2. Political and national conventions ideas and institutions: You have to correctly model the rise of Lazzise Farrie (prolly misspelled it) Capitalism. You also have to model the rise Of Socialism, Communism, State Individualism, German pan-nationalism, Polish nationalism, Ukrainian nationalism, Indian Collectivism and nationalism, The Apohogy and fall of the British Empire, by 1900 Brittan WAS bankrupt and had to sell off its navy's and buy naval armaments and ships from the U.S. It had to do so again in 1912 (which is beyond the proposed timeline) but im putting it out there that Victoria allowed said Bankruptcy to occur. The rise of Amrica from a small nation to a world power by 1900. The Beginnings of the Bolshevik revolts And the failed first Russian Republic. The Push out of the notion of the U.S.S.R. Germany's rise to Industrial and military power before WW1, not to mention its formation! Sardinia-Piedmont's successful gains and subsequent formation into Italy! The Austrian revolts that caused Austria to finally become Austria-Hungary. The 2 hour war that left Kyoto and Edo in flames And Japan firmly in Americas grip (yes we went to war with them before WW2!!) The Meji Restorations based off of American Idealism. The rise of Japan as the Power of Eastern Asia through multiple wars. The collapse of China to republican revolts and the rise of multiple nationalist movements within that would later cause it to be in its current National Socialist form.
I could go on, as this is only about 5% of what actually happened between ACW and 1900.
The thing is from a 1356 start, the map will not resemble what the political situation would have looked like by 1860. So putting excessive depth of detail of potential situations from 1860 to 1900 that may never play out, it just seems problamatic.
Now you place everything politically and territorally correct in the history files. Then it would be correct or an 1860 game start, but chances are most players would start from 1356 still and then none of that history gets read by the game. You can script the ai to behave more historically for wars and alliances after 1860 that would be read from a 1356 start, but all those events would have to have clauses for if certain Tags still exist by 1860, that the event was designed for. Imagine if someone started from 1356 as Spain and Spain holds most of NA where England should have historically and the United stated never happens and you have events for the ACW.
Just adding in histories for an 1860 start is more of a token. I was told that the game wasn't designed to model a 1337 start, but its better equipped from 1337 than 1900.
I understand Dafool with how you prefer to develop the more important bits in secret, but honestly some of it could come out in the open anyway if you are going to bring this out in the open. Comments in the thread might be distracting but if you were going to develop that stuff without talking to us anyway then I don't see how our feedback would affect it at all.
I suppose I don't mind later start dates, but in my opinion it would only work if you could completely revamp how allies and diplomacy and spheres work, and then you have Vicky 2. Current spheres have no real diplomatic importance other than getting an AI to like you a bit more or accept your request of vassalization, and allies will hate you the moment they get an event with a core on you. Nations in the late 1800s, 1900s did not work in ways EU3 can model in any realism.
Also this is a reply at 3 am so sorry if I was rude anywhere.
I would say that any extension of the end of the timeframe makes my (previously stated) arguments and suggestions for a redesign of California a bit more pressing. I would also suggest the possibility of events relating to the Gold Rush (it could be made in a time-independent manner, perhaps based on the proper provinces being colonized and/or fought over). Texas and California as possible revolter nations would be cool too. (California actually did try to rebel from Mexico and declare independence; it only didn't "take" because it happened the same spring that the US-Mexican war started.)
One thing I'll also toss out is that, since EU3 (and particularly D&T) often sees faster colonization, perhaps the 1750 start dates for the colonial revolters should also be pushed earlier. There are arguments that could be made for some colonies, even in real history, having been "potential revolters" as early as the 1640s.
Sunshine patriot - Southern California sunshine, that is...
plays EU2, EU3-DW (usually with D&T), and occasionally dusts off HOI, HOI2, CK, Rome, or Victoria
Sheridan's EU2 France 1419 Strategy Guide (outdated but still useful in concept)
2. Laissez-faire non-interventionalism is represented extremely well afaik by the free trade slider. Socialism/Communism, although their ideas were around at the time, did not have a big enough following to make them worth putting them in, seeing as we're only going up to 1900 that is. (Feel free to disagree with me on that ) Britain wasn't bankrupt by 1900 (although it had been surpassed by Germany), as for its fleet, in fact I believe it had just instituted new naval reforms after scare-mongering by admirals (namely John Fisher) in the press, and was about to embark on its Drednought programme. And the Meji restoration, in my opinion, wasn't based off American idealism, but as a response to bullying from western nations, most notably the USA, Britain and France.
From those, I like the ideas about nationalism and the PL commonwealth. I'll let SWF do the nationalism thingy, and I'll get to work on trialling a PL commonwealth.
As for developing in secret, its not so much 'secret', its more that there isnt the space on the thread to discuss every single idea (we need a subforum!). Also, we don't need help on them, so we prefer just to implement the idea then make any alterations based on your suggestions later - this works far better since you actually get to trial it in game rather than just seeing the idea.
Not rude atall, thanks for your suggestions
Last edited by lukew; 07-05-2012 at 14:13.
You would definitely need to implement railroads though. They were huge military targets during the ACW because of how darn useful they were. Perhaps as a province decision that costs a significant amount of ducats? Railroads are expensive.
They also should be available slightly prior to the ACW as they were invented earlier.
If I remember correctly, one of the reasons to use the 1356 start date was because that's when the EU3 version of the HRE basically came into being. Moving the date back would mean you guys would have to model that.
How exactly do you plan to work the Scramble for Africa? Wouldn't this require redrawing the continent's interior almost entirely?
I'd recommend checking out the Victoria 2 forum, really. We've (collectively) been able to simulate a lot of good stuff from the 19th century by playing around with flags, modifiers, country tags, and so forth. It's more a matter of asking what you need to know about than anything.
Honestly, I'd rather see a death and taxes to Vicky 2 converter.
That's about as Central Africa as you can get, and it was one of the first territories officially resolved.
To be honest, I'd actually suggest ending the game in 1881-4 so that you don't have to worry about the Scramble.
However, I'd suggest the Scramble for Africa to be implemented this way:
Triggering Point: More than 2 European nations own colonies in Sub-Saharan Africa, 25% of Sub-Saharan Africa owned by non-Africans
Event #1: "Riches in Africa". Tells the player that countries have been colonizing Africa and that the world is becoming aware of its resources. Sets flag "African Colonialism", which opens up conquest missions on various African tribes (to encourage A.I. to conquer Africa) and various triggered modifiers that give incentives to colonize Africa.
Event #2: "African Expedition". It's an event that is supposed to reveal deep African provinces that would replace "wastelands". One way to keep nations from easily colonizing the deep cores of the continent would be to make this event have a MTTH of 100 years modified by innovative slider points and # of neighbouring provinces settled. A substantial investment cost can also be incurred (i.e. -5 colonists, -5 magistrate).
Event #3: "Scramble for Africa". Fires when more than 2 European nations own provinces in Sub-Saharan Africa and 80% of Sub-Saharan Africa owned by non-Africans. Opens up events that give cores to neighbouring African provinces owned by someone else.
If you guys plan on adding new resources, "Gems" or "Diamonds" are probably something worthwhile to add, since Africa's quite known for its diamonds in the 19th century. Randomly flipping grain/wool provinces to that after a certain tech level would be cool.
Anyway... just throwing some ideas around... and yes, the scramble for Africa can start far earlier than the historical date, just as the colonization of the Americas.
Maybe industrialising could allow you to convert african provinces to richer trade goods, or ones you own could flip by event?
However, the trouble is that not every African provinces have rich resources, so a decision'd have to be made on whether to follow the historical resource distribution or to add some randomness to it (but admittedly, there can still be hidden deposits that are not yet found).