Shadow of the Andes - An Interactive Chilean AAR

[Red Cesar]

"We cannot simply "hope" that the others nations of South America will simply bicker among themselves, without targeting us, nor can we assume that the state is in adequate shape to defend itself from rebellious elements at this time. We simply can't afford to be defenseless for several years, we must rebuild at a slower rate, while being in adequate shape to fight off the vulturous nations that are our neighbors."

-General Cesar Roseno

[ThunderHawk3]

((As a side-note here, I think we need a few more candidates before I'm willing to move into the primaries, but we have enough voters. Current vote on the Peru-Bolivia Act is 6-5 in favor, so it's a close vote and the polls are still open.))

[Devotist]

General Roseno, trying to incite fear is not going to get us out of dire straits. A containment of the military is by no means ensuring we are defenseless. We will be defenseless when the army realizes we have no ability to sustain it, who will stop it from launching a coup or mutiny? That instability will provoke our neighbors to be opportunists, far more than a simple reduction now. The empire on which the sun never sets may suffer the costs of a powerful and large army, but Chile is no such country.

((The opposing faction actually had a sizable majority until all these pro-military politicians and the disproportionate number of generals joined in. It makes me want to groan at how Chile has such a large number of generals.

Yaye for the Peru-Bolivia Act

*Froths at the mouth*))

[King50000]

((Making my character now, just want to get my vote in. We can vote without a character, right?))

Yaye for the Peru-Bolivia Act

[ThunderHawk3]

((Making my character now, just want to get my vote in. We can vote without a character, right?))

Absolutely.

[Red Cesar]

"We are unstable now as it is, simply slowing the rate of economic growth will not ensure the destruction of our economic system. The system will recover, but if an enemy strikes while we are weak, there are lives and land on the line that can simply never be regained."

-General Cesar Roseno

[OConner]

I agree with the General, although would it not be prudent to approach Brazil or another nation to secure an ally in case of war?

[Devotist]

Weak? How is such a large army for a country of our size weak? Land that is mostly empty? What makes this large and unsustainable army and empty land so valuable for you? Is bankruptcy worth the extravagance of our army and the maintenance of empty land? Develop our rivers of gold, and the rest will come in time.

You forget that Brazil is going to be just as hungry as these hawks claim our neighbors to be, if they truly are the evils we make them out to be. Secure Britain or the United States as an ally, for they are detached from the countries that wish to subdue Chile.

[OConner]

Yes, Brazil is expansionist, but they do not border us, thus when they expand it will not be at our expense, unlike Bolivia and Argentina. I have enormous respect for the British, however, they thing they respect the most is military power. If we have none, it will be difficult to obtain their protection. Besides, both Britain and the United States are imperial powers. Until we show them that we are the same, they will attempt to control us.

[Devotist]

Chile, even in its current state, is in no position to be imperialist. I have no problems at all with being partners with the greatest empire on the face of this planet, enjoying its protection and sharing its benefits, rather than engaging in fruitless adventures for the sake of being an "imperial power." Being an imperial and warmongering power will earn us no diplomatic friendliness from Britain.

[King50000]

Name: Colonel Manuel Carrera
Born: 1789
Party: Conservadores
Background: Serving during the Chilean War of Independence, Carrera served under his older brother, General José Miguel Carrera, fighting courageously against the Spanish. With the death and betrayal of his brother by Pro-San Martin military forces while in exile, Manuel slowly grew a deep hatred of San Martin, a hatred that began to spread to the troops under his command as well. He remained loyal in public but in private, he began to plot an eventual coup against the President, shortly after his second term. With the announcement of new elections, though, Manuel called off his plans and his troops stood down. He now waits to watch as events unfold.

((Was going to make him a General, but Devotist is right, we have alot of them already))

[Pallen]

Mayro Armando de Vasces,

The states of Europe have waged war over eachother for centuries, because they are all ruled by a single being, a Monarch whose word is law and whose daily mood will decide the lives of many. Many nations of South and North America are democracies, were not a single person can so easily proclaim war. We have a house of qualified people with whose different views and backgrounds, contribute to a decision which will serve the purpose of our state most beneficially. No countries in South America holds any claims over Chilean territories, and there are no tensions or any sign of war.

To return to the matter of the Bill, then even though this is what was proposed by the president, then we have many other strings we can pull to repair our economy without demolishing the military. We can raise the taxes up to 50% indstead of the 75%, then we will have a greater income, thus sparing the military for the most part. This means that the military will suffer next to nothing, while we send our the coming president to negotiate a loan from the United States of America. We share the same values and surely they would help to strengthen our democracy, thus we can invest in the mining industry and invest in refnining, producing more minerals and gold. This would in turn pay the debt off, and we would be creating more income for the state.

In short

1) Taxes raised to 50%
2) Minor Military Cutbacks, effectivly only 20% of the original cutback required.
3) Take a loan from the United States of America
4) Invest this in the mining industry

[Soulstrider]

And it's not like the other countries are in better state than us, we all suffered in the revolt against the Spanish, if they decided to invade someone their economy will probably not sustain the war for a long time, the only real treat would be Brazil and they have no border with us.

[Devotist]

I believe Senator Romano's proposal is a good start to a proper bill. However, I suggest the following amendment:

Military cutbacks are 35-50% of the original requirements.

Anything else is lackluster and halfhearted.

[Red Cesar]

"When did I say our current military was weak? You misquote me Senator. Land that is mostly empty? Is that land not part of our Fatherland? Did we not fight tooth and nail for independence for that land? And you would have it torn away from us, simply to maintain your social status-quo? I care so much for a large army, and for that "empty land" for the reason that without our military, that land which is our Fatherland, could easily be torn away by our vulturous neighbors."

-General Cesar Roseno

[OConner]

Senator Eduardo Emilio Romano,

First, I would like to state that I support your new plan. I was thinking of proposing a moderate plan myself. I am not a rampant imperialist. Please never mistake me for one. But may I point out that the most powerful nations of Europe are not absolute monarchies. The United Kingdom, France, and Prussia all have democratically elected officials.

[Red Cesar]

((What are you all talking about disproportionate amount of generals? There are two generals, me and Savoy, and I think one Admiral-captain-whatever.))

[ThunderHawk3]

((A side-note for the participants: It looks like you're drafting a compromise military spending bill. Whenever you agree on a final form, it can be put to a vote. Since the President's bills take priority, as I wrote in the rules post, voting on the Peru-Bolivia Act must finish before a compromise can be considered. That means you'll have a chance to see if the Peru-Bolivia Act succeeded or failed before putting forward your own compromise to amend or override it.

By my count, we're at 7-5 in favor right now, with no new candidates announced since my last tally.))

[OConner]

((What are you all talking about disproportionate amount of generals? There are two generals, me and Savoy, and I think one Admiral-captain-whatever.))

((yea I don't get it. Do people think my character is a general or something?))

[King50000]

((We only have 6 brigades. So a third General, me, would make three armies of 2 brigades each. I, personally, would rather have 2 armies of 3 brigades each than 3 of 2. So that's why I went as a Colonel.))

I, Colonel Manuel Carrera, shall run for the Conservadores nomination.

((There's a third condidate TH))