how this game works at all.

PS

With the DLC downloads can you playthe crusader kingdoms themselves, like Antioch, Edessa

Click to expand...

Enjoy MTW. WHy would you come to a developer's forum and ask them to make a game in a style that is clearly (given their history) not their cup of tea?

And yes you're not the only one having difficulties, just like *I* have difficulty "getting into" a game like M2TW because it is so fucking SHALLOW and craptastic. I had to mod that game so heavily before it was even barely playable (the BBB mod is mine and Pnutmaster's work). The sweat I put into that game before it was playable is a lot more work than YOU put into CKII before you came to the forums and took a piss on the lovely camp fire, so to speak.

See ya later, don't let the door hit ya on the way out.

 

D

Dino_j

Sergeant

82 Badges

Apr 7, 2012

53

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• Jun 16, 2012

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• #37

It did take me a few days of constant play start getting the hang of CKII. Part of the issue is that the manual gives very little information regarding th egame beyond the layout of the screen. For instance, it doesn't tell you that demesne size is based on your stewardship rating. After playing constantly andf consulting this forum, I began enjoyning the game much more. I especially like starting a game at a point in history that I'm familiar with and making changes to see how they play out.

 

DCyDe

Field Marshal

50 Badges

Sep 5, 2004

2.936

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• Jun 16, 2012

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• #38

Nonononono, this game is simple enough, if anything then PI should make it more deep with a trade-system. But i agree that most PI games aren't for the mentaly handicapped and that's how it should be !

 

Veldmaarschalk

Cool Cat

151 Badges

Apr 20, 2003

30.163

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• Jun 16, 2012

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• #39

bilugo said:

PS

With the DLC downloads can you playthe crusader kingdoms themselves, like Antioch, Edessa

Click to expand...

No, you don't need DLC's to play the Crusader states. You can start the game at any date between september 1066 and 1337. If you want to play the Crusader states you have to start after the first Crusade, so after 1100.

 

Veldmaarschalk

Cool Cat

151 Badges

Apr 20, 2003

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• #40

MAGNUS796 said:

Hmm maybe your IQ just isn't up to it? I think its a great game and its not REALLLLLY that hard to understand once you have spent sometime in it.

Click to expand...

Insults are not allowed