The Sword of Islam - Dev Diary 1

[RedRooster81]

I wouldn't worry until it gets there, Orinsul. The price of the DLC puts more money in the project if you want to buy it. The mods that do things with Islam or add a second religion modeled on Islam (with polygamy, decadence, etc.) could simply make their mod dependent on the DLC. We all had to pay up in EU3 to play mods that updated to the new expansion, but this is better because most of the content will be free; only playing a Muslim ruler is for-pay AFACT.

[Mods]

I'd like to be able to go duchy of Flanders --> kingdom of Flanders --> Empire of Flanders
That's my idea of fun alternate history, it should be possible for every duchy to do this

[DamianGrim]

I'd like to be able to go duchy of Flanders --> kingdom of Flanders --> Empire of Flanders
That's my idea of fun alternate history, it should be possible for every duchy to do this

There are already some mods for this.

[Orinsul]

I'd like to be able to go duchy of Flanders --> kingdom of Flanders --> Empire of Flanders
That's my idea of fun alternate history, it should be possible for every duchy to do this

As an option for a dynmanically named empire, as the moslem ones change their name with dynasty if it could be made so there were a couple Empire titles that can only be made by decision and are named off the primary title of the person making it, then thatd be pretty cool. but having titles for each duchy would be excessive and probably create more problems/annoyances then it could possibly solve and not something i would want to see in the game.

[NewbieOne]

King = Sultan, while Caliph = Emperor.

If you want to RP the house of Osman on its historical path, then it actually makes sense that these two are separate. First you become a powerful lord by raising yourself to the Sultan level, which just requires you to beat up on the Byzantines. But then to really become a supreme leader of the faithful, you also need to usurp or otherwise grab a Caliph title. Just like in real history (although a little after the game's time frame) when they seized Egypt and made Al-Muttawakil surrender the claim, as well as the sword and the mantle of the Prophet, to the Sultan Mehmet.

At some point the Ottoman rulers started using the title of Padishah, which was of the imperial rank. They were referred to as emperors in Europe too. In the beginning, though, they weren't in that league. I suppose they weren't there in 1453 yet either, more like after taking over the Caliphate (which, if they did in CK2, they'd be emperors too).

[malagasy]

Excited about Mali and west Africa. Now, there is an island South East of Somalia that would become a pretty important trading hub just about thist time ...

[Sleight of Hand]

Excited about Mali and west Africa.

I was until I saw them in the E3 stream -- the kingdom of Songhay is about three provinces. I'm not really sure what the reason behind adding West Africa was given how poorly it seems to be implemented, and I'm guessing they haven't added any more provinces there since that particular game (at E3) was played.

We'll have to see how it plays (maybe it was a balance decision) but I can't imagine playing in West Africa will be much fun.

[Garak]

Excited about Mali and west Africa. Now, there is an island South East of Somalia that would become a pretty important trading hub just about thist time ...

I was skeptical of such an addition when people floated it beofre, but based on what I've seen, I'm interested. It'll be nice having a new region to play in, and by not rendering the coast as a controllable area (as it looks in the screenshots and whatnot), that should help to slow down any European attempt to invade the area, which is good. Now I just hope they add an African portrait pack for this area and for Ethiopia.

[Avicenna]

Maybe instead of many empires you could use a more 'neutral' title like high-king? 'Emperor' is a very Roman title at this point, and yet the original idea of 'emperor' was a king of kings. For me, it would make more sense to have a high-king of the British Isles than an emperor - emperor just sounds hollow and pretentious, while high-king [or something similar] sounds like you're the undisputed liege of that land.

A high-king would be a step-up from king, and an equal of an emperor, but it's a title that comes from a different culture and time to the Byzantine and HRE titles.

Yeah, yeah, I know, 'role-play' - and I agree with that, but it's historical role-play, and if you're uniting Scandinavia in the 1100's, they'd use a title like high-king, not emperor!

[RedRooster81]

I would associate a high king with pre-Norman Britain--Edward the Confessor had some sense of overlordship over the Welsh princes, and over Scotland to a degree. I think that would be an idea foreign to William the Conqueror, but less so than I am probably imagining. What we are missing I think is a kind of overlordship dynamic that is not vassalage per se but a recognition that a nearby ruler is first among equals of the princes in a region. By Edward I, England had this role in the British Isles, while Leon dominated the Iberian realms (Christian and Muslim), and under St. Louis France became a strong diplomatic and military power over much of Latin Europe. I am overstating the case probably, but that would be superior to the empire dynamic where law is extended to the entire de jure area of the 'empire'.

[DreadLindwyrm]

Right, and your argument is that not including new content unless it has localised names is a good argument?

@tommassi; Yes, they have localised translations, but not localised names. For example King = Koenig, which is apt, but they don't have Markgraf for the historical margraves (instead they're lumped in with Count/Graf), which is closer to what your issue is. Thus german cultured emperors of Scandinavia will be Kaiser, and not Emperor.

Would this perhaps be because the rank of margrave isn't in game, and thus there won't be a title for it?

I'm not 100% certain, but wouldn't a (culturally) German emperor be called Kaiser whereever they were found, since this is the form of "Caesar" that they favoured, using this in the vernacular, rather than variations of "Imperator" or "Autokrator" (latin and greek respectively)? Surely any name can be applied to the tier 5 titles, just depending on what the culture would have been likely to use for an "emperor" or "king over kings" title. Since Emperor is taken from the Latin, the "common" language of Western Europe, it makes a good starting point.
Besides, do German cultured dukes and counts in Scandinavia use the german forms or the scandinavian ones for their titles? What title do our scandinavian brothers use for emperors?

[DreadLindwyrm]

And, having just had a chat to a few scandinavians, the titles there for emperor derives from caesar as well, possibly via German Kaiser...
I don't see an issue with a german emperor of Scandinavia using the spelling he is used to. Especially since he probably isn't using the spelling - it'd be his court scribe writing it all out.

[Blastaz]

Besides, do German cultured dukes and counts in Scandinavia use the german forms or the scandinavian ones for their titles? What title do our scandinavian brothers use for emperors?

Title is taken from culture of liege, so English counts in france/spain/wherever are Earls.

Would assume almost everyone is just Emperor by default.

[B. Hayrettin]

well the practice was kinda "civilised" afterwards where the princes were locked up in so called "kafes"(cage) in the palace to stop them doing something stupid. some developed mental diseases, others too pussy to be a sultan. during the later stages of the empire the conditions got better i guess, as the lucky bastards had access to the harem hehe