"The Mightiest Empires Fall": An Austrian RoP PBEM

Stuyvesant said:

Ah, look at all those 'Looted' symbols throughout eastern Prussia/Poland. The Cossacks can be proud of their contributions to the war effort.

I must ask: how did that annihilated Cossack regiment that was run over by Cumberland managed to get word back to you? Considering they were slaughtered to the last man and horse...

The combination of Cumberland and Freddie sounds like a very grim prospect: more troops, better troops, better leadership... I see now how your main army is going to become mince meat. I just hope you take plenty of Prussians and British with you - enough to allow the rest of your armies to continue advancing and tightening the pressure on Prussia.

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Yep, its good to see that the Cossacks understand the process of properly liberating land in Germany ... and it is indeed a mystery how a totally outnumbered and overwhelmed force managed to gather and report such a useful amount of detail.

The next post has an overview map which will give some idea of the relative positions, April is the last turn were the main fronts are relatively far apart, which in turn sets the scene for Narwhal to start moving quickly to beat up one threat after another (if he can)

Bornego said:

And the tension rises ...

So Narwhal concentrated his troops. Nevertheless, there appeared to be numerical equality. On defense your army should have been able to hold the line (especially since the Austrian generals are excellent in that regard - Daun has a higher defensive rating than Friedrich!)

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I try to sit on the defense in April in the hope the Prussians take the bait, but as the weaker French and Russian armies come into striking range I found I had to be more proactive in keeping Frederick focussed on Saxony

Dewirix said:

Like Bornego I was thinking that the Prussians concentrating in Saxony could play nicely to the Austrian strength on the defence.

I'm not sure the British would have taken the abandonment of Hanover lightly. Regardless, it seems your scouting strategy is paying dividends.

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Again the map in the next post will make it clear just how good my scouting system was, even with our house rule about not taking MC with non-commanded hussars and cossacks, I have Prussia pretty well riddled.

"No fear more, no stain more": April 1758

April can be seen as a brief lull in the fighting. The Austrians and Russians were mostly regrouping after the March battles and the French were involved in clearing the threats to their flanks and rear before moving onto the Elbe. Equally it seemed the Prussians needed time to recover from their marches and their losses at Leipzig.



However, although outnumbered almost 2-1 in Hannover and Saxony, in combination the Prussians were much stronger than any of the Allied armies. The advantage of interior lines, faster movement and superior generals was very much in my mind at this stage.



The North

After the defeats at Rostock, the Swedes retired into Stalsrund. It was clear they were more of a threat when they were nowhere near a battlefield.



However, by late April, the Prussians abandoned Rostock, presumably either to reinforce their armies in Saxony or to contest the Russian approach to Stettin.



Hannover

By early April, the French were securely in charge of the west bank of the Weser with the exception of the major port of Bremen. It was decided to leave Hohenzollern's column to secure Minden while the rest of the army drove the English away from Bremen and secured the rear before moving deeper into Hannover. At the same time, Hohenzolllern oversaw a massive expansion of the depot at Minden, vital if the large French army was to be supplied as it neared the Elbe.







Their rear was also secured by the capture of Paderborn at the start of the month



The British force at Bremen retired without giving battle, enabling the siege to begin.



With their growing expertise in siege works, the town fell by the end of April



freeing the French armies to march on Hannover.

Oder

By the start of April, Kosel fell, allowing Charles' forces to press further north along the Oder



The arrival of fresh battalions at Wien, offered a further boost to his numbers.



Saxony

After the twin battles of Leipzig, the front in Saxony was quiet. Both sides were content to sit back in defensive positions and recover their losses and organisation.



However, with the weaker Russian and French armies now within striking distance, it became clear that the Austrians needed to actively engage Frederick in Saxony in order to prevent him destroying one of the other threats to Prussia. Equally May was to see a renewal of the Russian offensive.

Dewirix said:

Well, you weren't kidding about your recon assets. That's pretty much all of Germany you've got lit up in that first screenshot.

I understand that you need to keep the concentrated Prussian forces concentrated on your main Austrian army, but a head-on attack doesn't sound like an appealing prospect.

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Bornego said:

At this point your situation looks very good. NM is in good shape and Prussia's advantage in VP will melt away quickly if nothing extraordinary happens. In fact, you could afford to sit back and play it safe now. It's actually Narwhal now who has to act in order to gain more VP.
I have to say, you played this very well this far ... which makes it even harder to believe you went from this promising situation to a nasty disaster.

Two remarks:
- How much money Prussia gets is almost irrelevant. What restricts the number of replacements it can build is the amount of conscripts it has available.
- I am not sure if you needed to seek battle actively - especially not in a theater where Prussia was relatively strong. It probably would suffice if you played a cat and mouse strategy. Push where the Prussians aren't present in force, retreat where they aren't. But as you write yourself, that isn't without risk either since Prussian troops move faster - however at this point they probably don't make up much more than 50% of Friedrich's forces.

And one question: did you build both depot upgrades at Minden in the same turn? I have never tried that. Is this really possible?

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I actually came up with a slightly more elegant solution, I worked out a deployment that protected Dresden and allowed me to besiege Troppau, I hoped that would lure Frederick to battle, as it was, it worked out even better than I'd hoped, as we'll see very soon

Would stress again, the Austrian army can be battered down to very little for one of two reasons. Either Frederick rips it apart, or its the force that does the bulk of the actual fighting while the French and Russians take the key cities.

Searry said:

Yes it's possible if you have two separate stacks of 2 supply wagons. Never tried with three.

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aye, my report was wrong. Minden starts as 0 level depot and its a real pain to take the French army beyond as a result. I built it up to 2. But yes, all i did was to form 2 stacks of 2 supply wagons (the depleted ones) and they each build a depot in the turn.

"Before the sweeping blast": May 1758

Well for those of you worried at the lack of major battles, never fear your needs will be fully met in the next few reports.

Hannover

Here, I redeploy the force that took Bremen back to Minden (to pick up fresh supply) while the 2 fresh corps and Soubisse's HQ stack move onto Hanover.

In the meantime the fresh Saxon corps starts the long march to Minden, it should arrive by early July.



In an attempt to force the pace, I decide to send Orleans and the French cavalry onto Braunschweig. I may be lucky with a surrender event, and it will also help gather intelligence on the Prussian deployments.

As it is by late May, my sieges are ongoing and that British corps from Bremen is spotted at Magdeburg.



Again I am suspicious that he is on his way to join Frederick.

Time to order up even more units for the French army



Saxony

At the start of May, I decided to try and threaten Troppau and deployed the entire army so it was mutually supporting, but still protected Dresden. Not least, the core of the Prussian army was at Halle (including the force that had been at Magdeburg).

However, by mid-May, the situation is rather different. Frederick has moved into Chemnitz itself.



Well I decide to gamble on taking full advantage, lifting the siege of Troppau the entire Austrian army redeploys to Leipzig, Wurzen and one corps is ordered to Chemnitz itself. Again the moves are timed so as to be self-supporting as I see the opportunity to trap Frederick well away from any regular supply sources.

Equally he can't move south without fighting some sort of battle.



In the event, Frederick tries to attack northwards and walks into my entire army at Wurzen, in a vicious battle, my advantage on the defense tells (the rain helped too)



Even better, they try again the next day



Even better, Frederick is then forced back to Chemnitz, which cannot be doing his supply situation any good, and, overall, the Prussian army is now split into two.

However, I have paid a high price. Von Bilberstein (4-1-4) has been killed, now I can juggle brigades and do some promotions but he was one of my best corps level generals.



Oder

Here again, I'm just moving methodically northwards. My only concern is that Moritz's cavalry are still in Silesia, but I don't think they can really harm 2 full corps of infantry.



However, by the end of May I have one hole in Niesse

The North

Lapuchin's Cossack corps pays an early visit to Berlin, I'm not sure what Schwerin is up to, and want as much information on his movements as I can manage



And, at the end of May, the Swedes retake Rostock



The net effect of the twin battles at Wurzen is I am now ahead in Vps, fairly meaningless but a nice sight. Equally, I am well ahead in NM (I've just lost some in return for more VP and EP) and our battle losses are pretty much even.



So things are about to become rather vicious. I have effectively trapped Frederick, but that British force at Magdeburg and Schwerin around Berlin are in my rear. Moritz, I suspect is going to move to Saxony as he can do little on the Oder at the moment. The French and Russians need to clear a barrier of forts before they can really help.

I'm afraid that Frederick will try to run south, but as long as I can secure the major supply sources, sooner or later that leads to serious problems. For the moment, I want to see if I can trap his army and inflict substantial losses. That it has split into two may allow me to do serious damage to one column or the other.

Dewirix said:

Looks like Freddy got reinforced for the second Minden battle (more cannons and about the same number of men as the first time, despite casualties). Glad to see it didn't do him any good. I should have known you were too canny a player to go after the Prussians head on, but even you couldn't have expected such a good opportunity to neutralise their main force. Without the ability to break out past your Austrians Narwhal's going to have a hard time containing the French and Russian thrusts.

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My plan now is not very elegant, but in effect the Austrians will become some sort of tar-baby, sticking with Frederick so he can't recover and can't intervene. In combination the 3 Prussian formations outside Saxony could stalemate the Russians but would be overwhelmed by the French. So he has to seriously damage the Austrians in some way to protect his core cities to the north. If he can't do this then Browne, and the spiritual fathers of 8th Guards Army, are going to hoisting the Russian Imperial Flag over the Brandenburg Gate by the end of the summer.

Dewirix said:

I think it's elegant in its simplicity.

They'd have to build it first - the real Brandenburg Gate doesn't get built for a good few decades yet.

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Ah, ok, will have to find somewhere else to drape it, at least I've remembered it won't be the hammer and sickle :ninja:

Bornego said:

Being at Chemnitz isn't that big of a problem for Friedrich. The depot at Leipzig is next door and his supply trains can restock from there. Moreover his corps are still positioned in a way that allows them to mutually support each other. If you would manage to take Leipzig, then Friedrich would indeed be in trouble.

On the other hand, the Prussians have some interesting offensive options as well: Friedrich could strike at the two weak corps south of him (not ideal ground, though). Just as well he could march east through the hills to Dresden (with nothing but a simple city wall to protect it, the city would fall fast). This move might actually turn the tables since all of a sudden it would be Daun who is cut off from a supply depot.
In both cases, my main worry would be that the Prussian forces would then be isolated from each other and each is heavily outnumberedon its own.

In Narwhal's shoes, I would probably wait for the next attack. Especially since it looks to me as if you got lucky at Wurzen and Narwhal's stacks were in different postures. Just a guess but it would explain why you fared so surprisingly well. Moreover, I am pretty sure you started feeling cocky at that point - I know I would have.

Narwhal, one question if I may, what made you put Wilhelm in charge at Leipzig? - ok, he has a high senority but there are always a few higher ranking army commanders in whose stack one can hide this least talented Prussian corps commander.

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I was very afraid that Dresden was his target. As a level 1 fort it falls very easily so if he put a large siege force on top of it, I would have to attack. So at best (for me) I am initiating combat at a disadvantage, if I failed then that huge army is going to be a liability as I try to find enough supply to keep it intact.

In the outcome, in June, I think he tried both. I gain the reward for all that building of the HRE/Bavarian contingent as they stand up to a major battle (ok in good terrain with limited frontage) and stop his escape (at least for the moment).

I wasn't at all confident at this stage. I've seen Narwhal (both in PBEM and in AARs) turn around bad situations very quickly and efficiently and this is by no means over. The Austrians are at risk and the Russians stopped by the end of June.

"The sun was out of sight": June 1758

This was a strange month, no progress with the French at all but more vicious battles in Saxony. On the Oder, both in the north and the south, I made some useful progress. So its coming down to a question of whether Frederick can either cripple the Austrians, or escape, before the Russians and French enter Prussia proper.

Saxony

At the start of the month, I'd decided to risk sending one of Daun's corps to Chemnitz to see if it provoked a battle. In the event, before I could move, Frederick again tried to escape and hit my army at Wurzen.



Despite the three vicious battles, my formations are still ok, my main problem is the loss of Von Bilberstein as a corps commander, a number of wounded brigadiers and some battalions close to losing elements. So my neat OOB is a bit less neat (and is going to get a lot worse) .





To allow my forces to recover organisation, I opted to remain on the defense in late June. As it is Frederick tries to break out south, running into the HRE/French force at Freiberg. I lose a 3 day battle but inflict more losses in terms of elements on the Prussians. Frederick's army is clearly suffering for lack of replacements.



In the end, Frederick drives me from Freiberg but is still blocked by the fort I built. It won't last long, but I might be able to trap him before he escapes. The problem with this battle was the HRE command stack and the French corps were in different stances and it looks like the French took no part in the actual fighting (an oversight by me, I really hadn't expected this battle as I thought Frederick would have slipped out via Leipzig).

North

In early June Browne's 3rd division commences the siege of Stettin and by mid June, Serbollini has risked a day trip towards Berlin





With the Russian army at Stettin, I don't think he will be an obvious target for the Prussians, and hopefully he can boost the Russian force. In combat terms that is the weakest of my three main armies. It looks like Narwhal is going to use the Cavalry, the British and the Schlesien Army to protect Berlin from the Russians. This is feasible as I have about 3000 power against 2000 in those Prussian forces but would suffer if I was the one on the offensive.

In any case, Stettin falls promptly as the experienced Russian gunners level another Prussian fortress



Next step Berlin.

Oder



Here, I've gambled (correctly) that Moritz is not going to hang around so have split up Charles army. One corp continues the siege at Niesse while Picolomini moves onto Brieg.

Brieg falls at the end of the month (this was on the 5% chance of any fort under siege surrendering unless it has full supply wagons), next stop Breslau

France

More Germans arrive and will march off to war with Prussia in July



However, Hannover is proving tough and I can't move on till it is secured. So as the war escalates in Saxony and I make steady progress at both ends of the Oder, the French army stays immobile.



So overall, losses remain even, and there is little shift in terms of NM as my gains for Stettin were wiped out by the losses for Freiberg.

Dewirix said:

Seems like you've got a health lead in VP, and the casualty ratio is swinging in your favour. Freddie's taken a beating over the past couple of turns, so I suppose from a psychological point of view the battles of Freiburg might have been necessary to restore his self-confidence. It certainly seems like Daun has the beating of him for now.

I count 60 Prussian elements lost as opposed to three for the Austrians, and that figure doesn't include the 22 you destroyed taking Stettin.

Looking good for Austria, but miracles do happen...

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the big fear now (for me) is Narwhal unifying all his scattered corps. In some ways RoP discourages the creation of bully stacks (frontage mainly) but equally they allow you to grind down a weaker foe. if he can wreck either the Austrians or the French, he'll gain the time to recover at least some of his manpower, making a threat to whichever is still left.

I must confess that from here on, the game ceased to be much of a simulation of the Seven Years War and more like the final days of the Reich in 1945. Its a flaw in the game engine (imo), that renewal of battle after a major encounter is too easy.

germanpeon said:

I can't see you losing at this point, even if one of your main armies in Hannover, Pommern, or Sachsen are thoroughly defeated or even eliminated. A roughly even score in VP, NM, or casualties is even only numerically, while in strategic terms means a firm lead for the coalition.

I noticed, unless my eyes deceive me, that several of your brigade commanders want a promotion... perhaps the formation of another column would ease the command stress Daun's army is suffering, specifically in the columns of Lobkowitz, Nadsady, and Lucchese. Buckow looks like a promising option.

Will the Russians be able to march right on to Berlin after Stettin, or will the fortress of Schwedt block their movement?

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Yes, I used Puffy to build a new corps, so the next turn everyone had no malus, but my OOB becomes increasingly ropey as this escalates.

I decided to ignore Schwedt, in truth I gambled the Prussians no longer have the forces for side campaigns and would need all their units in the north to protect Berlin. So from now on, I only take what I need (or that is in my way). Under more normal conditions, I'd have cleaned out all those forts on the lower Oder.

"Good Mornng, Midnight": July 1758

Saxony

At the start of the month, Frederick was at Freiberg, snagged up on my small fort there. I decided to move the bulk of Daun's army to Chemnitz, and, as before, order a single corps to actually move on and engage.



I caught Frederick at Freiberg and he won a 2 day battle (but again was the army that took the losses in terms of elements)



However, by mid July the situation is downright confusing and Frederick's army is in a real mess and large parts of mine not much better.



Puffy was promoted and went to Dresden to pick up some fresh units and would return in a few days.

In any case, the slaughter recommences.



Somewhere in that chaos, a complete Prussian column was eliminated and I find all sorts of nice things lieing around the battlefield



The North

Here it seems as if the Prussians are trying to bar the road to Berlin, even as more powerful siege guns have almost reached the front.



I'm content to wait a while, as I need to recover organisation.

However, in late July Narwhal forces the pace, striking at the weaker of the two Swedish formations that I'd left back at Rostock



I'm not that worried, they fell back to Stalsrund and can hide in the fort.

Hannover

Here, Hannover falls at the start of the month



Opening the road to the Elbe and the French move up to renew the siege of Braunschweig.





Well the VP situation still favours me, and I'm still ahead with NM. Losses are escalating but still pretty even. Its a case of whether I can really finish Frederick off.

In those last battles a lot of units were inactive. In particular in the assault phases, the numbers engaged dropped by almost 50% (failed morale checks) and this is going to get worse.

The main fear is that those forces facing off against the Russians move to Saxony. They might be able to overwhelm Daun's battered army before the French and Russians will be able to deploy.