[Forum Game] - World in Revolution: 1861

[Spectre17]

OOC: Fry you need to give me 100 gold and take that from the Dutch because of the treaty of Jamaica.

[Shock3r]

OOC: Whens the update?

[Morrell8]

OOC: Tomorrow morning for us I'd wager.

[Red Cesar]

Ic.

[Muskeato]

The Union provisionally recognises the Taiping government.

[Thandros]

The Qing Emperor Is angered by the foolish decision of the Union to Recognise the Taiping Rebels. Does no one realise that if you recognise one group of Rebels you instantly Legitimize all others even those opposing your own government. The Emperor asks all nations to think twice before recognising a band of rebels. Even Provisionally it will have the same effect.

[Seek75]

Staatpresident Marthinus Pretorius van die Zuid-Afrikaansche Republiek

And how is a recognition of one group of rebels recognition of all? There are cases in which rebellion is justified and cases where it is not. The Heavenly Kingdom's rebellion against you is, in this case, more than justified, as you are a horrible and inept leader that must slaughter 80% of his bureaucracy in order for his government to just barely function. The southern rebels, however, have no excuse for their rebellion save some flimsy excuse of "state's rights" (despite the fact that nullification could have very easily solved that very same problem without their pointless revolt).

Furthermore, you recognized the rebel government currently occupying the southern United States, did you not? Therefore, you have absolutely no room to chaste anyone on the recognition of rebels.

[King50000]

As of now, there is no southern United States. We are not a rebel group, but an independent nation. The US recognizes us, so there is no excuse for you to claim us as nothing more than rebels. We have more legitamacy as a nation at this point than the Taiping rebels. You would do well to remember that.

[Seek75]

Staatpresident Marthinus Pretorius van die Zuid-Afrikaansche Republiek

Your legitimacy will be proven when your occupation survives more than twenty years without becoming a leech on the Union. This I doubt very much, however.

[King50000]

A leech does nothing more than live off of its host. The Confederate States have no reason to live off of the US. We will become a successful and thriving nation of our own accord through the cooperation of our friends in Brazil, Spain, the Netherlands, and whoever else may wish to be friends with our just and honorable government.

[Thandros]

The Qing Emperor finds the Boer lack of Knowledge Disturbing. The CSA left the Union it never rebelled against it. The Union made the choice to try and force them back in with Violence and war. The Taiping Rebels only took up arms because a number of local Qing Officials of the Previous Emperor decided to try and suppress the Religious movement that Hong Xiuquan set up. Such events would never happen now days as their is Freedom of Religion in Qing China. In fact if Hong's Movement had grown large enough his movement may even have been Granted one of the Seats on the National Council assigned to various religious groups in China. This rebellion would never have happen if more Forward Thinking Ideas had been in place. You can't blame the Current Emperor for his predecessors' mistakes cam you. The Qing would happily negotiate with the Rebels but they refuse to put anything better in front of us in terms of offers than Offering to Exile the Qing Emperor and his Officials to distant parts of the Empire to form new states. These offers can't be accepted by the Emperor and so the Rebellion must continue.

[Muskeato]

The Union reminds the Qing that the Southern states fired upon federal property and declared war while we asked for negotiations.

As a footnote, the Taiping government has been formally recognised by the executive office as a legitimate government. The government of the South has not.

[Duke of Britain]

The Union reminds the Qing that the Southern states fired upon federal property and declared war while we asked for negotiations.

As a footnote, the Taiping government has been formally recognised by the executive office as a legitimate government. The government of the South has not.

OOC : Fry stated that the CSA independence was secured in the mini-update.

You recognized it and will sign a treaty, and if both of you don't come to an agreement Fry will make a treaty that will be worse than anything both of you could agree to (At least if i remember that's what he said)

[Muskeato]

OOC : Fry stated that the CSA independence was secured in the mini-update.

You recognized it and will sign a treaty, and if both of you don't come to an agreement Fry will make a treaty that will be worse than anything both of you could agree to (At least if i remember that's what he said)

OOC: "You recognized it" Is the only bit I might dispute :P 'Independent' and 'Legitimate government' or not synonymous.

[Thandros]

The Qing Emperor reminds the Union that the Confederates first fired upon illegally occupied Property which Rightfully belonged to South Carolina which was part of the Confederacy. He also reminds them that the Confederacy has a Legal basis in their withdraw from the Federated Union State which never banned Secession. Further More your recognition has no more importance than any other nations. The Taiping have been recognised by 4 nations, The Confederates have been Recognised by more if the Emperor has been given correct Information. That means the Confederate Government is more legitimate than the Taiping Rebels who have no real legal basis in their Rebellion.

[Muskeato]

OOC: Not going to argue any of that because I've done it before and I have something against circles. Cool viewpoint.

Actually sod it, I will say one thing

The Union agrees it has never taken a stand against the word succession. We do however dislike monarchies in general due to our political views. We are confused as to how 'succession' legalises war.

[King50000]

OOC: Muskeato, you do recognize us, go back and reread the mini-update if you don't believe us.
And Duke, save your breath. He hasn't been listening to me when I told him that exact same sentence.

[Thandros]

OOC: Dammit Wrong word tanks for the Heads up Muskeato

The Qing Emperor reminds the Union that the Qing is now what is called a Constitutional Monarchy like Britain and Germany and a new home to a basic form of Democracy and not the Autocratic Taiping.

[Syber]

Argentina finds amusing seeing a chinese ruler, with no concept or grasping of legal matters trying to lecture the USA Government on their own law.

[Seek75]

Staatpresident Marthinus Pretorius van die Zuid-Afrikaansche Republiek

The Qing Emperor seems to be delusional, though what else can be expected of uncivilized heathen rabble? It was the rebel government that attacked Fort Sumter, which was not in fact the property of South Carolina but in fact property of the federal government of the United States.

Furthermore, again, any claim that secession is legal and necessary is a claim made in complete ignorance of the doctrine of nullification, which would very easily solve the very same problem secession would but without needless conflict.

And, last but not least, you are no constitutional monarchy. You are an autocrat attempting to disguise his power through rubber-stamp organizations, just like the Roman Empire of old, though I suppose you would not know of such things. To you, anything less than outright, blatant absolutism must be democracy.