Bug Reports

[Dafool]

Don't know if this is a bug, but I'm currently playing a game as Quzco. I'm in a race with Chimu to domination of South America, but it seems I won't win it because Chimu expands really fast in terra incognita. They don't even have to send colonists to gain new provinces (when I click on their new province's history it tells me the povince was taken by rebels, liberated and annexed by Chimu)!! AI is clearly just cheating in that case. They get new provinces for free with already a few thousand soul in it.

Is this feature included on purpose to help the AI? Or is it totally abnormal?

It's a feature. Uncolonized provinces in the Andes are ripe for the taking, but you need to be bordering those provinces first. Crush the Chimu and you may start getting them yourself.

[GarethT]

Hello. I've currently been playing as Japan (formed a while back) ever since unifying Japan I can't seem to sue peace with anyone at all. It comes up and then closes again. Any solutions?

[banania]

It's a feature. Uncolonized provinces in the Andes are ripe for the taking, but you need to be bordering those provinces first. Crush the Chimu and you may start getting them yourself.

By "ripe for the taking" do you mean I can send an army there and click on "seize colony" in uncolonized provinces? Cos' that's what the AI seem to do. I tried something like this but only thing I could was sending some colonists.

(Slighlty out of topic: just formed the Inca Empire, waiting for Portugal or Castille to show up and westernize)

[Dafool]

By "ripe for the taking" do you mean I can send an army there and click on "seize colony" in uncolonized provinces? Cos' that's what the AI seem to do. I tried something like this but only thing I could was sending some colonists.

You can't actively seize those provinces, but if you're centralized and your ruler has a good military score you should get an event to take those provinces in no time.

(Slighlty out of topic: just formed the Inca Empire, waiting for Portugal or Castille to show up and westernize)

It should be interesting. You'll probably find that my mod, American Empires, adds a lot of content to the interaction between the Old World and the New World. If you're lucky they might not be so hostile. Please let me know if you run across any bugs though. The New World content is almost completely my work and I can usually give you a quick fix if needed.

[kepler]

I am still playing 5.13 and I have a few observations, not sure if something has changed in 5.14:
- As other people have reported, I have the impression that the Muslim group techs too fast.
- While having a look at the Tech Groups I have noticed that:

	muslim = {
		modifier = 0.8
		start_level = 4
		cav_to_inf_ratio = 0.81
		slow_limit = 5
		slow_limit = 8

Not sure if having two slow_limit can create problems.
- The Relations Improved Event can fire for two countries of different Religion, not sure if it's WAD.
- Chinese Tech countries shouldn't get colonization missions (such as "Colonize Taiwan") because the AI will never colonize if it has a tech speed less than 70% IIRC.

[banania]

You can't actively seize those provinces, but if you're centralized and your ruler has a good military score you should get an event to take those provinces in no time.

Strange, I've always been rather centralized (started with Cuzco, I think -2 Centralization) and I think I had a good military leader at some point, but had no event. I'll be more aware of my leader's military skills next time...

It should be interesting. You'll probably find that my mod, American Empires, adds a lot of content to the interaction between the Old World and the New World. If you're lucky they might not be so hostile. Please let me know if you run across any bugs though. The New World content is almost completely my work and I can usually give you a quick fix if needed.

Oh then, you're totally gonna be harrassed by silly questions.

I'm not up to the point of encountering western colonists, but I've got a first question/request. I formed the Inca Empire by clicking on a decision which had a couple of requirements. One of them was "Have claim_on_andes larger than 12" or something like that. And... well... apart from the fact that there might be someting buggy (claim_on_andes must be the modifier name) with the sentence using a modifier name as real words, what is this "claime_on_andes"? How did I manage to increase it? Where can the current status of the modifier been found?

That's all for now!

Otherwise, I'm having a blast with South America right now. I guess it means your work is already KEWL.

[Tigernekro]

As Byzantium every month or every secound the event "the Black Sea Trade" fires. But nothing seems to happen. Neither I get a modifier for my country, nor i get any provinces improved.

[Dafool]

I am still playing 5.13 and I have a few observations, not sure if something has changed in 5.14:
- As other people have reported, I have the impression that the Muslim group techs too fast.
- While having a look at the Tech Groups I have noticed that:

	muslim = {
		modifier = 0.8
		start_level = 4
		cav_to_inf_ratio = 0.81
		slow_limit = 5
		slow_limit = 8

Not sure if having two slow_limit can create problems.
- The Relations Improved Event can fire for two countries of different Religion, not sure if it's WAD.
- Chinese Tech countries shouldn't get colonization missions (such as "Colonize Taiwan") because the AI will never colonize if it has a tech speed less than 70% IIRC.

The Muslim group should be pretty close to the west overall for most of the early game. That doesn't concern me too much since Muslim nations also tend to be much poorer overall as well. Are you seeing strange tech behavior, like the Mamluks being several techs ahead after a 100 years, or are you simply seeing them keep up? The relations improved event is a vanilla problem IIRC. The colonize missions are simply there to give the player something to do. I'm not sure if we'll need to change that.

Strange, I've always been rather centralized (started with Cuzco, I think -2 Centralization) and I think I had a good military leader at some point, but had no event. I'll be more aware of my leader's military skills next time...

Oh then, you're totally gonna be harrassed by silly questions.

I'm not up to the point of encountering western colonists, but I've got a first question/request. I formed the Inca Empire by clicking on a decision which had a couple of requirements. One of them was "Have claim_on_andes larger than 12" or something like that. And... well... apart from the fact that there might be someting buggy (claim_on_andes must be the modifier name) with the sentence using a modifier name as real words, what is this "claime_on_andes"? How did I manage to increase it? Where can the current status of the modifier been found?

That's all for now!

Otherwise, I'm having a blast with South America right now. I guess it means your work is already KEWL.

The "claim on" part isn't a modifier, it a count of how many provinces in that region you own. And thanks for interest.

As Byzantium every month or every secound the event "the Black Sea Trade" fires. But nothing seems to happen. Neither I get a modifier for my country, nor i get any provinces improved.

You're using the 5.2 beta. We don't support that version and it will cause bugs like these.

[kepler]

Are you seeing strange tech behavior, like the Mamluks being several techs ahead after a 100 years, or are you simply seeing them keep up?

Around 1600 the Muslim tech group is in many cases doing better than the Oriental one and it's close to the Western one. Except for Government tech.

The colonize missions are simply there to give the player something to do. I'm not sure if we'll need to change that.

I don't think the AI should receive missions that it can't complete, because the player has enough advantages already.

[banania]

It should be interesting. You'll probably find that my mod, American Empires, adds a lot of content to the interaction between the Old World and the New World. If you're lucky they might not be so hostile. Please let me know if you run across any bugs though. The New World content is almost completely my work and I can usually give you a quick fix if needed.

Fully westernized, Catholic, owns 2/3 of South America and started colonizing Africa.

But that was painful. The plagues events are very surprising, certainly historically relevant, but IMO they fire too much. Population growth penalties, tax penalties even tax base penalties or money request are already sufficiently painful not to add that much revolters. I had to chase revolters during 60 or 80 years after first contact with western countries. Though the diseases brought by European colonists were a tragedy to local population (thus entailing those huge economical and demographic penalties), I don't think provinces should revolt when half their population is suddenly gone. Maybe from time to time, but not every time. The province going from Terrible to Serious to Notable to Minimal desease insures that you get something like a 12 revolts during the process. Maybe revolters should appear only in provinces with a certain amount of population, or only when the modifier "Terrible" or "Serious" affect the province, limiting other plague modifiers to economical penalties.

To plague revolters, when you add revolters due to westernization and revolters due to Catholic conversion, it's an endless war against revolters. Well, these particular revolters have to be kept in my opinion, because these moves are socially difficult and should bring some unrest. Fortunately, there is an event firing quite frequently to convert provinces. That's helpful. Oh, and I've seen a lot of american native countries start towards "Innovative" side of the slider. I think the "Convert to Catholicism" decision should fire a +5 move toward "Narrowminded". I don't think this is a very progressist move indeed.

[kepler]

I think it's more on the Innovative side. Certainly it's a big change, even if the end results could vary.

[YuriKaslov]

Not sure if this was already mentioned, but should formable nations be able to become revolter nations? I've had this happen with both Arabia and Greece in one game... and Greece's only core was in Kaffa afterwards. I don't recall this happening in the last version of the mod I had installed, though.

[Phoibos]

First of all, great mod. Just a few things I noted in my recent Mamluks-Egypt-Arabia game.

I formed Egypt fairly quickly, with the intent of getting a few more cores. However, despite the decision saying that cores would be granted on the entire Egypt region, I didn't receive any cores on parts of Egypt that were not cores already, mainly Dongola and Berber (which were not colonized yet) and Massawa (owned by Ethiopia).

After that, I released Mamluks as a vassal in order to isolate my capital in Cairo and move it to a province in the Arabian peninsula in order to form Arabia. This worked fine until I began my reconquest of the Mamluks. After annexing them in a second war, I discovered that for several months afterwards they still had 5 merchants placed in Alexandria. Furthermore, several nations (like Yemen and Hafsids) were still shown as allied to them. In fact, 20+ some years later, I was at war with the Hafsids and saw that one of my peace options was for them to annul all treaties with the now non-existent Mamluks.

Finally, I had the opportunity to fight a war over the Ottoman throne. I declared war while the majority of the Ottoman troops were in the Balkans annexing Ragusa with the intent of blockading the strait of Marmara in order to occupy all of Anatolia. I thought I could do this because Byzantium still owned Constantinople and so the Ottoman's had to use the strait rather than the land connection. Much to my dismay, the Ottoman doom stacks simply waltzed over the strait despite my fleet doing its best to blockade. Making sure I had the right body of water blockaded, I discovered that the strait connecting the provinces is not over any body of water, but rather over the province of Bursa. Is that as intended? I approve of making Constantinople a land connection, but if the Ottoman have yet to conquer Constantinople I feel it fair to use the strait against them in the way I intended.

Finally, I will echo YuriKaslov - I have yet to see revolter Greece, but I have seen one-province Arabia revolt on multiple occasions.

[Dafool]

First of all, great mod. Just a few things I noted in my recent Mamluks-Egypt-Arabia game.

I formed Egypt fairly quickly, with the intent of getting a few more cores. However, despite the decision saying that cores would be granted on the entire Egypt region, I didn't receive any cores on parts of Egypt that were not cores already, mainly Dongola and Berber (which were not colonized yet) and Massawa (owned by Ethiopia).

I didn't create the Egypt decision and I haven't used it in any games, but make sure you're not confusing the nation for the region or vice versa. The wording used in game can sometimes be a little unclear when it comes to that difference.

After that, I released Mamluks as a vassal in order to isolate my capital in Cairo and move it to a province in the Arabian peninsula in order to form Arabia. This worked fine until I began my reconquest of the Mamluks. After annexing them in a second war, I discovered that for several months afterwards they still had 5 merchants placed in Alexandria. Furthermore, several nations (like Yemen and Hafsids) were still shown as allied to them. In fact, 20+ some years later, I was at war with the Hafsids and saw that one of my peace options was for them to annul all treaties with the now non-existent Mamluks.

These types of problems are usually caused by the player. If you've done any tag switching via reloading or the console it may have caused this. Constant saving and/or reloading of the save can cause this as well.

Finally, I had the opportunity to fight a war over the Ottoman throne. I declared war while the majority of the Ottoman troops were in the Balkans annexing Ragusa with the intent of blockading the strait of Marmara in order to occupy all of Anatolia. I thought I could do this because Byzantium still owned Constantinople and so the Ottoman's had to use the strait rather than the land connection. Much to my dismay, the Ottoman doom stacks simply waltzed over the strait despite my fleet doing its best to blockade. Making sure I had the right body of water blockaded, I discovered that the strait connecting the provinces is not over any body of water, but rather over the province of Bursa. Is that as intended? I approve of making Constantinople a land connection, but if the Ottoman have yet to conquer Constantinople I feel it fair to use the strait against them in the way I intended.

This may or may not be WAD. I'll have to take a look and see how the strait is set up.

Finally, I will echo YuriKaslov - I have yet to see revolter Greece, but I have seen one-province Arabia revolt on multiple occasions.

This really can't be helped. Rebels from cultures with limited tags available will sometimes defect off to nations we would prefer not to break away. This is why in vanilla you may occasionally see Greece in some Greek island or Revolutionary France in a Cosmopolitan province.

[mythmonster2]

I've got Divine Wind patched up to 5.1. Whenever I load up D&T, the map has these weird blue lines all over it. This is when I'm selecting a country and in-game.


I also have Steppe Wolf and Whole World Mod installed; both of their maps and the base game's maps work just fine. I've made no changes to the base game or D&T. Besides this very annoying graphical glitch, everything on D&T works fine.

[Dafool]

I've got Divine Wind patched up to 5.1. Whenever I load up D&T, the map has these weird blue lines all over it. This is when I'm selecting a country and in-game.


I also have Steppe Wolf and Whole World Mod installed; both of their maps and the base game's maps work just fine. I've made no changes to the base game or D&T. Besides this very annoying graphical glitch, everything on D&T works fine.

That's obviously not normal. Considering that your other map files are working fine, I'm going to assume this isn't a graphical incompatibility issue. In this case, I can think of only two reasons for such a problem: Rather your download was corrupted or you somehow inadvertently messed with the map files. Either way, I'd recommend redownloading the mod and then reinstalling it in the suggested manner. That should fix your problem.

[digitCruncher]

Playing as Joseon, I Military Modernised to Oriental tech (The western nations haven't been able to make any footholds in eastern africa or further by 1700, and even if I did, I lag behind in tech only enough to westernize of a few OPM in Europe, and France). The problem is, Oriental units are FAR inferior to Eastern units. Is this intended at this tech path? Ming, who didn't modernise, has land tech 27, and has Eastern Charge Cavalry (3/2 Fire 5/3 Shock, 5/4 Morale), whereas I am stuck with either the previous iteration of Eastern Cav (I forgot the name, but it is 2/1 2/1 2/1), or I can 'upgrade' to the Oriental version (0/0 2/1 3/2). Furthermore, infantry is a real head scratcher. I still use the Eastern infantry (4/2 2/1 4/3) which is INATELY SUPERIOR to the Oriental version at land tech 26 (2/2 2/1 4/3, or two less offensive fire). This leads to the rather embarrasing moment when 20,000 Joseon troops are repulsed by 12,000 chinese troops, and those 12,000 troops barely lose against reinforcements of another 20,000 troops)

If I knew I was lagging so far behind militarily, I would have changed my tactics completely.

[Arakhor]

This is probably best suited to the Bug Report thread: please don't forget to set the starting Byzantine Emperor as Ioannes V, not Iohannes VI, but still maintain the historical name list ("Ioannes #6" = 40) so that the next King John is Ioannes VII. Ioannes VI Kantakouzenos had already been forced to abdicate in 1354, so the current Emperor in 1356 is Ioannes V Palaiologos and any future successor should instead be Ioannes VII.

[zedyue]

Playing as Joseon, I Military Modernised to Oriental tech (The western nations haven't been able to make any footholds in eastern africa or further by 1700, and even if I did, I lag behind in tech only enough to westernize of a few OPM in Europe, and France). The problem is, Oriental units are FAR inferior to Eastern units. Is this intended at this tech path? Ming, who didn't modernise, has land tech 27, and has Eastern Charge Cavalry (3/2 Fire 5/3 Shock, 5/4 Morale), whereas I am stuck with either the previous iteration of Eastern Cav (I forgot the name, but it is 2/1 2/1 2/1), or I can 'upgrade' to the Oriental version (0/0 2/1 3/2). Furthermore, infantry is a real head scratcher. I still use the Eastern infantry (4/2 2/1 4/3) which is INATELY SUPERIOR to the Oriental version at land tech 26 (2/2 2/1 4/3, or two less offensive fire). This leads to the rather embarrasing moment when 20,000 Joseon troops are repulsed by 12,000 chinese troops, and those 12,000 troops barely lose against reinforcements of another 20,000 troops)

If I knew I was lagging so far behind militarily, I would have changed my tactics completely.

The problem is that Western tech has like 30 units over time (just infantry, or just cavalry etc) , and the other techs have like, 9 units in each catagory. I'm sure youve noticed even playing as oriental russia, by the time you get your FIRST upgrade at tech 14, the westerns have usually had 2-3 military upgrades. I think that the other techs need more inbetween units so when caught behind, they aren't AS horribly destroyed. Frankly, I think they should get a new unit at equal techs to the westerns, just each one isn't quite as good to the next level up.

Like at tech 10 (or whatever it is) in western tech, they get longbows, oriental should get a new unit, ottomans/muslim should get a new unit, horde should get a new unit, eastern should get a new unit. etc. But even if everyone was at 10 tech, the eastern should be worse than the muslim for example.

It just doesn't work for units to have a difference of 6 shock because the western tech has had 6-7 unit upgrades and Ming MIGHT have gotten 1.

You can see how this is bad by starting really late in the game as ottomans, viewing all the infantry units, and then starting a game as france, and viewing all the infantry units. The turks get smashed so hard because they never make it to the next unit tech.

[Dafool]

The problem is that Western tech has like 30 units over time (just infantry, or just cavalry etc) , and the other techs have like, 9 units in each catagory. I'm sure youve noticed even playing as oriental russia, by the time you get your FIRST upgrade at tech 14, the westerns have usually had 2-3 military upgrades. I think that the other techs need more inbetween units so when caught behind, they aren't AS horribly destroyed. Frankly, I think they should get a new unit at equal techs to the westerns, just each one isn't quite as good to the next level up.

Like at tech 10 (or whatever it is) in western tech, they get longbows, oriental should get a new unit, ottomans/muslim should get a new unit, horde should get a new unit, eastern should get a new unit. etc. But even if everyone was at 10 tech, the eastern should be worse than the muslim for example.

It just doesn't work for units to have a difference of 6 shock because the western tech has had 6-7 unit upgrades and Ming MIGHT have gotten 1.

You can see how this is bad by starting really late in the game as ottomans, viewing all the infantry units, and then starting a game as france, and viewing all the infantry units. The turks get smashed so hard because they never make it to the next unit tech.

Actually some of that is misguided. While it's true that Western tech has more units, they don't have access to those units at notably different intervals. Western tech just has a lot of variations amongst the units it does unlock. For example, a Western tech nation may unlock 3 different units of equal "pip value" at tech level X, whereas a Chinese tech nation only unlocks 1 unit around that same tech level. Most of the tech groups get these units at roughly the same tech levels, although some of them do have gaps (including Western tech). There are some differences between the overall power of these different units, but usually the difference is relatively small for most of the early game. It isn't until about tech level 30+ that disparity between units becomes more noticeable.