+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 78

Thread: Historical Inaccuracies in AHD

  1. #1
    General in Chief of the CSA Projekt 919's Avatar
    Crusader Kings IICommander: Conquest of the AmericasFor the MotherlandHearts of Iron IIIHOI3: Their Finest Hour
    March of the EaglesSemper FiVictoria 2500k clubEuropa Universalis IV

    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    In Exile
    Posts
    1,429

    Historical Inaccuracies in AHD

    I Would like to start this thread by saying I love paradox interactive games and reaaly love some of the new game mechanincs in AHD. However, I noticed several (Many?) historical errors in the 1861 scenario. I Do not want this to become a AHD/Paradox bashing thread but rather intend it to serve a a list for dev assistance in later patches or as a assist to modders. I Would ask players of AHD to please submit any inaccuracies they notice to this thread as well.

    Overall List of Needed/Requested Changes

    Technologies
    Small Arms - For both the USA and CSA breechloading rifles are enabled at start. However there were no breechloading rifles in either army until 1865 and even then it was not a standard weapon. Whearas Prussia, who introduced breech-loading rifles as early as 1849 ("Needle Gun"), still only has flintlock rifle tech. The same applies for the OE 1861 which in RL at this time was equipped with 1853 Enfields ("Muzzle Loading Rifles") but also is stuck on Flintlocks. Although I cannot be certain, I assume there kinds of errors are widespread.

    Territorial Inaccuracies

    Paraguay - Paraguay should own Alto Paraguay in 1861, atlthough disputed between Bolivia and Paraguay the latter had a much more solid claim and control over the area.

    Dominican Republic - Should be a Colony of Spain, It reverted to this status only a month before the start date.

    Tunis - Should be a Vassal of Ottoman Empire, not a possesion of it.

    The Ionian Islands - should still be a satellite of Britain and not a part of Greece yet. The Treaty of London handing over the islands wasn't signed until 1864.

    Ifni province - should be owned by Spain. They captured it in the Spanish–Moroccan War in 1860.

    Zanzibar - should exist as a starting country (its cores are already there). It gained independence from Oman a few months before the start of the game.

    France - should not control the main Comoros Islands, only Mayotte. They gained Mayotte in 1841, but didn't establish a protectorate over the other islands until 1886.

    USA/CSA - Discussion ongoing about where the border between the Union and the South should be.

    Holstien - Should still be a vassal of Denmark rather than a part of Prussia

    Countries in Need of overall rework

    Ottoman Empire - The list of innacuracies has the greatest concentration regarding the Ottoman Empire. Technologies need a total rework, the OOB (Many Irregulars despite Ottoman Armies rapid modernization prior to and immediatly afterward the crimean war) is also in need of some TLC. in 1861 Egypt could or could not have have been construed as a Ottoman Vassal so I'll leave that up to the individual interpreter. Also, despite industrial score (Regardless of the accuarcy of a 0 industrial score in 1861) the Ottomans qualify (Historically) as much more of a great power than Belgium.

    Rebellions

    The Taiping Rebeliion - in China was at its Height in 1861 but is completely absent from V2. The result is a ahistorically stable China and completely changes the dynamics of the 1860's Far East.

    The Caste War - Although Obscure, large areas of the Yucutan were part of a independent Maya State for large sections of the 19th century. At the very least this area should be occupied by rebels in 1861 and possibly even be a uncivilized nation.

    This thread is submitted in the utmost respect for the Moderators and Employees of Paradox Interactive and in the Belief that it is not in Violation of any forum rules.
    Last edited by Projekt 919; 06-02-2012 at 06:43.
    1st Knight and Grandmaster of the Order of Southern Paradoxians
    Unreconstructed and Nationalist Southern Intellectual
    Descendant of James Clarke Taylor, Who's 34th Georgia Regiment was sacrificed in vain by General Pemberton in an attempt to slow the Northern Armies
    A believer in that faint glimmer of hope that we Southerners will not fall into the dustbin of history and may one day have our own Country Again
    Avid reader and student of Faulkner
    Expert on North Korea and lover of History in General
    Permenant Fan (And within Paradox Games, Player) of Lost Causes
    Student of International Affairs
    Confederate Ronin of Clan Taylor, second to Tufto-san, the Daimyo of Groan
    (Join the Order of Southern Paradoxians at: http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/...hp?groupid=531 and I will send you your Number by PM)

  2. #2
    Field Marshal Gaius Marius I's Avatar
    EU3 CompleteDivine WindHeir to the ThroneVictoria: RevolutionsVictoria 2
    Victoria II: A House DividedVictoria II: Heart of DarknessV2 BetaV2 AHD Beta500k club

    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
    Posts
    3,632
    And just to correct a couple of your own innacuracies :

    - USA certainly should have Breech-Loading Rifles; the Sharps rifle was developed by 1861 in the USA and was used by the sharshooter batallions and in carbine form by the cavalry (although the regular infantry regiments ofc continued to use rifled muskets as the primary arm until 1865).

    - Romania recieved the north bank of the Danube at the Treaty of Paris in 1856; Russia regained it after the Russo-Turkish War in the 1870s. So the ownership is correct

    And my 2 cents as a MP player on Tunisia:

    - Tunisia is probably more correct as a vassal, although putting it under direct Ottoman rule perhaps opens more possibilities for modders to simulate the Bardo treaty or a war in lieu of it, and in game terms a transfer to French rule via the free people wargoal (if they are just a vassal, the French have to fight two wars to first free the puppet and then make puppet)
    Gaius Marius

    First Man in Rome
    7 Consulships

    ICQ#: 574097267
    MSN: allpowerfull2000@yahoo.com

  3. #3
    Master of the Universe CaptRobau's Avatar
    Achtung PanzerArsenal of DemocracyCities in MotionCrusader Kings IIDeus Vult
    EU3 CompleteDivine WindFor The GloryHearts of Iron IIIHeir to the Throne
    Iron CrossMajesty 2Victoria: RevolutionsRome GoldSemper Fi
    Sword of the StarsSupreme Ruler 2020 GoldVictoria 2Victoria II: A House Divided500k club

    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Netherlands
    Posts
    2,659
    -If you research a tech, it means your entire army gets it. If the USA has breech-loading rifles researched, it means every soldier was equipped with a breech-loading rifle. As this was not the case (most soldiers on both sides still had muzzle-loading rifles, except the aforementioned Sharpshooters which number a thousand men or so), Projekt 919's point still stands.

    -Tunisia is even better represented as being in the Ottoman sphere. The Tunisian bey was more worried about the Ottomans encroaching upon his independence than the French. The Ottoman Empire should start slipping of the Great Power stage during the second half of the 19th century. If that happens Tunisia will become unprotected and viable for annexation by France or another European power. Just like in RL.

  4. #4
    First Secretary Frymonmon's Avatar
    Arsenal of DemocracyHearts of Iron 2: ArmageddonCities in Motion 2Crusader Kings IIDarkest Hour
    East India Company CollectionEU3 CompleteDivine WindFor the MotherlandHearts of Iron III
    Heir to the ThroneLead and GoldMarch of the EaglesVictoria: RevolutionsSemper Fi
    SengokuVictoria 2Victoria II: A House DividedVictoria II: Heart of Darkness500k club
    Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order

    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    New Hampshire
    Posts
    751
    Here's my two cents...

    - "Butternut" Region in Southern Illinois and Indiana

    This area was populated by Southern whites who were distinctively different from the Northerners. I feel this small minority should be represented with a small splattering of Dixie POPs in southern Illinois and Indiana. This area has been traditionally tied with the Southern states, and there was even a fear, albeit ever so slight, that this area would separate from the Union and join the Confederate cause should Kentucky or Missouri secede.

    - Balkh should belong to Afghanistan

    This area was captured by Afghanistan in 1850, and has remained a part of the country since then. Meaning it should have a core placed here as well.
    Founder and Creator of World in Revolution

    Awarded WritAAR of the Week Feb 05, 2012 | 3rd Place Winner of the AARland Choice AwAARds 2012 (Round 2) for Empire of the Pacific | Awarded Fan of the Week September 16th, 2012 | Awarded 2012 VictAARian Cross for Empire of the Pacific

  5. #5
    Lt. General Sakkura's Avatar
    Cities in MotionCrusader Kings IIDarkest HourEU3 CompleteDivine Wind
    For the MotherlandHearts of Iron IIIHeir to the ThroneEuropa Universalis: RomeSemper Fi
    Victoria 2Victoria II: A House DividedVictoria II: Heart of Darkness500k clubEuropa Universalis IV: Pre-order

    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Denmark
    Posts
    1,266
    - Holstein should be a Danish puppet in the 1861 scenario just like in the 1836 scenario. Nothing really changed between those dates, since the war in 1848 was a stalemate.

  6. #6
    Field Marshal calvinhobbeslik's Avatar
    Crusader Kings IIEuropa Universalis: ChroniclesVictoria 2Victoria II: A House DividedVictoria II: Heart of Darkness
    500k clubEuropa Universalis IV: Pre-orderEUIV: Call to arms event

    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    San Jose
    Posts
    5,747
    Quote Originally Posted by Sakkura View Post
    - Holstein should be a Danish puppet in the 1861 scenario just like in the 1836 scenario. Nothing really changed between those dates, since the war in 1848 was a stalemate.
    IIRC, Holstein has been annexed by Prussia in the 61 scenario?
    Location: San Francisco
    Nationality: Anglo-Indian
    Religion: Atheist
    Ideology: Democratic Socialism
    Issues: Interventionism, Free Trade, Full Citizenship, Anti-Military, Atheism, Excellent Health Care, Excellent Safety, Universal Suffrage,
    Current Work: Student
    Cash Reserves: 0
    Revolt Risk: +0
    Militancy: 3.14
    Consciousness: 10

  7. #7
    Lt. General Sakkura's Avatar
    Cities in MotionCrusader Kings IIDarkest HourEU3 CompleteDivine Wind
    For the MotherlandHearts of Iron IIIHeir to the ThroneEuropa Universalis: RomeSemper Fi
    Victoria 2Victoria II: A House DividedVictoria II: Heart of Darkness500k clubEuropa Universalis IV: Pre-order

    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Denmark
    Posts
    1,266
    Quote Originally Posted by calvinhobbeslik View Post
    IIRC, Holstein has been annexed by Prussia in the 61 scenario?
    Yep, and it shouldn't be. The duke of Holstein was Frederik VII of Denmark until his death in 1863. Prussia annexed Holstein and Slesvig in war the following year.

  8. #8
    The Confederacy should start with its portion of the New Mexico territory as it had in 1861. I think vicky 1 had this, why not AHD?

  9. #9
    First Lieutenant XXLPlakat's Avatar
    Arsenal of DemocracyCrusader Kings IIDarkest HourEU3 CompleteDivine Wind
    For the MotherlandHearts of Iron IIIHeir to the ThroneMagickaVictoria: Revolutions
    Rome GoldSemper FiSengokuSupreme Ruler: Cold WarVictoria 2
    Victoria II: A House DividedVictoria II: Heart of DarknessRome: Vae VictisRise of Prussia500k club
    Europa Universalis IV

    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Germany,Germany
    Posts
    293
    Its strange, that Prussia just have muzzle-loaded rifles in the 1861 scenario. An Military Power house in Europe is far poorer equipped than the southern states.
    Quote Originally Posted by Labrynian Rebel View Post
    Crusader King II: So You Thought You Were a Good Person

  10. #10
    Lt. General Sakkura's Avatar
    Cities in MotionCrusader Kings IIDarkest HourEU3 CompleteDivine Wind
    For the MotherlandHearts of Iron IIIHeir to the ThroneEuropa Universalis: RomeSemper Fi
    Victoria 2Victoria II: A House DividedVictoria II: Heart of Darkness500k clubEuropa Universalis IV: Pre-order

    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Denmark
    Posts
    1,266
    Quote Originally Posted by XXLPlakat View Post
    Its strange, that Prussia just have muzzle-loaded rifles in the 1861 scenario. An Military Power house in Europe is far poorer equipped than the southern states.
    Especially when they were among the first to introduce a breech-loading rifle as standard equipment, and those rifles are noted among the reasons for Prussian military success in the 1860s.

  11. #11
    General in Chief of the CSA Projekt 919's Avatar
    Crusader Kings IICommander: Conquest of the AmericasFor the MotherlandHearts of Iron IIIHOI3: Their Finest Hour
    March of the EaglesSemper FiVictoria 2500k clubEuropa Universalis IV

    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    In Exile
    Posts
    1,429
    Quote Originally Posted by thunderbird2099 View Post
    The Confederacy should start with its portion of the New Mexico territory as it had in 1861. I think vicky 1 had this, why not AHD?
    Control was disputed even over that area. However, they gave the CSA Kentucky (Also Disputed) so I guess they figure it balances.
    1st Knight and Grandmaster of the Order of Southern Paradoxians
    Unreconstructed and Nationalist Southern Intellectual
    Descendant of James Clarke Taylor, Who's 34th Georgia Regiment was sacrificed in vain by General Pemberton in an attempt to slow the Northern Armies
    A believer in that faint glimmer of hope that we Southerners will not fall into the dustbin of history and may one day have our own Country Again
    Avid reader and student of Faulkner
    Expert on North Korea and lover of History in General
    Permenant Fan (And within Paradox Games, Player) of Lost Causes
    Student of International Affairs
    Confederate Ronin of Clan Taylor, second to Tufto-san, the Daimyo of Groan
    (Join the Order of Southern Paradoxians at: http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/...hp?groupid=531 and I will send you your Number by PM)

  12. #12
    First Secretary Frymonmon's Avatar
    Arsenal of DemocracyHearts of Iron 2: ArmageddonCities in Motion 2Crusader Kings IIDarkest Hour
    East India Company CollectionEU3 CompleteDivine WindFor the MotherlandHearts of Iron III
    Heir to the ThroneLead and GoldMarch of the EaglesVictoria: RevolutionsSemper Fi
    SengokuVictoria 2Victoria II: A House DividedVictoria II: Heart of Darkness500k club
    Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order

    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    New Hampshire
    Posts
    751
    Quote Originally Posted by Projekt 919 View Post
    Control was disputed even over that area. However, they gave the CSA Kentucky (Also Disputed) so I guess they figure it balances.
    Kentucky in AHD is under Union control. Only from 1836 playing to the WBTS does Kentucky join the Confed'racy
    Founder and Creator of World in Revolution

    Awarded WritAAR of the Week Feb 05, 2012 | 3rd Place Winner of the AARland Choice AwAARds 2012 (Round 2) for Empire of the Pacific | Awarded Fan of the Week September 16th, 2012 | Awarded 2012 VictAARian Cross for Empire of the Pacific

  13. #13
    General in Chief of the CSA Projekt 919's Avatar
    Crusader Kings IICommander: Conquest of the AmericasFor the MotherlandHearts of Iron IIIHOI3: Their Finest Hour
    March of the EaglesSemper FiVictoria 2500k clubEuropa Universalis IV

    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    In Exile
    Posts
    1,429
    I Think We've all missed one huge thing.................the taipeng rebellion is conspicuosly absent from china despite the fact it was in full swing in 1861.
    1st Knight and Grandmaster of the Order of Southern Paradoxians
    Unreconstructed and Nationalist Southern Intellectual
    Descendant of James Clarke Taylor, Who's 34th Georgia Regiment was sacrificed in vain by General Pemberton in an attempt to slow the Northern Armies
    A believer in that faint glimmer of hope that we Southerners will not fall into the dustbin of history and may one day have our own Country Again
    Avid reader and student of Faulkner
    Expert on North Korea and lover of History in General
    Permenant Fan (And within Paradox Games, Player) of Lost Causes
    Student of International Affairs
    Confederate Ronin of Clan Taylor, second to Tufto-san, the Daimyo of Groan
    (Join the Order of Southern Paradoxians at: http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/...hp?groupid=531 and I will send you your Number by PM)

  14. #14
    General Hibernian's Avatar
    Crusader Kings IIEuropa Universalis 3Divine WindFor the MotherlandHearts of Iron III
    HOI3: Their Finest HourHeir to the ThroneEuropa Universalis III: In NomineEU3 Napoleon's AmbitionNaval War: Arctic Circle
    Rome GoldSemper FiVictoria 2Victoria II: A House DividedMount & Blade: Warband

    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Dublin, Ireland
    Posts
    2,084
    I looked though the 1861 scenario quite a bit last night (for work on PDM) and noticed the following map errors (most of them not very significant, but still).

    * The Ionian Islands should still be a satellite of Britain and not a part of Greece yet. The Treaty of London handing over the islands wasn't signed until 1864.

    * Ifni province should be owned by Spain. They captured it in the Spanish–Moroccan War in 1860.

    * Zanzibar should exist as a starting country (its cores are already there). It gained independence from Oman a few months before the start of the game.

    * France should not control the main Comoros Islands, only Mayotte. They gained Mayotte in 1841, but didn't establish a protectorate over the other islands until 1886.

    There are obviously other problems, like in South America, but others have already mentioned those.

  15. #15
    Major Comm Cody's Avatar
    Crusader Kings IIDarkest HourDeus VultEuropa Universalis: ChroniclesFor the Motherland
    Hearts of Iron IIISemper FiSword of the Stars IIVictoria 2Victoria II: A House Divided
    Victoria II: Heart of DarknessCK2: Holy Knight500k clubEuropa Universalis IV: Pre-order

    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    In your ceiling.
    Posts
    704
    Blog Entries
    2
    I shall talk about the leaders in the 1861 scenario for the USA and CSA

    Phillip Sheridan in 1861 was a Second Lt, Not the leader of the Army of the Mississippi, which didn't exist until 1862.
    Ulysses S. Grant was commander of the Cario Garrison in 1861, Not the leader of the Army of the Ohio, Correct leader is William Rosecrans
    Leader of the Washington Garrison was Winfield Scott, Not Sherman.

    Leader of Army of Northern Virginia was P. G. T. Beauregard, Lee replaced him, and a few others.
    Leader of the Army of Shenandoah was Joseph E. Johnston.
    Army of Virgina on the CSA side never existed, I would say merge it with the Army of Northern Virgina.
    Comm Cody on some forums, 2nd_Lt_Cody on others, and Pvt. Adams [29th ID] or 2nd_Lt_Cody on steam.

    I know nothing, I see nothing, I hear nothing!

    BET BOARD ON RUSSIA VS UKRAINE:
    http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/...aine-bet-board Blog one
    http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/...1#post17239956 My post in the thread.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Projekt 919 View Post
    Control was disputed even over that area. However, they gave the CSA Kentucky (Also Disputed) so I guess they figure it balances.
    I do think Kentucky is controlled by the Union in AHD (as stated above, but i will have to check) In any case, the territory of New Mexico seceded of its own accord (in the same fashion the other CS states did) unlike Kentucky, so its claim to being confederate territory is far more valid that Kentucky's.

  17. #17
    Colonel Theddude's Avatar
    Crusader Kings IICommander: Conquest of the AmericasEU3 CompleteDivine WindFor the Motherland
    Hearts of Iron IIIHOI3: Their Finest HourHeir to the ThroneSemper FiVictoria 2
    Victoria II: Heart of DarknessMount & Blade: WarbandPride of NationsCK2: Holy Knight500k club
    Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    London, UK
    Posts
    1,045
    Quote Originally Posted by thunderbird2099 View Post
    I do think Kentucky is controlled by the Union in AHD (as stated above, but i will have to check) In any case, the territory of New Mexico seceded of its own accord (in the same fashion the other CS states did) unlike Kentucky, so its claim to being confederate territory is far more valid that Kentucky's.
    It would be nice if it were a Confederate territory, but it would have to be a territory in the first place. The south of Tucson and Arizona at least should be Confederate territories, like they claimed them to be. There were even a few minor battles there, and in game would allow the Confederates to trade Western land for time, like they did historically.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...e_of_statehood

    First off, in 1836, all of the later US states controlled by Mexico should be colonies (territories) as Mexico claimed them as territories, not states, without effecting real control. When the US won the Mexican American War, they were similarly claimed as territories, not states. In fact, New Mexico and Arizona were the last two continental territories to gain statehood. As it stands now, Mexico has them as states (wrong), and when the US takes them they are automatically granted statehood (wrong again).

    Thus in 1861, most of them should be colonies (territories). California, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Oregon, and Kansas should be states at the start, and the rest should remain territories. Like the OP said, I respect the developers for their wonderful game and hope this info can help make it better and more accurate.

  18. #18
    Colonel Gwax23's Avatar
    Arsenal of DemocracyHearts of Iron 2: ArmageddonCrusader Kings IIDarkest HourEU3 Complete
    Divine WindFor The GloryHearts of Iron IIIHeir to the ThroneIron Cross
    Victoria: RevolutionsRome GoldSemper FiSupreme Ruler 2020 GoldVictoria 2
    Victoria II: A House DividedVictoria II: Heart of Darkness

    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    942
    Only the southern halves:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Co...of_America.svg

    Could that be represented in game based on the province borders?

  19. #19
    Lt. General Sakkura's Avatar
    Cities in MotionCrusader Kings IIDarkest HourEU3 CompleteDivine Wind
    For the MotherlandHearts of Iron IIIHeir to the ThroneEuropa Universalis: RomeSemper Fi
    Victoria 2Victoria II: A House DividedVictoria II: Heart of Darkness500k clubEuropa Universalis IV: Pre-order

    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Denmark
    Posts
    1,266
    If you're updating the original post, why are you leaving out the Denmark/Holstein issue? It's not as if Denmark really needs to be in a weaker situation than IRL in 1861...

  20. #20
    General in Chief of the CSA Projekt 919's Avatar
    Crusader Kings IICommander: Conquest of the AmericasFor the MotherlandHearts of Iron IIIHOI3: Their Finest Hour
    March of the EaglesSemper FiVictoria 2500k clubEuropa Universalis IV

    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    In Exile
    Posts
    1,429
    Quote Originally Posted by Sakkura View Post
    If you're updating the original post, why are you leaving out the Denmark/Holstein issue? It's not as if Denmark really needs to be in a weaker situation than IRL in 1861...
    I Just Missed it, I am updating now.
    1st Knight and Grandmaster of the Order of Southern Paradoxians
    Unreconstructed and Nationalist Southern Intellectual
    Descendant of James Clarke Taylor, Who's 34th Georgia Regiment was sacrificed in vain by General Pemberton in an attempt to slow the Northern Armies
    A believer in that faint glimmer of hope that we Southerners will not fall into the dustbin of history and may one day have our own Country Again
    Avid reader and student of Faulkner
    Expert on North Korea and lover of History in General
    Permenant Fan (And within Paradox Games, Player) of Lost Causes
    Student of International Affairs
    Confederate Ronin of Clan Taylor, second to Tufto-san, the Daimyo of Groan
    (Join the Order of Southern Paradoxians at: http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/...hp?groupid=531 and I will send you your Number by PM)

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts