How to Become English

[Geekrulez]

As the title states, how I do become English from Saxon ? I have seen all rulers and courtiers in England become English.
I created Kingdom of Brythain, though. Can I still be one ?

[SaintEsteban]

As the title states, how I do become English from Saxon ? I have seen all rulers and courtiers in England become English.
I created Kingdom of Brythain, though. Can I still be one ?

I don't think you can have an adult change culture, but letting someone with the proper culture educate your heir will handle things for future generations. Good luck!

[Geekrulez]

errrr. Are they English educated ? Nope. They were Saxon. They just suddenly become English and there is suddenly an English county.

[lenny]

The change to English should happen by special event (as long as you are saxon or norman and ruling in England.) I do not know what affects the speed of change, but you could speed up the change of your family by selecting English educators. (If there are already English vassals and courtiers around.)

[Geekrulez]

The change to English should happen by special event (as long as you are saxon or norman and ruling in England.) I do not know what affects the speed of change, but you could speed up the change of your family by selecting English educators. (If there are already English vassals and courtiers around.)

Then, all Saxon counties become English ? Will I get relation penalty and can request culture change to my vassal ? I have formed Brythania. Is it still possible ? Supposed in the end I got England and change primary title, will my Saxon vassals in Brythania change culture ?
Thanks.

[Isaios]

It triggers sometime after 1100, for any county within the Kingdom of England, has a MTTH of 1200 months and is impacted by having a high learning trait. At 13 Learning the MTTH drops to 380 months. It requires the demesne holder being Norman and the demesne culture to be Saxon.

Once the initial event fires, other event fire to make your court, vassals and provinces switch culture to English.

# The English Melting Pot
character_event = {
	id = 55002
	desc = "EVTDESC55002"
	picture = GFX_evt_throne_room
	
	trigger = {
		year = 1100
		culture = norman
		any_demesne_province = {
			kingdom = {
				title = k_england
			}
			culture = saxon
		}
	}
	
	mean_time_to_happen = {
		months = 1200
		modifier = {
			factor = 0.75
			learning = 7
		}
		modifier = {
			factor = 0.75
			learning = 9
		}
		modifier = {
			factor = 0.75
			learning = 11
		}
		modifier = {
			factor = 0.75
			learning = 13
		}
		modifier = {
			factor = 1.5
			NOT = { learning = 5 }
		}
		modifier = {
			factor = 1.5
			NOT = { learning = 3 }
		}
		modifier = {
			factor = 2.0
			NOT = { learning = 1 }
		}
	}

	option = {
		name = "EVTOPTA55002"
		culture = english
		random_demesne_province = {
			limit = {
				kingdom = {
					title = k_england
				}
				culture = saxon
			}
			culture = english
		}
	}
}

# It's spreading
character_event = {
	id = 55003
	desc = "EVTDESC55003"
	picture = GFX_evt_throne_room
	
	trigger = {
		year = 1100
		culture = english
		any_demesne_province = {
			kingdom = {
				title = k_england
			}
			OR = {
				culture = saxon
				culture = norman
			}
		}
	}
	
	mean_time_to_happen = {
		months = 720
	}

	option = {
		name = "EVTOPTA55003"
		random_demesne_province = {
			limit = {
				kingdom = {
					title = k_england
				}
				OR = {	
					culture = saxon
					culture = norman
				}
			}
			culture = english
		}
	}
}

#Make my court speak English
character_event = {
	id = 55004
	desc = "EVTDESC55004"
	picture = GFX_evt_throne_room

	trigger = {
		year = 1100
		culture = english
		top_liege = {
			primary_title = {
				title = k_england
			}
		}
		any_courtier = {
			OR = {
				culture = saxon
				culture = norman
			}
		}
	}
	
	mean_time_to_happen = {
		months = 120
	}

	option = {
		name = "EVTOPTA55004"
		random_courtier = {
			limit = {
				OR = {	
					culture = saxon
					culture = norman
				}
			}
			culture = english
			hidden_tooltip = {
				character_event = { id = 55006 days = 3 }
			}
		}
	}
}

#Make my vassal speak English
character_event = {
	id = 55005
	desc = "EVTDESC55005"
	picture = GFX_evt_throne_room

	trigger = {
		year = 1100
		culture = english
		top_liege = {
			primary_title = {
				title = k_england
			}
		}
		any_vassal = {
			OR = {
				culture = saxon
				culture = norman
			}
		}
	}
	
	mean_time_to_happen = {
		months = 720
	}

	option = {
		name = "EVTOPTA55005"
		random_vassal = {
			limit = {
				OR = {	
					culture = saxon
					culture = norman
				}
			}
			culture = english
			hidden_tooltip = {
				character_event = { id = 55006 days = 3 }
			}
		}
	}
}

character_event = {
	id = 55006
	desc = "EVTDESC55006"
	picture = GFX_evt_throne_room

	is_triggered_only = yes

	option = {
		name = "EVTOPTA55006"
		culture = english
	}
}

[moldeh]

It triggers sometime after 1100, for any county within the Kingdom of England, has a MTTH of 1200 months and is impacted by having a high learning trait. At 13 Learning the MTTH drops to 380 months. It requires the demesne holder being Norman and the demesne culture to be Saxon.

Once the initial event fires, other event fire to make your court, vassals and provinces switch culture to English.

# The English Melting Pot
character_event = {
	id = 55002
	desc = "EVTDESC55002"
	picture = GFX_evt_throne_room
	
	trigger = {
		year = 1100
		culture = norman
		any_demesne_province = {
			kingdom = {
				title = k_england
			}
			culture = saxon
		}
	}
	
	mean_time_to_happen = {
		months = 1200
		modifier = {
			factor = 0.75
			learning = 7
		}
		modifier = {
			factor = 0.75
			learning = 9
		}
		modifier = {
			factor = 0.75
			learning = 11
		}
		modifier = {
			factor = 0.75
			learning = 13
		}
		modifier = {
			factor = 1.5
			NOT = { learning = 5 }
		}
		modifier = {
			factor = 1.5
			NOT = { learning = 3 }
		}
		modifier = {
			factor = 2.0
			NOT = { learning = 1 }
		}
	}

	option = {
		name = "EVTOPTA55002"
		culture = english
		random_demesne_province = {
			limit = {
				kingdom = {
					title = k_england
				}
				culture = saxon
			}
			culture = english
		}
	}
}

# It's spreading
character_event = {
	id = 55003
	desc = "EVTDESC55003"
	picture = GFX_evt_throne_room
	
	trigger = {
		year = 1100
		culture = english
		any_demesne_province = {
			kingdom = {
				title = k_england
			}
			OR = {
				culture = saxon
				culture = norman
			}
		}
	}
	
	mean_time_to_happen = {
		months = 720
	}

	option = {
		name = "EVTOPTA55003"
		random_demesne_province = {
			limit = {
				kingdom = {
					title = k_england
				}
				OR = {	
					culture = saxon
					culture = norman
				}
			}
			culture = english
		}
	}
}

#Make my court speak English
character_event = {
	id = 55004
	desc = "EVTDESC55004"
	picture = GFX_evt_throne_room

	trigger = {
		year = 1100
		culture = english
		top_liege = {
			primary_title = {
				title = k_england
			}
		}
		any_courtier = {
			OR = {
				culture = saxon
				culture = norman
			}
		}
	}
	
	mean_time_to_happen = {
		months = 120
	}

	option = {
		name = "EVTOPTA55004"
		random_courtier = {
			limit = {
				OR = {	
					culture = saxon
					culture = norman
				}
			}
			culture = english
			hidden_tooltip = {
				character_event = { id = 55006 days = 3 }
			}
		}
	}
}

#Make my vassal speak English
character_event = {
	id = 55005
	desc = "EVTDESC55005"
	picture = GFX_evt_throne_room

	trigger = {
		year = 1100
		culture = english
		top_liege = {
			primary_title = {
				title = k_england
			}
		}
		any_vassal = {
			OR = {
				culture = saxon
				culture = norman
			}
		}
	}
	
	mean_time_to_happen = {
		months = 720
	}

	option = {
		name = "EVTOPTA55005"
		random_vassal = {
			limit = {
				OR = {	
					culture = saxon
					culture = norman
				}
			}
			culture = english
			hidden_tooltip = {
				character_event = { id = 55006 days = 3 }
			}
		}
	}
}

character_event = {
	id = 55006
	desc = "EVTDESC55006"
	picture = GFX_evt_throne_room

	is_triggered_only = yes

	option = {
		name = "EVTOPTA55006"
		culture = english
	}
}

Now here's the thing...like Isaios just pointed out, you need to have a Normal king of England to get the english culture to pop up. However, even when Harold survives (which is very often), his heirs somehow end up being English, which, according to this shouldn't be happening, as, instead, the Saxons should keep being Saxons. It's really weird.

[skibear]

There should be a popup that says 'Congratulations, you won first prize in the lottery of life'

[Isaios]

Now here's the thing...like Isaios just pointed out, you need to have a Normal king of England to get the english culture to pop up. However, even when Harold survives (which is very often), his heirs somehow end up being English, which, according to this shouldn't be happening, as, instead, the Saxons should keep being Saxons. It's really weird.

Do you mean if Harold survives as king? If so, that's wierd, but if he just survives with the Bastard as king, then that fulfills the event requirements.

There should be a popup that says 'Congratulations, you won first prize in the lottery of life'

Nono, that's being a prince of Saud

[moldeh]

No, the Godwins stay in power and yet England becomes English. No idea how or why. And there definitely aren't any Normans there either.

[Sleight of Hand]

No, the Godwins stay in power and yet England becomes English. No idea how or why. And there definitely aren't any Normans there either.

That's a bug. Report it. English culture should never appear unless the Normans take England.

[Isaios]

No, the Godwins stay in power and yet England becomes English. No idea how or why. And there definitely aren't any Normans there either.

I can't explain that. Looking at the event code, it certainly LOOKS like it'll only trigger for a Norman... This might possibly belong in bug reports.

[moldeh]

I can't explain that. Looking at the event code, it certainly LOOKS like it'll only trigger for a Norman... This might possibly belong in bug reports.

I'm actually gonna look in older saves and see if there's anything there...Maybe the Normans only got enough holdings to grab 100% warscore, stayed in power for a while, triggered the event and then got deposed by the Saxons again. However, I've seen it happen at least twice so I don't know...but you do have a valid point, it shouldn't be happening

[Isaios]

IF they were kings for a bit (and you can check that in the title history rather than savegames) then the initial event might have triggered, causing the latter events to trigger as well after Saxon reconquest.

[moldeh]

IF they were kings for a bit (and you can check that in the title history rather than savegames) then the initial event might have triggered, causing the latter events to trigger as well after Saxon reconquest.

Yeah, that's what I'm thinking. I'm gonna go check it out soonish.

[guitarspider]

If you're a Saxon duke or count in England and your liege has changed culture to English, there is also an option to change culture next to have a feast and so on. Or at least there was when I played my first game.

[AlexanderPrimus]

IMHO there's really no need for separate Saxon and English cultures.

Prior to the Conquest, English meant Anglo-Saxon. Having Saxon suddenly shift to English would be like having Teuton suddenly change to German, or Frankish to French.

After the Conquest, English still meant Anglo-Saxon, there were just a few thousand Normans running the show.

Ultimately the Norman interlopers anglicized to a degree, becoming Anglo-Norman.

However, I think it's silly to have the post-Conquest Kings of England have English culture. For instance, Richard I spoke both French and Occitan, but was not very good with English.

If memory serves, the first post-Conquest King of England to learn English as his native tongue was Henry V. That's astonishingly late.

[Nick B II]

Keep in mind that the primary reason culture is included in this game is so that everyone's name is right. That was the only thing most CK1 cultures did -- Mongols got some bonuses to represent the hordes; and Greeks, Georgians, and Armenians got loyalty bonuses to the Byzantine Empire; but that was it. The stuff that's been added since then, such as cultural buildings and cultural loyalty bonuses, are nice but clearly not the reason culture was put in the game.

Which means it doesn't really matter that, to almost every Englishman in the period, there was no sudden cultural shift. What matters is that Egbert and Aethelred gave way to Richard and Henry; and that modern gamers would think it was really weird if Henry II was spelled Henri II, even if the RL Henry II spent almost all his time being Henri.

Nick

[AlexanderPrimus]

Well that's just it, isn't it?

Robert, Richard, Henry and William were all names brought over from Normandy.

You had a few holdovers that became popular with the aristocracy like Edward and Edmund, but the English royalty were all Francophone at that point. And they were even more French after the Angevins took over.

Personally I don't have a problem with things being depicted how they really were. Let the Frenchies be Frenchies.

[Isaios]

The shift is also there to remove the wrong culture-group malus. That and the names makes the change both nescessary and desireable.