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Thread: New Timeline

  1. #1
    First Lieutenant nett40's Avatar
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    New Timeline

    I'm a big fan of the old "Victoria 1 - Revolutions", "Europa Universalis III - DW" and "Hearts of Iron II - Darkest Hour". However, "Victoria 2" and its expansion "Vic2 - A House Divided" looks really great and fantastic, but after playing for some time, I quickly loose interest and switch back to EUIII-DW because of the extremely owerpowered British and the un-historical unification attempts in Germany 1860-1871.

    Victoria 2, has great promise, but fatal short comings. Japan and Germany (two of the most succesful countries of this time period) hartly ever amount to anything.

    What if the game wasn't called Victoria 2, but "A Place In The Sun" instead, with a new starting point in 1871. Now Germany and Italy has formed, Japan has begun westernization, The United States was out of the civil war-era, Russia is a powerful back-water and Great Britain was ruling the waves.

    This way, all the great powers would be in a much better historic starting position. Germany and Japan wouldn't be sidelined. New end-point could be 1946 instead of 1936. Vic2 would now have been transformed into a rush for the colonies and carve up the world era-game, thus including the era of new-imperialism with the era of the World Wars...
    Last edited by nett40; 20-05-2012 at 13:17. Reason: correction
    I wish Paradox will make a WORLD WAR 1 game based on Victoria 2, but with a new start date: February 26th 1885 (Berlin Conference of 1884–85, also known as the Congo Conference or West Africa Conference).

  2. #2
    You can mod it pretty easily. Changing the start and end dates and adjusting countries' borders is very easy; events and decisions are a bit harder, but after some practice it's easy too.

  3. #3
    East vs West developer kunadam's Avatar
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    The hard work in a new start date for Vikcy is populations. One have to set all populations for each provinces across the globe.
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  4. #4
    IIRC that was the start date of the second scenario in the original Vicky.

  5. #5
    und Recht und Freiheit Einigkeit's Avatar
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    So... let's start a mod?

  6. #6
    Or you could just make Japan start as a civilized nation, move Saxony into the Prussian sphere of influence and give them ownership of Schleswig. This will cause Prussia to quickly form the North German Confederation (just needs to sphere two countries) and Japan saves all the time it would have normally spent teching up.

    If you don't want Japan to start civilied, just give them Land Reform and Education Reform
    land_reform = yes_land_reform
    education_reform = yes_education_reform

    This will make them civilize much faster than they normally do (aside from the 20% progress, the increase in money and effectiveness really helps researchpoint gain). They will quickly become a great or secondary power.

  7. #7
    Colonel Xenophon13's Avatar
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    You'd probably want to revamp the military system a bit too to make it better set up for WW2. Maybe replace some of the cavaly units with advanced tanks and motorized infantry.

  8. #8
    First Lieutenant nett40's Avatar
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    A good bonus for the developers, if they changed the starting point to 19 January 1871 (the day after Germany was founded in Versailles Palace's Hall of Mirrors in France), would be that Europe then only consisted of some 16 nations/states/kingdoms/empires etc. All European nations/states could thus easily get the original unit sprites of their military of that period.

    With this new timeline only the Balkans would still be a critical hotspot of national uprisings and conflict within Europe (as it was IRL). This way many difficult and tenious unification and revolutionary events could be scrapped al together, much less scripting (no US Civil War).

    All in all simply
    Last edited by nett40; 09-05-2012 at 16:34.
    I wish Paradox will make a WORLD WAR 1 game based on Victoria 2, but with a new start date: February 26th 1885 (Berlin Conference of 1884–85, also known as the Congo Conference or West Africa Conference).

  9. #9
    Field Marshal calvinhobbeslik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nett40 View Post
    A good bonus for the developers, if they changed the starting point to 19 January 1871 (the day after Germany was founded in Versailles Palace's Hall of Mirrors in France), would be that Europe then only consisted of some 16 nations/states/kingdoms/empires etc. All European nations/states could thus easily get the original unit sprites of their military of that period.

    With this new timeline only the Balkans would still be a critical hotspot of national uprisings and conflict within Europe (as it was IRL). This way many difficult and tenious unification and revolutionary events could be scrapped al together, much less scripting (no US Civil War).

    All in all simply
    16? Hmm, UK, Portugal, Spain, France, Belgium, Netherlands, Germany, Denmark, Sweden, Switzerland, Austria, Italy, Russia, Romania, Serbia, Greece, Montenegro, Ottoman Empire? That's 18, assuming that Bulgaria/Albania had not been independent then and not counting Luxembourg...

  10. #10
    First Lieutenant nett40's Avatar
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    Less than 20 European countries is still a very low number, compared to the number of starting European countries in the current Vic2-AHD timelines from both 1836 and 1861.

    Furthermore, if you change the starting date to 1871 the great powers that dominated global politics up until 1945 would all be present from the get go.
    Last edited by nett40; 12-05-2012 at 11:06.
    I wish Paradox will make a WORLD WAR 1 game based on Victoria 2, but with a new start date: February 26th 1885 (Berlin Conference of 1884–85, also known as the Congo Conference or West Africa Conference).

  11. #11
    First Lieutenant nett40's Avatar
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    The best thing if you start the game after the German unification in 1871, would be that the countries that actually took part in the "great game" for colonies and global dominance, would all be in existence.

    A lot less scripting would also be required as the new great powers (Germany, USA, Italy and Japan) would be ready to take on the old great powers (UK, Russia, Austria and France) from day one.

    A lot less cores in Germany and Italy, as they should be full nation states like France is (the blue bloob). No more South German, North German, North Italian or South Italian culture pops, there should simply be one culture per nation (ie. German pops and Italian pops). Just like the French nation has a single culture pop in the game. There is no North French, East French or South French culture pops. This would also prevent Italy and Germany from being "carved up" into smaller states following defeats.

    The Scottish cores in the UK could also be removed, as they are all British pops (no Scottish and English pops) only the Irish cores should remain beside the UK cores on the British Isles.

    Japan would, as said before, also be on its way and building up its industry and military base from day one.

    No tenious scripting needed for the purchase of Alaska from Russia, the American Civil War or the various conflicts between the US and Mexico, as these conflicts would all be in the past. Mexico could simply retain its cores on the American South West.

    Only one cavalry unit is needed, as the cavalry arm was loosing importance from 1870 and onwards. Instead there could be a motorized infantry unit, a paratrooper unit, armored car unit or a mechanized infantry unit.

    Submarine, Destroyer and Carrier should be added as late game naval units instead of the (1836-1861 era) early game units (Man'O'War, Frigate and Clipper transport).

    With these few changes the game could be extended to 1946. No scripting for the 1st or 2nd World War, as they wouldn't happen the way they did IRL. This way you don't intrude into the Hearts Of Iron-era series, as this wouldn't be a WW2 game.

    Instead this would be a game about the rivalry between the eight Great Powers that fought for global hegemony for a period of 75 years, between 1871 and 1946.
    Last edited by nett40; 29-05-2012 at 15:28. Reason: correction
    I wish Paradox will make a WORLD WAR 1 game based on Victoria 2, but with a new start date: February 26th 1885 (Berlin Conference of 1884–85, also known as the Congo Conference or West Africa Conference).

  12. #12
    This would be pretty cool for an expansion. A new scenario in 1871 is definitely something I'd like.

    The problem is that Victoria doesn't really model 20th century warfare that well. So the majority of the game would be plain bad for warfare.

    A ww1 expansion with 1871 and 1914 as start dates would be amazing if they fleshed out combat though.

  13. #13
    if you started it in 1878 after the russo turkish war bulgaria would exist austria would have bosnia and montenegro and serbia would be a bit bigger. plus it sort of makes the balklands ready for a coalition war against the ottomans cos all the members of the balkland league would be inderpendent. but really love this idea.

  14. #14
    First Lieutenant nett40's Avatar
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    If Paradox move the starting date to 18. January 1871, then you can integrate a lot more of the colonial states/puppets of this era into the game. I'm missing Syria, Jordan, Kuwait, Kenya, Tanzania, Rhodesia etc.

    I'm also missing more colonial cultures. If there is a limit on the number of available cultures, then you could replace the Texan, Dixie and Yankee cultures with an "Anglo-American" culture. This together with the unification of the Italian and German cultures would mean you could add four African or Asian cultures.

    These changes combined with a replacement of naval units from prior 1871. I'm thinking of the Man'O'War, Clipper and Monitor units, these obsolete units could be replaced with late era naval units such as Submarine, Destroyer and Carrier.

    The replacing of most cavalry units (Dragoon, Hussar and Cuirasseur) with Motorized Infantry, Paratroopers (able to loop into enemy territory far away) and Mechanized Infantry. This way PI could easily extend the timeline into the middle of the 1940'ies.

    You could get these vital colonial states/puppets into this Paradox game about the "Great Game" of european new imperialism (1880-1939). By simply making room for colonial states/puppets by deleting all the minor Italian and German minor states, such as Holstein, Anhalt, Bavaria, Würtemberg, Papal State, Parma, Lombardia, Sardinia-Piedmonte etc.
    Last edited by nett40; 28-05-2012 at 13:41. Reason: correction
    I wish Paradox will make a WORLD WAR 1 game based on Victoria 2, but with a new start date: February 26th 1885 (Berlin Conference of 1884–85, also known as the Congo Conference or West Africa Conference).

  15. #15
    While I do love the idea of a start at 1871 and even more 1878, I must say that trying to extend the time line is stupid. It would never ever work. Leave world war 2 to Hearts of Iron.

    I even think post ww1 is stupid. The game should technically end after the first great war because the great war was fought as a response to everything that happened during the 19th century and could be considered the climax of the era.

    That would of course require a massive great war overhaul, but I think it'd be nice, great wars right now is pretty stupid anyway. Spain grabbing Jutland when the great war is fought 1880 as the 2nd Franco-Prussian war.

  16. #16
    First Lieutenant nett40's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lullelulle View Post
    While I do love the idea of a start at 1871 and even more 1878, I must say that trying to extend the time line is stupid. It would never ever work. Leave world war 2 to Hearts of Iron.

    I even think post ww1 is stupid. The game should technically end after the first great war because the great war was fought as a response to everything that happened during the 19th century and could be considered the climax of the era.

    That would of course require a massive great war overhaul, but I think it'd be nice, great wars right now is pretty stupid anyway. Spain grabbing Jutland when the great war is fought 1880 as the 2nd Franco-Prussian war.
    I totally agree with most of this and I don't want to turn Vic2 into a HoI clone. WW2 should never occur in this paradoxical game anyway, hell even WW1 will never happen the way it did. But the game can easily handle to cover an extended time period, with only a few changes to the units.

    I find that the fun part about Vic2 is that you might manage to keep your Great Power out of any conflict, maybe even keeping the peace among the nations up untill 1939. However, there might also have been two or three Great Wars prior to 1914. The game should have a somewhat open ending and that is why I thought about 1946 - NOT because I want to make a remake of WW2 (that's best done in HoI) - But because that leaves the player time to play in the world he has helped create.

    Most cavalry units were obsolete by 1900 anyway, why not simply have fast infantry units instead. Move the tank a little closer to 1918, PI could make the infiltration-tech locked untill 1916. Motorized Infantry or Armoured cars could become available instead.

    Few people want to keep playing if they by 1930 have full control over the other great powers. However, if you are in a juggernaut buildup with Britan, France or the US, then it would be a shame to end the game by 1918 or 1930. Just imagine playing as Russia and having created a powerful Soviet Union by 1930 and now wants to take on the world (Red Alert-style). But, then the games ends in 1936, before your mighty tank brigades roll into the streets of New York!!!
    Last edited by nett40; 29-05-2012 at 15:42. Reason: clarification
    I wish Paradox will make a WORLD WAR 1 game based on Victoria 2, but with a new start date: February 26th 1885 (Berlin Conference of 1884–85, also known as the Congo Conference or West Africa Conference).

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