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Thread: The Golden Horde is too strong?

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by matnormyth89 View Post
    is there a bug with my game?

    when Ikhanate appear, i got 5k gold and near 60k army (which doesn't need gold expense/maintenance) spawn in the east..i use that army to conquer some area (seljuk-whatever)..

    then golden horde appear, and same as before i got 5k gold and 60k army..i expand really fast at that area..is it a bug?
    Are you playing as a Zoroastrian/Tengri?

  2. #22
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    Like others have said, once they're out of their 50-120K doomstacks, they're pretty much manageable. In some situations you can perhaps force a fight in a coastal province with a 40K supply limit. It takes three days to load or unload an army and attrition doesn't apply to those armies which are currently in battle (if it's the same as EU3), so you can sometimes escape attrition if you slow down the game speed and put the other instalment on the ships after unloading the previous portion of your army to another coastal province within the range of the same ship. I've used ships a lot to shuffle armies. You can also keep reinforcements shipborne until the Mongols come into contact with your army that waits for them (check the arrival date in the tooltip for the enemy army and begin unloading 2 days before that date, and then your army will unload from ships one day after the battle started; you can try and make it on the same day but sometimes the opponent somehow manages to cancel the move order if you try to make it the precise same day, so I add that one day).
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  3. #23
    I don't want my Mongols to convert. I like the free casus belli holy wars!

  4. #24
    In a hands off game the golden horde expanded to almost exactly their historical borders (including Russia though since vassal states aren't simulated well).
    I was wondering when they would start to eat the world but it seems they had reached critical mass, much like the Aztecs in the west who had conquered lots of territories but had their special troops decimated by the HRE.
    If the doomstacks fall they usually stagnate. You sometimes get a Seljuk-fatmid combination early in the game that stops ilkhanate from even getting started.

  5. #25
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    The only fix I think the hordes need is to refocus their scope. The Ilkhanate seems to like going north rather than into Persia. As for the Golden Horde, they go too far North as well. Ilkhanate should focus on taking out Persia, Mesopatamia, Egypt, and Anatolia. The Golden Horde should look to hit Russia, eastern Europe, central Europe, and Western Europe.

    I know that sounds too deterministic but I think it will lead to better gameplay.
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  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stratagyfan101 View Post
    The only fix I think the hordes need is to refocus their scope. The Ilkhanate seems to like going north rather than into Persia. As for the Golden Horde, they go too far North as well. Ilkhanate should focus on taking out Persia, Mesopatamia, Egypt, and Anatolia. The Golden Horde should look to hit Russia, eastern Europe, central Europe, and Western Europe.

    I know that sounds too deterministic but I think it will lead to better gameplay.
    Sorry this will sound like legal jargon but I believe the game should have a tendency to follow the most natural course (most predictable, most probable, not necessarily the smartest) from an ex-ante perspective. This is really only a result (even a by-result) of replicating the circumstances as they were. If the circumstances can't be replicated fully, then adding some "determinism" could help gain some impression of it. But it would be best to replicate the circumstances (not the minute details but rather the gist of them) and have an accurate mechanism for implementing the effects of particular character traits of the decision-makers to supply the human factor.
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  7. #27
    Can someone help me?

    I was playing as a Russian duke and got conquered by the Golden Horde. Now 60 years and two generations later, I am a mongol high chief. However I have not been able to acquire any more land because the GH has absolute authority and I have no chance of reducing because they also have a 125k doomstack. Any advice on how to lower authority?

    Also, do the mongol nations always convert? In my game, the GH are converting all their provinces to Tengri. The orthodox religion is almost wiped out.

  8. #28
    They convert eventually. And when they do, all the Tengri lands instantly become whatever they convert to.

    As for your doomstack problem, just gotta wait it out I guess. I never played a Russian faction for this very reason lol.

  9. #29
    they are like the end game boss

  10. #30
    After some reading up on the Mongols particularly their army composition and tactics, I find it very unhistorical that they'd even venture up the Karelian Penisula or farther north and northwest. As geography goes, that particular region is as unfriendly to horse archer armies as you humanely can get. Deep and dense forests, hills, mountains cut deeply by numerous rivers, fjords and lakes. And a extremely long coastline that the Nordic navies could easily utilize for strikes along the Mongol supply lines or picking off straggling groups ala Viking style raids.

    Eastern Europe for the most part is open plains..completely suited to the Mongols. However there is a reason the Mongols were in such a hurry to get out of Croatia because they were getting chewed up in Croat mountain ambushes.

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlexanderSirius View Post
    In my game, they got Northern Europe, when I finished my fight with Spainish Muslum
    I found they beated my dynasty ally Norway..
    Even they always have civil war, but sooner will be ok...
    I am very affraid I am the next...Fighting with spainish already used much of my spirint...


    How to make them weaker, and in real history they always go back to east to fight for the throne of empire.
    not expand their land in west so crazy...

    Apologies for not reading through the other answers first but I'm extremely tired and already halfway through my mug o'sleeping herbs. These may already have been said. The Mongols are supposed to be awfully strong. The reason why they didn't camp at Paris was perhaps that they couldn't really stretch that far logistically (and counting on much expansion by means of vassal levies was limited) but more so that they simply went back to their own to argue about choosing the new leader when the old one died. This was basically the invasion stopper. Only Ilkhanate couldn't really overwhelm the Mamluks but otherwise they tended to be near-unstoppable for a long time after they first appeared. They were tough to deal with up until 15th century and later.

    In short, the most powerful enemy of the Mongols were the Mongols themselves.

    Only that they had superior leadership and military training (individual skill and group act) rather than attrition-free dogpilestacks of doom. Had a couple of death occurred at different times, who knows what could have happened.

    I must confess my big dream with CK2 is to inherit a khaganate as a Catholic ruler from the outside (and not with a claim war, which is doable, I forced a Catholic claimant on them once but reloaded and couldn't repeat the success).
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  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Urzhail64 View Post
    After some reading up on the Mongols particularly their army composition and tactics, I find it very unhistorical that they'd even venture up the Karelian Penisula or farther north and northwest. As geography goes, that particular region is as unfriendly to horse archer armies as you humanely can get. Deep and dense forests, hills, mountains cut deeply by numerous rivers, fjords and lakes. And a extremely long coastline that the Nordic navies could easily utilize for strikes along the Mongol supply lines or picking off straggling groups ala Viking style raids.

    Eastern Europe for the most part is open plains..completely suited to the Mongols. However there is a reason the Mongols were in such a hurry to get out of Croatia because they were getting chewed up in Croat mountain ambushes.
    True enough.
    There really should be some summer/winter season and/or terrain based attrition.
    Like imagine hordes of horse archers marching in frosen mountains - i doubt they would get far. Even if they are harsh and weather resistant as mongols.

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