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Thread: Worst WC country?

  1. #1
    Banned Iwanow's Avatar
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    Worst WC country?

    How do you think, which country is worst for WC? I got few candidates :

    RYUKU : Pagan opm island. If they manage to conquer anything it can be easily taken from them without peace deal. Also they got realy crappy tech, positon and everything. If they survive, it is only because they are island.
    CHIMU : Pagan(SIC!) OPM in North america, its only Neighbour is big Inca, which has lot more soliders, cash, and is just bigger. And even if they manage to conquer inca, they will have to wait 50 years to get cores on it, meaning massive rebels and low income.
    MALDIVES : Next opm. It is muslim which helps, but it got realy crappy starting province, and no real way to conquer anything.
    KONGO : It borders nothing, it can't build ships, it is in nowhere, and even if europeans border it, they do it on very late game, ussualy conquer it outright. Any chances??? I think no... not realy.

    So, whadayouthink?

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by Iwanow View Post
    How do you think, which country is worst for WC? I got few candidates :

    RYUKU : Pagan opm island. If they manage to conquer anything it can be easily taken from them without peace deal. Also they got realy crappy tech, positon and everything. If they survive, it is only because they are island.
    CHIMU : Pagan(SIC!) OPM in North america, its only Neighbour is big Inca, which has lot more soliders, cash, and is just bigger. And even if they manage to conquer inca, they will have to wait 50 years to get cores on it, meaning massive rebels and low income.
    MALDIVES : Next opm. It is muslim which helps, but it got realy crappy starting province, and no real way to conquer anything.
    KONGO : It borders nothing, it can't build ships, it is in nowhere, and even if europeans border it, they do it on very late game, ussualy conquer it outright. Any chances??? I think no... not realy.

    So, whadayouthink?
    Ryukyu is fine - WC is virtually guaranteed.
    Chimu is ok - dealing with Incas is not too hard, but, like most primitives they have a risk of obliteration if Europeans decide to land a serious invasion force.
    Maldives are not bad - you can opportunistically grab land here and there - it seems there's always a war in India.
    Kongo is probably the worst (primitives with less options than anyone else).

    In general, I would classify nations bad for WC as
    (1) Those who are under the risk of getting conquered right from the start and no reliable defense (for example, Epirus, Pskov, Mongol Khanate);
    (2) Primitives (except inland ones and Ryukyu who has superior tech) who might get annexed by Europeans if Europeans gets serious (usually they don't, but sometimes they might);

    With everyone else WC shouldn't be a problem - just a matter of how long it will take.

  3. #3
    Honestly, if I had to pick a nation, it'd probably be African.

    For me, it was simply frustrating just trying to westernize as Mutapa and dealing with incessant rebellions when I tried playing them. I suppose once you've got enough steam rolling it's not so bad, but... getting there...
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  4. #4
    Colonel Stratagyfan101's Avatar
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    Epirus and Granada?
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    Colonel Memento Mori's Avatar
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    You are all wrong! The worst WC country is a colonial rebel - once it appears it's already too late

  6. #6
    Arakan, 1399 start. You start as Sunni OPM, but your one province is Buddhist, giving your neighbours a free religious liberation casus belli on you. Also, you start with no forts. It gets declared upon by its two neighbours on day one, and has near zero chance of survival.

  7. #7
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    Loango....it gets annexed by KONGO nuff said...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sylon View Post
    Arakan, 1399 start. You start as Sunni OPM, but your one province is Buddhist, giving your neighbours a free religious liberation casus belli on you. Also, you start with no forts. It gets declared upon by its two neighbours on day one, and has near zero chance of survival.
    Good one. Though you might luck out somehow, and once you get a good start it should be way easier than the suggested subsaharan/new world nations.

    Trebizond is also pretty difficult in DW

  9. #9
    Banned Iwanow's Avatar
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    So, maybe we do a list and vote?

    EDIT:

    Kongo
    Loango
    Chimu
    Maldives
    Ryuku
    Trebizond
    Arkan
    Epirus
    Granada
    Bar
    Pskov
    Mazovia
    Mongol Khanate

    Any adds, to the list?

  10. #10
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    Loango by a long, long way. I'm not about to say any WC is impossible within a resonable time limit, but by god Loango is the harshest conditions possible.

    I'm also going to stick my neck out and say that Granada is one of the easiest in your list. Once you stomp Castille which is very possible, you're pretty much in the Ottoman's position if not better.

  11. #11
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    Granada is in better position - they have sliders just allowing them to westernize. Problem is, that they cannot westernize, as they do have better tech than europe.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iwanow View Post
    Granada is in better position - they have sliders just allowing them to westernize. Problem is, that they cannot westernize, as they do have better tech than europe.
    Yeah but when the europeans get higher tech, you'll then be able to westernise and be in a great position for WC!

  13. #13
    Banned Iwanow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The-King View Post
    Yeah but when the europeans get higher tech, you'll then be able to westernise and be in a great position for WC!
    Quite agreed here. Also you can force PU on weaker muslims. As you got other religion - holy war on europe... quite easy. But the beggining is quite hard...

  14. #14
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    Ryukyu is not that hard. You can change your religion to Sunni within 25 years and then you've got great Holy War CB and no animist penalty. Only drawback is that you won't be Japanese anymore, but that's only for roleplaying.

    Chimu is not hard because of Inca. You can save/reload a couple of times and you'll manage to beat them in the end. You can then vassalize them and take the remaining provinces by mission so that you get cores on them. The hard thing is that you probably won't have an opportunity to westernize before 1550 and once you do, North and South America are already mostly colonized, so you also need to conquer that, but you can only start doing that after 1550. So your best bet is to try to get a coastal COT and colonize your way to central America.

    Loango? Do they even start with provinces?

    The African countries are, in my opinion, rather easy, especially Sokoto and Adal. You won't usually be bothered that much and when you get attacked, you usually only have to cede some coastal provinces, usually revolting back pretty quickly. The advantage of African countries is that you don't need to wait for the arrival of European neighbors, so you can westernize earlier. Only exceptions are maybe Kongo/Loango and the African nations next to the Gold/Ivory/Grain Coast.

    Granada may be strong when you manage to turn the tide, but so far I've never managed to do so.

    Maldives shouldn't be too hard when you pay attention and strike at the right time in order to get a continental foothold.

    Monghol Khanate is a similar story. If you can get a start, then it shouldn't be too hard, maybe a lot of micromanagement. Steppe Nomad governments are great for conquering huge swaths of land. Only if you could convince Manchu to leave you alone for the first years.

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    Banned Iwanow's Avatar
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    So i think Kongo is the toughest. They got no neigbours, cannot colonize, are pagans, and need to wait for someone to colonize near them. They got one of the toughest tech groups, only good thing, it is better than NA tech. So you actualy may reach land tech allowing you to make forts.

  16. #16
    Colonel luitzen's Avatar
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    In DW you can reach landtech 3 before the Europeans arrive as any American nation.

  17. #17
    Banned Iwanow's Avatar
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    So Kongo? Still got better tech group than chimu, but in exchange, chimu got bigger territory.

  18. #18
    We must have a Loango AAR.
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  19. #19
    One question: All of you have the "no end date" mod when you are talking about wc, right? I mean, you can´t claim a wc is "guaranteed" without the mod, or can you? :S (I am an expirienced player, but I never have played with mods)

  20. #20
    Banned Iwanow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by emil209 View Post
    One question: All of you have the "no end date" mod when you are talking about wc, right? I mean, you can´t claim a wc is "guaranteed" without the mod, or can you? :S (I am an expirienced player, but I never have played with mods)
    WC is possible, without any mods.

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