..Although, from what I have played of CK2 (England, Wales, Poland, Castille), Iberia seems the best experience, probably the most challenging, of them all. Constant Holy Wars, trying to claim ASAP Leon, Navarre, Aragon and Galacia (sp?), as well as find other European alliances (I found England good, and was working towards HRE when it went down the pan); it really made it difficult. I dont think though that the Moors should be hindered (am I saying that?), or penalised - I found it challenging and hard work building up and I did quite well. Dont nerf it.
As Leon (or Castille) it comes to kill your brother as quickly as posible (sad but true). Then you have chances against smaller muslims. Declare Holy War when they are fighting each other. Don't miss any oportunity. I played less than 100 years and only muslims left in the neigbourhood are Mauretania duchies (I usurped kingdom title).
I meant that you are heir of your brothers kingdom. Kings of Leon and Castille are brothers and aren't married. They are heirs to one anothers kingdoms. After patch 1.5 its sooo easy to kill someone using plot mechanics. Without bloody war, within first couple of days in the game, I got kingdom of Castille. Leon + Castille is quite a nice power against this muslims just below my borders (I forgot their name). They got one or two duchies. I just waited till muslims were fighting. If they are at war, there is small chance that anyone will help during Holy War.
I find Iberia very rewarding and enjoyable. After I finished my first game (as Poland, conquered most lands in europe and put Piast on HRE throne) I tried playing England and found it soo boring. Spreading Christianity across northern Africa is fun
im still for a weak holy order, unable to survive mid-late game, unable to steamroll muslims AT ALL, just to give the early weak cristians a backbone against small-mid muslim muslim invasions(ofc. it wont help at all when the shia calipahte wants you dead). maybe a mix between better AI and a slight buff. but thats for PI to decide.
No, all I want them to do is a. bear in mind that their enemies will ally when they call a Holy War and b. use De Jure claims rather than Holy Wars when possible. Possibly also to know when it is a good time to assault a holding, though that's a wider issue.
That the AI does not do these things is the only area where they might be any sort of problem here. If they then lose because the Muslims are much more powerful then... well, that's how it should be.
I don't quite understand your analysis,, I am afraid. It implies a human cannot win, because the situation is the same for humans. The fact is, good timing wins you that war with ease.
Last edited by Corelay; 24-05-2012 at 18:34.
When I played my first game as Barcelona, I didn't know the Spanish kingdoms were impossible. I survived quite well. I fabricated claims on small Islamic states surrounding me, knowing a Holy War would bring the wrath of the much stronger states to the south. I eventually became a force to be reckoned with, and when a much stronger nation declared "Holy War" on me I would try to delay their sieges as long as possible so that another Catholic nation may save me. Worked quite well for awhile, that is until my leader died and his hier considered his liege to be the Duchy of Toscany, so I was absorbed into the Holy Roman Empire. Other HRE states ganged up on me and I wasn't able to defend myself effectively so I lost.
At least it wasn't to the Muslims.
All generalizations are false.
You fabricated claims as Barcelona? That's not normally necessary; they have De Jure claims on most stuff near them, and the more they conquer, the more claims they get. They can also Holy War the tiny Muslim states nearby that they don't have other claims on and rush-win before any coalition forms against them. Barcelona's a very entertaining starting point for the game, actually.
The civil wars inside of iberian kingdoms can be crippling. For example, as Leon, your sister always rebels and it interrupts my wars as she can call Galicia and Castille in on her side.
Yup, tried a Leon game lately and that happened almost at once. On the other hand, it's a very winnable rebellion and you get the demense off of her when you win it.
and you also have nuno revolting in galicia. all while castilel thinks: LOL, im going for zaragosa ASAP! and gets dogpiled because leon and galicia couldnt help him. or you have galicia excommunicating evryone.
note: in my current game castille is groing again. my bother in alw's on the throne now(granting him an alliance with me) so im now expanding his realm the gamey way until he owns and digested about half iberia. will see what happens then.
I started Navarra, one hundred years after, the reconquista was finished...
Navarra is kingdom of Castilla, Leon, Aragon, Navarra and Africa (this last was given to my daughter in law)...
we survive very well to saracens, because we all were together...
I play EUIII-Divine Wind, Victoria II, HoI3, East India Company, Crusader Kings, Rome
Once, Navarra had more provinces in Africa than in Europa
Once, Ottomans was master of Europa
Once Portugal was a reformed theocracy
Sorry if I make mistakes in English, it is not my mothertongue
If you start only 20 yars later, in 25 may 1085, thare is big Castilia kingdom and reconqista is not garanteed but very possible. At least they hold their positions for long time.
In my games I've never seen Spanish kingdoms existed even by 1180. Sometimes though the whole Peninsula gets conquered by France or HRE. Once I've seen it controlled in maybe 3/4 by England, fighting with France for former Aragon. This really need to be fixed (maybe by giving spanish provinces some defence bonus?).
Issues: Laissez-faire/Full Citizenship/Pacifism/Pluralism
Current Work: Fighting for freedom
Militancy: 5 (+ 0.2)
Consciousness: 9 (+ 0.2)
אֶרֶץ יִשְׂרָאֵל- The mod about Israel
I thought the start of the game was when the reconquista had started to seem more plausible, no? What with the collapse of al-Andalus and everything. But either way, while the christian kingdoms were in no way in a strong state surely they should stand a reasonable chance of winning. When I play CK2+ the christian kingdoms actually seem too powerful, but to me that is still preferable to always seeing a muslim spain with perhaps one or two tiny christian nations, and sometimes french or HRE 'colonies', which never return to spanish kingdoms. While a player can always use his brain to conquer Iberia, most people don't want to always have to either play as or interfere with Iberian nations just to see the christian knigdoms stand a chance of surviving or expanding.
The problem is that the Spanish Kingdom AI declares war on its Christian Allies for some claim or other and then Muslim neighbors with Tech and Numbers advantage "see weakness" and dogpile on with a Holy War.The only time I see an Iberian Kingdom survive is when I play as one.And then I was Castille and finished Reconquista by 1230.
There is a guy in this thread that keeps saying that the muslims had the upper hand in Iberia by 1066, well, that is actually not correct. If you read any book about Spanish history, you'll see that Fernando I (the father of the 3 kings) was winning every war against the muslim until he died (and split the kingdom in 3... he was a fucking asshole) In fact, the emirates to the south (beja badajoz and cordoba) were paying him taxes by the time he died and kept doing them after it (And 5 years later Sancho II of Leon would reunite the kingdoms, and then they would be inherited by Alfonso VII again.)
The only way in-game to make christian Iberia survive is by making the 3 kings merge their territories together, I think this should be "forced" by lowering all their relationships between them, and buffering relations with their rivals vassals while keeping their own vassals relations "not-that-good". Also, the internal fights between the muslims are not reflected historically in-game, they will never attack eachother and think there is a lack of divided taifas dunno if it is done in pourpose... whatever, the devs must have a look at iberia and make it 60/40 for the christians to beat the muslims, to be honst that sounds like fair odds