USA and GB, the only trully superpowers??

[edmarmota]

I've played Victoria 2 AHD for a couple of months, and in all my games GB or USA are the only consistent superpowers, is there any cheat of the AI to do so? On one game, france was the second power but just before the end had a war with prussia and GB, and although USA was her ally didn't enter that war (it does not become a great war because i play it with AHD not the 2.3 patch) and get kicked pretty bad ended out of GP status, final result GB on 2 and USA on 1.
On another game, I managed to challenge the USA as Mexico and fight two unsuccesfull wars against them (in both wars i've had technology advantage that seems don't matter against their might), that turn good just because i was allied with GB, but with heavy losses for me, then suddenly, after 1920's or so, and losing half of their army in the last war (finally i've learned how to fight a war in victoria 2), they raise a more powerful army that i can't counter, from 130 brigades to 300, and 400 brigades of mobilization pool, (i spoted it by loading a save game as the usa). Final result on that game GB 1 and USA 2, after a great war between GB and Austria(Austria with number one spot and number one military), even though GB lost Canada to the USA, Austria lost, (because after conquering canada the USA sign peace with GB) they both get the top spots.
Then i get suspicious and load the other late games i had (1890 and up), as both GB and USA,and they both had enourmous mobilization pools...if the AI had (as USA) at least 3 wars against Mexico, 2 against CSA, and two against GB, why their economy has that tremendous boost that they can manage to get that powerful army without bankrupt itself. Austria, Prussia and the other GP (aside GB, that's my point) didn't have so many wars and I assume that's why they get in that spot, they drop very fast of GP status if they get on a war with another GP on the top 5 spots. That didn't happen in all my games with either the USA or GB...
Is the game hardcoded??
I've seen the USA broke in many recorded games (in youtube) but never happened to me...any toughts??

[delra]

It isn't actually hardcoded, but each country has its own starting position and challenges. France for example requires quite some acrobatics to carve itself a good SoI overseas to fuel the industry and AI rarely does that. Austria struggles with a million minorities and low literacy prone to revolutions and having their industrial progress hampered, Germans are surrounded by enemies who don't want them to unite before they can start working on building a SoI overseas.

Brits start off with a massive overseas empire, are pre-industrialized and have access to vast resources. Americans get insane amounts of immigration throughout the game and also are quite capable of building themselves a solid SoI in Asia and South America in addition to their local wealth. That gives them some advantage over other AIs, as it should IMO.

If they are ever broken, it'd be through a revolution.

[airpirate]

Nothing's hard coded, it's just that both countries start in and almost always stay in really good positions. The USA gets a huge mobilization pool because it always gets lots and lots of immigrants that assimilate fairly quickly. Thus, it doesn't matter if they lose the South; they still get a massive population boost and, because the USA has some nice industrial resources, will remain very powerful. GB will always have tons of prestige (having tons of colonies helps with that), usually has a decent population, and gets tons and tons of resources from its colonies (and if it doesn't have the resource it needs in the colonies, it has the prestige to buy the goods from the world market). Besides, what would a game called Victoria 2 be without a powerful Britain?

[Jorlaan]

I made a personal mod at one point that removed the British from Siam, Johore, Burma and India. I made India a mixture of its independant states. With those changes alone the game took a massively different path every time, some very interesting games. Britain was far more restrained and it actually gave them an army more like history, not the overwhelming, unstoppable monster it becomes in this game.

[edmarmota]

so the only way to broke up USA are:
1) Mantain the CSA, never allowing to get annexed (if they get formed) and/or
2) Ally with GB or Russia, or Mexico if it managed to be GP, and incorporate a GB wargoal in any war against USA, (and hope that no other GP declares war to GB or manage to get GB involved in another war.

with both of these targets, never give up a war against them...

Another comment on the same subject...As Mexico, I've managed to sustain a battle against almost 30-40 USA brigades, with 20 or so mixed brigades, and as the strategies suggests, i'm also managed to get them circled (with troops around the province with the main battle, some occupating enemy soil and some on my own border). When the win battle window appears i was very happy because, as also the manual and the strategy guide and even the forums states (and i'm also watch on some youtube videos also), those 30 to 40 brigades MUST surrender, and been lost, but two days after the battle, suddenly i'm spammed with 30 brigades around the area ( in 1 to 3 groups max) and they only loose 10 brigades overall...on other area of the war frontier, they did the same to me (with 20 brigades of mine against 10 of theirs, and i'm circled), i've lost the battle but this time i'm lost all my brigades!!!.
On another war on the same game, this time against Austria, i did the same strategy on africa, but this time their brigades do surrender...so my conclusion was "the ai cheats with USA!!" (at least on me)...ja ja ja.

[delra]

To murder the USA, you need a revolt that'd overthrow their democracy and thus prevent immigration which is the oxygen in their lungs. Keep them occupied and remove their army, then just hope there's some motivation among their communists. :-)

Vicky2 is strange like that, that you'd rather border a communist country than a free one.

[Secret Master]

I'd say that the USA and GB being dominant powers is not that bad. I mean, the UK starts the historical period of the game at the top of the pecking order. They have a huge and wealthy colonial empire, they are ahead in commerce and industry, and they already have enough of a navy to make pushing them around difficult. Vic2 is not a game where everyone starts out equal. And neither is unbeatable, either. Although maximum fun is when they become deadly rivals for half the game; saves me the trouble of fighting either one.

[dskod1]

I would say it makes for some fun goals. Like completely dismantling the british empire or making the USA drop from great power status

[calvinhobbeslik]

It isn't actually hardcoded, but each country has its own starting position and challenges. France for example requires quite some acrobatics to carve itself a good SoI overseas to fuel the industry and AI rarely does that. Austria struggles with a million minorities and low literacy prone to revolutions and having their industrial progress hampered, Germans are surrounded by enemies who don't want them to unite before they can start working on building a SoI overseas.

Brits start off with a massive overseas empire, are pre-industrialized and have access to vast resources. Americans get insane amounts of immigration throughout the game and also are quite capable of building themselves a solid SoI in Asia and South America in addition to their local wealth. That gives them some advantage over other AIs, as it should IMO.

If they are ever broken, it'd be through a revolution.

France no longer spams Africa, since it doesn't take Algeria/Tunis and doesn't seem to reseach Machine Guns until too late.

[Beagá]

I´ve seen Italy get more colonies than them, indeed.

Problem is, colonial and non-accepted POPs are too productive and stable, making the UK way more powerful than it should, and Austria way more stable as well. That´s why Germany takes ages to form sometimes.

[delra]

But wasn't the UK way more powerful than it should in real history? And without the way more powerful than it should UK, wouldn't the board be a bit too easy for the player to dominate?

Regarding the techs, you can help debugging problems in them by posting 1880 or 1890 techs for all the relevant major powers, like this:

A 1 2 2 4 5
N 3 4 1 4 2
C 2 1 4 3 1
C 2 3 4 5 1
I 1 2 4 1 2

Where ANCCI is the names of each tech tree, and numbers mean researched technology level in each column from left to right. If you gather enough of such matrixes, we'll be able to see good and bad patterns in AI scripts.

Just remember that AI has a random factor to its research, so you can't expect optimal tech route all the time, just most of the times they will tend towards the optimal route. If most major powers aren't getting MGs in 9 out of 10 games, it's a problem, if it's 2 out of 10 games and only applies to one major power, it can be blamed on random factors.

[Finnish Dragon]

I think in 1836, Britain should be slightly weaker and having the British Raj in India as a puppet. Then Britain should develop something like Nationalism and Imperialism to inherit the British Raj as they historically did in 1857 after the Sepoy Rebellion.

[chals]

For some reason, USA get why more Immigrants then any other amercan contry, even if you take contry side into mind..

[GAGA Extrem]

The USA superpower status is softcoded. Statue of Liberty, homestead act and immigration bonus for being in North America more ore less kill any competition for immigrants by other countries.

The UK has by far the best starting position and is more or less immune to any invasion attempts (not to mention that the AI fails miserably at naval invasions ). But they can fail. I had a game where they suffered from several revolutions and fell to rank #6.

In general, the thing with V2 is that GPs have a huge advantage on the world marked, esp. the #1, so they tend to stay in the GP club because of better access to ressources.

[Beagá]

But in the end what really matters is population. Has anyone run a hands-off game as the UK to see if the proportion of englishmen increases? I mean, by migrations of indians, irish etc.?

As for the UK power, it quickly diminished as Germany and the US advanced. Germany in particular could already be considered more powerful than the UK by 1910 in many areas. However, since in game the UK remains with Canada etc, they always stay more powerful than they should (while NGF sometimes can´t even form the Empire due to not going after Austria´s spherelings).

[calvinhobbeslik]

But in the end what really matters is population. Has anyone run a hands-off game as the UK to see if the proportion of englishmen increases? I mean, by migrations of indians, irish etc.?

As for the UK power, it quickly diminished as Germany and the US advanced. Germany in particular could already be considered more powerful than the UK by 1910 in many areas. However, since in game the UK remains with Canada etc, they always stay more powerful than they should (while NGF sometimes can´t even form the Empire due to not going after Austria´s spherelings).

The reason they stay GP is India...Canada and Australia don't do much for them...

[delra]

Would Vicky be Vicky without the UK bullying the world... I feel like we need this kind of a nemesis on the board.

[Shiggs713]

But in the end what really matters is population. Has anyone run a hands-off game as the UK to see if the proportion of englishmen increases? I mean, by migrations of indians, irish etc.?

As for the UK power, it quickly diminished as Germany and the US advanced. Germany in particular could already be considered more powerful than the UK by 1910 in many areas. However, since in game the UK remains with Canada etc, they always stay more powerful than they should (while NGF sometimes can´t even form the Empire due to not going after Austria´s spherelings).

Exactly. Well, that and owning coal mines. My current game England has almost 300 million people (the most), its ridiculous. I'm playing as the USA, I've conquered roughly 1/3 of China, my population is increasing almost 100k per day, sometimes more when immigration flares up, and I still can't catch them in population. Rough estimates suggest that by the end of my game it should be close though, and I could easily catch them if I continue to gobble up half of china.

When I took a big chunk of china (sorry forgot the name) that was littered in coal, my industries instantly starting going berserk, rising a point or 2 everyday for a few years now, so maybe just maybe, I can pass them in both pop and industry without any direct intervention.

[Shiggs713]

The reason they stay GP is India...Canada and Australia don't do much for them...

maybe not much in terms of manpower, but Canada, South Africa, and Australia are all very profitable regions. Release Canada and play as them, you'll never have an easier time managing the budget, unless you do the same with South Africa. My point being is they are partly cash cows, plus a ton of Canada turns into oil or gold later in the game. Not to mention another few hundred prestige points for exclusive colonizing rights.

[KPJ]

I find Germany and Russia are often superpowers. Germany only fails to become a world power if they fail to become a country. Even NGF or SGF is generally a power-player. Then you always get a weird one thrown in like Ecuador or United States of Central America