Last edited by Narwhal; 28-01-2012 at 00:42.
Je ne suis d'aucune faction ; je les combattrai toutes -- Saint Just
Learning from Prussia - a Rise of Prussia AAR for beginners - or how a forced march in winter saved Prussia from anniliation.
A Tale of French and War Crimes : A double Multiplayer AAR of Wars in America with Loki100. Includes violence against English and Indians - not suited for children.
The War of 1812 - or how I burned down Washington
I thought of this scenario already, but as you said, it wouldn't be plausible. The Leagues between the 1160s (I begin with the League of Verona) and the last one against Frederick II. (there were in fact six leagues, but only the first and the last are well known because of their battle ageinst the two von Staufen). The driving force of the leagues were the communes, which in fact do not exist anymore; the only state, who had some similar points was in fact Venice, as the other territories were held by monarchies. And with the reign of the Visconti, the empire had only very determined power of this region; the only step to give at least a sign of imperial authority was the investiture of the Visconti as dukes, so that the emperors accepted their reign, but kept the de jure authority regarding the Regnum Italiae.
When the power of the Visconti vanished in the first half of the 15th century, and Venice, Milan and Florence fought with their allies against and with them, there was'nt even a real, significant action of the empire. Venice and Florence managed to conquer new holdings, which were later recognized by the empire.* Even the Sforzas were not recognized as rulers of Milan until the 1490s by the empire. We see that the empire is interested to keep its power, but de facto the italian states were independent to do what they wanted. Only Savoy remained more close to the empire, but had also an ambivalent relationship with France. On the other hand, the italian states didn't want to leave the empire at any cost, as we see that they legitimized their power with imperial help.
Indeed, even Maximilian, who was not only a capable, but also ambitious and talented ruler, did nothing in the first months against the army of the french king, when he entered in 1494/1495 Italy to conquer Naples. It was more the intervention of Pope Alexander VI., who created the League of Venice in 1495; and this was after the devasting siege of Naples, in which the french lost a lot of their troops - and after his devasting campaign through Savoy, Milan, Florence and Rome, reshaping the whole order which existed before.
My initial idea would be a resembling of the Italic league (1454) per event, after the last Lombard War; it would trigger after every major italian is at peace. The Italic league was a system of treaties and alliances between the italian powers, which guaranteed the peace on the italian peninsular for fourty years (if we let the Salt war out). At my point of view, this treaty between the five great powers - Milan, Venice, Florence, Papal states, Naples - was the cause for the peace and security in the Renaissance, not the membership in the empire. If one of the five powers was attacked, the others would attack the aggressor; the allies of the five powers joined this guarantee. Some historians argue, that this was the first pentarchy, which proved a balance of power on a regional level. The Quattrocento (15th century) was the "most italian century", as the penisular was not controlled by foreign powers, as it was before and then (Meuthen).
This event would be more a chain of events, as it resembles a systems of balance, which would remain as the relationships remain good and that there is no war between the states. An expanded "Italian factionalism". Maybe it could be expanded, as the Italic League was one of the first thoughts of an italian federation, but resembled more the ideas of Machiavelli in the later Discorsi than our thoughts which we connect with the word "federation". It can be destroyed, clearly. A lot of work to do, so I'm not ready yet with this idea, but I'm thinking, that in terms of stability, plausibility and historical accuracy this would be an interesting solution for the problems involving northern Italy.
But be sure, I made also some proporsals to CJL reagarding the unification of Italy, with more ways than only the Regnum Italiae/Kingdom of Italy one. I think it should be a big difference, if you follow a unification with a monarchy or with a republic; and also, if you favor the pope and a more autonomous way, or you favor the empire and remain in it.
Ah, yes, and another flag, as the napoleonic eagle is a rather unhistorical standard for a free Italy.
*For example, Venice gained the so called Reichsvikariat (imperial vicariate) for the conquered cities, e. g. Brescia, Bergamo in 1437.
Last edited by Marco Dandolo; 28-01-2012 at 00:47.
E' meglio vivere un giorno da leone che cent'anni da pecora.
- It is better to live one single day as a lion than a hundred years as a sheep.
Serenissima Italia - An Italian Ambition for EUIV
An overhaul mod for the whole Italian peninsula. Keep the Medici in power, play Calcio, meet Venetian Senators, be guest at the Palio and be prepared for a whole, new Italian experience!
Serenissima Italia is part of MUNDUS NON SUFFICIT, the first Major Overhaul Mod for EUIV!
This may be a bit out of scope for this mod, but I would love to see the implementation of the Anasazi cultures in the American southwest. These were fairly complex agricultural communities, and it would neat to see them in game. Honestly, I would just like to see that a native nation stands a chance at staying independant. If that can be accomplished by vanilla Magna Mundi, then great! Haha
EDIT: Also, is there any historical plausability in a united Basque country evolving during this time frame? I would love to see that, not just Navarre lol
Last edited by Brynn; 06-02-2012 at 22:21.
You mean out of some french and Spanish provinces? Well... a tag could be made for it, yes. What would be the name of such country?EDIT: Also, is there any historical plausability in a united Basque country evolving during this time frame? I would love to see that, not just Navarre lol
Well, the native name for the union of the Spanish and French Basque lands: Euskal Herria. Euskadi is only the part that is actually called "País Vasco" (Basque country)... Or, if you want to put it in a non-native name, it could be name "Vasconia" or, simplily "Basque Country"
Ok, thanks XD Not an expert in Basque history, really...
I was going to suggest... In XVII century, when the Portuguese and Catalonian revolt, the Duke the Medina Sidonia, and some other high nobles of Andalucia, plotted to make an independant kingdom of Andalucia (I Don´t remember the exact name that they wanted to use, really)... But Olivares discovered them, and forced them to abandon their conspiration. If they wouldn´t have been discovered, they could have created the country... Then, could it be a plausible country? n.n
been off the forums for awhile, busy with reading books for master's classes which can be both interesting and fun and sometimes boring so much so that I haven't even been able to beta the game very much but I am still around
The fronde is a good example of what should (hopefully) be represented through generalized events based faction mechanics (nobility)
Theodoro - - no.
as far as my mod goes I will mostly be adding provinces for new states (currently considering Lucca, Montferrat, and Saluzzo) which will only add to the fracturing of Italy, and more provinces for the Papal States (separate Urbino and Ancona) or Venice (considering dividing Bologna and Ravenna, which would go to Venice, and adding Padua), which will add to their capability to resist the Empire and other powers
Basque country - I think Navarre is fine. Unless you have a critical historical/gameplay reason why Navarre can not suit this purpose?
I am a native Spaniard too XD
The problem with Navarre being the basque country... Is that, traditionally, the Navarran nobility always has been Castillian, and only the peasants were basque. Then, it wouldn´t be a basque country... It would be a basque country dominated by Spanish. Other Basque country would be one where the people have rid off the Spanish minority, and formed their own nation...
Hey CJL78, now I dont know what has happened to Iceland in the real game, but last time I inquired about it, Iceland was still part of Denmark at game start. If this is still the case, maybe you could restore it to Norway where it belongs, and let game mechanics sort out the rest?
(Not that it is any benefit at all to have these (or this, if Iceland is one-provinvce) dirt poor province in the middle of the atlantic, but it annoys me a lot to see history go out the window.)
Regardless, I think that Navarre CAN be "the Basque country" in-game whether it was in RL or not.
Iceland is now one province, and owned by Denmark at game start while Norway owns two little island provinces (Faroe and Shetland Islands, iirc) While, like has been said, Iceland was technically part of Norway, I think allowing Denmark to control the province from the start allows the Danes to get involved in colonizing, which is more important. However, if Norway does not have a core on Iceland at start, I will give it one, so that it can fight for it back if they break the union/revolt
I know it is not very popular, but creating new tags when there is one already for the same culture and the same provinces could be used for where they really are needed. Not that a Basque Country and an Andalusian Kingdom wouldn't be cool, but just when they can be added after other more important countries.
Magna Mundi old beta tester
From Manipur to Milan, each nation has a story to tell.
Well, actually navarre was more french and aragonese than castillian in cultural terms... Indeed, navarreses and castillians were fierce enemies
I would seriously consider having a fully fleshed out "millet' system for the Ottomans, this really allowed for their expansion and stability in newly expanded territories. Allowing for the community decreases badboy, but it lowers cultural and religions assimilation eightfold, as well as decreasing all but manpower and core gain (which should be boosted in muslim provinces) This coupled with the autonomous statue modifier should allow for a realistic expansion, although a special casus belli for countries in the asian mediterranean should be included with extremly now infamy gain. Also a decision in the absence of the ottoman or malemuks to establish protectorates over the berber countries if they own constantinople, jerusalem and cario and the other rival does not exist.
Will we have more provinces for China and Japan?