Japan is doing extremely well so far. I think that the Far Eastern Theatre is the last of the Axis problems.
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Amazing game. Axis victory by VP makes sense, though, considering they have the Soviet player under a barrel, even if he's still holding out in Stalingrad and beyond the Volga. Germans are in control of Moscow, Leningrad and Kiev, so the eastern front is definitely going in their favor.
The more I think about the Bitter Peace event, the less sense does it make. It forces the Soviet player out of the war even though (as we can see) he still has plenty of fight in him. What's the point of forcing him to concede MASSIVE territory, if he can still defend it?
BP should only trigger when the Soviet player is really on his last legs. The Soviet player should WANT to trigger it, to retain Siberia.
The more I think about the Bitter Peace event, the less sense does it make. It forces the Soviet player out of the war even though (as we can see) he still has plenty of fight in him. What's the point of forcing him to concede MASSIVE territory, if he can still defend it?
BP should only trigger when the Soviet player is really on his last legs. The Soviet player should WANT to trigger it, to retain Siberia.
The BP is not affected by the army size, but by lost territory. All surrenders work like that in HOI3 (that's why dropping PARAs on VP provinces work so well), so nothing surprising there.
It would be great if one of the other players showed us how things look like from his perspective...
It would be great if one of the other players showed us how things look like from his perspective...
Remember the SU player lost the far east and most of the Cacaus region in addition to Moscow, Lenningrad and Rostov. Basically they kept Stalingrad but lost even more land then normally.
The Soviet Issue in general stems from the fact that in HoI3 there are so many more provinces that it really thins the Soviets to spreading divisions across a whole front line.
Add in the fact that the Germans have slightly better medium tanks and can use a Schwerpunkt style of attack there is no way the Soviets could protect themselves. It is extremely tough to manage so much territory against someone who can plan the operations out, the AI generally can shift troops in seconds in reaction to changes, the human player cannot.
Even when the Soviets attack first the front narrows for them, and the provinces get a bit larger so the Germans can use local advantages to counter attack, additionally their soldiers are better as well.
To Captain's skill, the fact that he has held Italy proper against Zid is a testament to his abilities and the prowess he commands against his enemies. We watched Captain go to town on Italy last game. I think the Axis holds no "true" advantage, it is simply who is playing them.
Rather impressed by the attack on Toulon, the job really needs to be finished at Marsielles. But Captain also has the luxury of watching "limited" fronts, maybe he can speculate on this? But I think only watching Italy and a few divisions in the East gives him time to organize faster than the other majors who are watching 3 or 4 fronts?
Add in the fact that the Germans have slightly better medium tanks and can use a Schwerpunkt style of attack there is no way the Soviets could protect themselves. It is extremely tough to manage so much territory against someone who can plan the operations out, the AI generally can shift troops in seconds in reaction to changes, the human player cannot.
Even when the Soviets attack first the front narrows for them, and the provinces get a bit larger so the Germans can use local advantages to counter attack, additionally their soldiers are better as well.
To Captain's skill, the fact that he has held Italy proper against Zid is a testament to his abilities and the prowess he commands against his enemies. We watched Captain go to town on Italy last game. I think the Axis holds no "true" advantage, it is simply who is playing them.
Rather impressed by the attack on Toulon, the job really needs to be finished at Marsielles. But Captain also has the luxury of watching "limited" fronts, maybe he can speculate on this? But I think only watching Italy and a few divisions in the East gives him time to organize faster than the other majors who are watching 3 or 4 fronts?
German player from the game here.
I agree that there are problems with the way the Bitter Peace works, especially so in MP games. But let's keep that discussion in a separate thread and keep focus on the intense action in the current round of Carnage
I agree that there are problems with the way the Bitter Peace works, especially so in MP games. But let's keep that discussion in a separate thread and keep focus on the intense action in the current round of Carnage
Amazing AAR. I don't know what other readers think, but after Axis VP victory I really want to see "real end" of this war.
+1
BTW, I'd be really interested in how you'd fare cpt as soviet, or Zid as soviet for example. (hint)
I've praised Zid several times, this time I'd like to share it with the German player controlling the western front. Not getting encircled and holding Paris, with so few troops against 2 human players... Hats off!
The Western/Eastern Front from the Allied perspective? Production priorities? Far Eastern Theatre? Naval battles?
Naval battles is a short story for Germany after the loss of its Battleship fleet. Lately, Allied ASW forces have inflicted heavy damage on the once so dreaded convoy raiding submarines, forcing them to be more defensive and constantly searching for new hunting grounds. German High Command believe that especially the UK has a solid lead in the tech race. All in all, submarine warfare is not a prioritized area for Germany at the moment. A few USSR submarines have been sunk in the Baltic Sea.
Production priorities are infantery and combined arms divisions, supplemented with fighter squadrons. Axis has won more air battles recently, but it is still a difficult area, partly due to the micro management required. More and more heavy divisions (composed of ARM, MECH and support brigades) are allocated to the battle for France, to counter Allies attacks mostly composed of armoured and other mobile troops. A combination of partisan activity and poor infrastructure has lead to severe supply issues on the Eastern front, so troops with lower supply demands are deployed there. It is believed that the major strength of the Red Army is its size, so a large number of defensive divisions are used just to hold the line ( some 2500 km) while the offensive operations (like Arkhangelsk) involve heavier, "spearhead" formations.
I feel I cannot post without congratulating all players on the excellent play all around.
Overall this game confirms, as in real life, that both sides can win and lose a lot of important campaigns, without necessarily losing the war. Except Barbarossa. Once Germany are committed in the East, that's pretty much the whole ballgame. If they win there, hardly anything else will matter, and vice versa.
Overall this game confirms, as in real life, that both sides can win and lose a lot of important campaigns, without necessarily losing the war. Except Barbarossa. Once Germany are committed in the East, that's pretty much the whole ballgame. If they win there, hardly anything else will matter, and vice versa.
Addendum to Chapter XXIV-XXVI
The War was still looming on, and though UK had heard from the US diplomats that the administration was making more and more efforts to join the Allies, Britain still stood alone. They did not have the armoured might of the Wehrmacht, and could not hope to defeat them in open battle, but they had something more. Intelligence. Since 1938, large listening stations had been built in Dover and Malta. Even before the outbreak of the war, they stood ready. When the officers and mathematicians working at Bletchley Park broke the Enigma, they had so much information that they did not know what to do with it all.
The entire defensive structure of Italy was laid bare. They had obviously chosen to defend on the beaches. Most of the beaches were defended by single milita brigades, or so it was thought.
Since Operation Gamey, the Germans had chosen to withdraw from coastal areas, denying the Brittish army any easy prey. After the fall of France, UK had supported two Underground resistance movements in occupied France, and they had grown exponentially.
However, after the fall of the Regia Marina, Zidston Churchill was insistent that the next targets had to be Italian- Sicily and Sardinia. Sicily was chosen to be attacked first, as the troops in Sardinia were thought to be unable to withdraw.
On Jan 11th, the invasion was launched. The motorised infantry that attacked still had problems before coming ashore, and UK had no active marine divisions. Had the beaches been defended by regular Italian troops, it could have been a bloody affair.
However, once the troops came ashore, their superior training, equipment and tea supplies tipped the scales. The important port of Taranto soon fell, and after just two weeks the Italian and German defenders were rushing to the sea to try to get over to mainland Italy. What they found was a full RN SAG waiting for them, attacking any ferry that even tried to exit the ports. Attacks from the RA damaged a few ships, but nothing seriously.
With their retreat cut off, the morale of the defenders plummeted. They surrendered a few days later. It was belived that somewhere around 50k troops surrendered in Sicily.
The RN also had the upper hand at the war below the sea. The submarine wolfpacks that had put the fear of God in the Brittish merchant marine, now found themselves the hunted. Convoy losses were lower than they had since the start of the war, and Axis submarines were now most often sunk when encountered.
Then, in the beginning of February, It was time for Operation Mincemeat, the invasion of Sardinia, and later Greece. In a twist of fate, an officer with the full plans for Operation Mincemeat in a briefcase chained to his wist fell overboard from a transport outside Italy. His corpse was washed up on shore, but Italian and German intelligence officers thought it to be a ruse- it was just too convenient to be true. Sardinia was defended by troops whose sole purpose had been to delay any attack untile the RM could engage the attackers. The troops stationed here had not seen their home since the war started, and once the Tommys were ashore, the defence crumbled like a scone at teatime.
Within just a week, Sardinia was liberated. Now Italy would not be able to harvest her rich mines of rare materials anymore!
Authors note: Why does Sardinia produce so much rares? What does it represent?
However, by then, even more important news came from Washington. The Emipre of Japan had declared war on the United States of America!
Knowing that the largest industrial nation in the world now had joined them in the struggle ensured the Brits that they would, ultimately, emerge victorious. It further strenghtened their resolve to win the war.
UK and USA had a plan how to defend ready. US paratroopers would land in the Phillipines, and the RN would attack from India and the USN would ferry troops from the US mainland.
However, Cunninghams gloomy predictions came true- he encountered a strong IJN taskforce of five fleet carriers- the Italians had obviously informed the Japanese of RN tactics. After a day long battle, both taskforces had to retreat, with no sunk ships on either side. Cunningham had to retreat to Alexandria. After encountering heavy IJN resistance, the USN chose to retreat rather than risk their troop transports. The Phillipines, and the US airborne troops, were doomed.
Knowing that the United States were on their side enabled the UK administration some... leeway in how it handled foreign affairs.
First, knowing that the Greeks were close to joining the Axis, Britain quickly "liberated" Greece. It what would become known as the "One day war", they quickly captured the government and military leaders and changed leadership to something more democratic. Most Greeks did not even know that they were invaded until weeks later.
Also, the ungrateful Sauds of Saudi Arabia refused to let the RN use their Red Sea harbours. In Operation Laurence, two motorised divisions trekked through the entire desert and attacked Riyad. More men died from thirst than from the meagre defence put up by the Saudi irregulars. A more receptive cousin was crowed a day after the fighting stopped, and Saudi Arabia was now back in the fold. When Oman was liberated from the Japanese, total control of the Suez canal was in the hands of the Brittish.
However, Russia was still hard pressed. If Stalingrad fell, it would be next to impossible to break the German defence of France, and many then thought that a diplomatic solution would have to be sought. The Allies would have wanted to wait, but they did not have time- they had to act, even though their troops and doctrines were not up to the standard they would have wanted. March 16th, they launched Operation Overlord- the invasion of France. UK would invade from the Atlantic coast, USA from the Med, into Vichy France.
Initally, the troops advanced quickly, and were aided by large uprisnings of partisans from the French resistance.
However, it was soon obvious that the German troops were formidable opponents, and they fought a skillfull fighting retreat. Encirclements and counter encirclements were legio. A French armoured division was surrounded and destroyed, and some German infantry and paratroopers were encircled. However, the Allies knew they had to take Paris. Or else, if Archangelsk and any other important city fell, the fighting spirit of the free world would be broken, and they would be forced to discuss peace term. They pressed on, trying har to get the all-important encirclement.
And then, they got it. Over twenty German divisions captured around Paris. If they broke them, Germany would have no defences until the Rhine.
But the best laid plans... After less than a day, the Wehrmach had broken trough the encirclement, slowly retreating east.
Authors note: Germany had two players during this session. I think we all thought that lucky, otherwise I think Dapne would have been overloaded. Its no fun winning because of players making game breaking mistakes under pressure.
And then, disaster struck. In the weeks previous the USN had been scouted by IJN submarines, and they told the Brits that they had lost six fleet carriers, six battlehips and all escorts during a several days long battle in the Pacific. The IJN then launched an invasion of Honolulu. If Pearl Harbour was lost, it would mean total Japanese dominance in the Pacific. It could not be allowed. The RN kept two task forces in the US west coast, and now they set sail. They knew that they were all that stood between the Japanese and the West, and they knew that many of them would not return.
During a massive battle outside of Pearl Harbour, they attacked the IJN invasion taskforce, and took them by surprise. The HMS Queen Elizabeth suffered several torpedo hits and was sunk, but the transports carrying troops were easy targets outside their beaches. Many, many were sunk and went down with all hands.
However, the IJN naval supremacy was too great, and both the SAG and the CV taskforce were forced to retreat into Pearl Harbour, badly damaged.
It seemed the IJN had suffered enough, and retreated, allowing the RN to bravely run away, limping back to safer ports. Neither the USN nor the RN understood why the IJN CVs were such killing machines. Nothing seemed to harm them. No answer to them appeared to the Navy staffs than to build even more CVs.
The Eyes of Dover and Ears of Malta
The War was still looming on, and though UK had heard from the US diplomats that the administration was making more and more efforts to join the Allies, Britain still stood alone. They did not have the armoured might of the Wehrmacht, and could not hope to defeat them in open battle, but they had something more. Intelligence. Since 1938, large listening stations had been built in Dover and Malta. Even before the outbreak of the war, they stood ready. When the officers and mathematicians working at Bletchley Park broke the Enigma, they had so much information that they did not know what to do with it all.
The entire defensive structure of Italy was laid bare. They had obviously chosen to defend on the beaches. Most of the beaches were defended by single milita brigades, or so it was thought.
Since Operation Gamey, the Germans had chosen to withdraw from coastal areas, denying the Brittish army any easy prey. After the fall of France, UK had supported two Underground resistance movements in occupied France, and they had grown exponentially.
However, after the fall of the Regia Marina, Zidston Churchill was insistent that the next targets had to be Italian- Sicily and Sardinia. Sicily was chosen to be attacked first, as the troops in Sardinia were thought to be unable to withdraw.
On Jan 11th, the invasion was launched. The motorised infantry that attacked still had problems before coming ashore, and UK had no active marine divisions. Had the beaches been defended by regular Italian troops, it could have been a bloody affair.
However, once the troops came ashore, their superior training, equipment and tea supplies tipped the scales. The important port of Taranto soon fell, and after just two weeks the Italian and German defenders were rushing to the sea to try to get over to mainland Italy. What they found was a full RN SAG waiting for them, attacking any ferry that even tried to exit the ports. Attacks from the RA damaged a few ships, but nothing seriously.
With their retreat cut off, the morale of the defenders plummeted. They surrendered a few days later. It was belived that somewhere around 50k troops surrendered in Sicily.
The RN also had the upper hand at the war below the sea. The submarine wolfpacks that had put the fear of God in the Brittish merchant marine, now found themselves the hunted. Convoy losses were lower than they had since the start of the war, and Axis submarines were now most often sunk when encountered.
Then, in the beginning of February, It was time for Operation Mincemeat, the invasion of Sardinia, and later Greece. In a twist of fate, an officer with the full plans for Operation Mincemeat in a briefcase chained to his wist fell overboard from a transport outside Italy. His corpse was washed up on shore, but Italian and German intelligence officers thought it to be a ruse- it was just too convenient to be true. Sardinia was defended by troops whose sole purpose had been to delay any attack untile the RM could engage the attackers. The troops stationed here had not seen their home since the war started, and once the Tommys were ashore, the defence crumbled like a scone at teatime.
Within just a week, Sardinia was liberated. Now Italy would not be able to harvest her rich mines of rare materials anymore!
Authors note: Why does Sardinia produce so much rares? What does it represent?
However, by then, even more important news came from Washington. The Emipre of Japan had declared war on the United States of America!
Knowing that the largest industrial nation in the world now had joined them in the struggle ensured the Brits that they would, ultimately, emerge victorious. It further strenghtened their resolve to win the war.
UK and USA had a plan how to defend ready. US paratroopers would land in the Phillipines, and the RN would attack from India and the USN would ferry troops from the US mainland.
However, Cunninghams gloomy predictions came true- he encountered a strong IJN taskforce of five fleet carriers- the Italians had obviously informed the Japanese of RN tactics. After a day long battle, both taskforces had to retreat, with no sunk ships on either side. Cunningham had to retreat to Alexandria. After encountering heavy IJN resistance, the USN chose to retreat rather than risk their troop transports. The Phillipines, and the US airborne troops, were doomed.
Knowing that the United States were on their side enabled the UK administration some... leeway in how it handled foreign affairs.
First, knowing that the Greeks were close to joining the Axis, Britain quickly "liberated" Greece. It what would become known as the "One day war", they quickly captured the government and military leaders and changed leadership to something more democratic. Most Greeks did not even know that they were invaded until weeks later.
Also, the ungrateful Sauds of Saudi Arabia refused to let the RN use their Red Sea harbours. In Operation Laurence, two motorised divisions trekked through the entire desert and attacked Riyad. More men died from thirst than from the meagre defence put up by the Saudi irregulars. A more receptive cousin was crowed a day after the fighting stopped, and Saudi Arabia was now back in the fold. When Oman was liberated from the Japanese, total control of the Suez canal was in the hands of the Brittish.
However, Russia was still hard pressed. If Stalingrad fell, it would be next to impossible to break the German defence of France, and many then thought that a diplomatic solution would have to be sought. The Allies would have wanted to wait, but they did not have time- they had to act, even though their troops and doctrines were not up to the standard they would have wanted. March 16th, they launched Operation Overlord- the invasion of France. UK would invade from the Atlantic coast, USA from the Med, into Vichy France.
Initally, the troops advanced quickly, and were aided by large uprisnings of partisans from the French resistance.
However, it was soon obvious that the German troops were formidable opponents, and they fought a skillfull fighting retreat. Encirclements and counter encirclements were legio. A French armoured division was surrounded and destroyed, and some German infantry and paratroopers were encircled. However, the Allies knew they had to take Paris. Or else, if Archangelsk and any other important city fell, the fighting spirit of the free world would be broken, and they would be forced to discuss peace term. They pressed on, trying har to get the all-important encirclement.
And then, they got it. Over twenty German divisions captured around Paris. If they broke them, Germany would have no defences until the Rhine.
But the best laid plans... After less than a day, the Wehrmach had broken trough the encirclement, slowly retreating east.
Authors note: Germany had two players during this session. I think we all thought that lucky, otherwise I think Dapne would have been overloaded. Its no fun winning because of players making game breaking mistakes under pressure.
And then, disaster struck. In the weeks previous the USN had been scouted by IJN submarines, and they told the Brits that they had lost six fleet carriers, six battlehips and all escorts during a several days long battle in the Pacific. The IJN then launched an invasion of Honolulu. If Pearl Harbour was lost, it would mean total Japanese dominance in the Pacific. It could not be allowed. The RN kept two task forces in the US west coast, and now they set sail. They knew that they were all that stood between the Japanese and the West, and they knew that many of them would not return.
During a massive battle outside of Pearl Harbour, they attacked the IJN invasion taskforce, and took them by surprise. The HMS Queen Elizabeth suffered several torpedo hits and was sunk, but the transports carrying troops were easy targets outside their beaches. Many, many were sunk and went down with all hands.
However, the IJN naval supremacy was too great, and both the SAG and the CV taskforce were forced to retreat into Pearl Harbour, badly damaged.
It seemed the IJN had suffered enough, and retreated, allowing the RN to bravely run away, limping back to safer ports. Neither the USN nor the RN understood why the IJN CVs were such killing machines. Nothing seemed to harm them. No answer to them appeared to the Navy staffs than to build even more CVs.
I can't get enough of this dual perspective type of updates. something impossible to do in SP, but here, it really feels like reading an alternate history book.
I can't wait to get to the last page...
I can't wait to get to the last page...
Zid, I love your naming. "Operation Gamey" and "Zidston Churchill". Priceless.
Epic naval battles, but it looks like you haven't been successful in sinking Japanese CVs.
Now we know that you had radars... and they are as powerful as ever!
Epic naval battles, but it looks like you haven't been successful in sinking Japanese CVs.
Now we know that you had radars... and they are as powerful as ever!
Sardinia
Up to 1960 (and since Rome Empire), Sardinia had a huge mining industry, mostly in coal, aluminium and lead.
This can help you figure out what's left of it:
"(...) There is little fishing (and no real maritime tradition), but the once prosperous mining industry is still active though restricted to coal (Carbonia, Bacu Abis), antimony (Villasalto), gold (Furtei), bauxite (Olmedo) and lead and zinc (Iglesiente, Nurra). The granite extraction represents one of the most flourishing industries in the northern part of the island. The Gallura granite district is composed of 260 companies that work in 60 quarries, where 75% of the Italian granite is extracted. The cork district, in the northern part of the Gallura region, around Calangianus and Tempio Pausania, is composed of 130 companies and has become the driver of Sardinian economic development. Every year in Sardinia 200,000 quintals of cork are carved, and 40% of the end products are exported. Fishing along the coasts is also an important activity on the island. Portoscuso tunas are exported worldwide, but primarily to Japan."
Source: wiki
Up to 1960 (and since Rome Empire), Sardinia had a huge mining industry, mostly in coal, aluminium and lead.
This can help you figure out what's left of it:
"(...) There is little fishing (and no real maritime tradition), but the once prosperous mining industry is still active though restricted to coal (Carbonia, Bacu Abis), antimony (Villasalto), gold (Furtei), bauxite (Olmedo) and lead and zinc (Iglesiente, Nurra). The granite extraction represents one of the most flourishing industries in the northern part of the island. The Gallura granite district is composed of 260 companies that work in 60 quarries, where 75% of the Italian granite is extracted. The cork district, in the northern part of the Gallura region, around Calangianus and Tempio Pausania, is composed of 130 companies and has become the driver of Sardinian economic development. Every year in Sardinia 200,000 quintals of cork are carved, and 40% of the end products are exported. Fishing along the coasts is also an important activity on the island. Portoscuso tunas are exported worldwide, but primarily to Japan."
Source: wiki
Hawaii is fairly small, and far from japan. Could you not make the islands unconquerable by simply putting 3-4 INF/ENG/ART divisions on each island? The Japanese could not attack them head-on and it would take them a long time to starve the garrisons out.
Great update Zidston
Could you shed some light on operation "suicide" in Finland?
Could you shed some light on operation "suicide" in Finland?