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Thread: Last Tango in 1.3 - An Argentine AAR

  1. #61
    Fantastic AAR! Not only has it prompted me to have a highly enjoyable game as Argentina, but it's also inspired me to post after a year of lurking

  2. #62
    Awesome AAR!

  3. #63
    Ask how many Divisions I have! InnocentIII's Avatar
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    Chapter Eighteen: War In Russia

    NOTE - Flikr says I've reached the limit for a free account and that only the most recent 200 photos I have uploaded will be "displayed". If this means I cannot see the old ones except here, fine. If it means they stop displaying the images from early chapters, then some might disappear briefly until I make changes. .

    Dewirix You're right about the risk, which is why I'm stuck in such a small area in some places. I'm hoping I can pile local troops into a defensive fight if need be. Good points on Korea, too.

    Swiss Pauli Thanks, you flatter me! Hope you keep enjoying it. I'm happy to see a good number of hits each night, but I especially appreciate the comments.

    KingMaker100 Thank you! Hopefully I can do badly enough to keep it exciting.

    Previously on "Last Tango" - the war in Russia starts off going quite well, considering Russia's two million man march. Russia might not have my technology, but as Stalin said, quantity has a quality all its own. In each of the three Argentine salients, Russia equaled or exceeded Argentina's forces when we left off. Russia appears to be massing around Riga. By the way, I live ten miles from a town called Riga. It's where our county has its landfill. Coincidence? Yes.

    At the end of January 1908 we take another Riga-area province. My original plan, had this war gone very well, was to demand another Russian state, perhaps one between Russia and Germany. Options, options. However, the Russians have other ideas, and since they are able to attack two of my 30,000-man armies with 100,000 men each, their opinion must be considered.



    I can match the Russians in the southern battle, and come close in the northern one, and I did drop 50,000 men off in St. Petersburg, but in all my battles I can only see a quarter of the Russian army. The rest is going to get here eventually, and even if half stays out of sight for another month or more, that doubles their troops. This will get dicey before it gets over. I whistle a few times and call "here General, anyone seen a general?"



    Maybe one's on his way. They have to be special ordered. The two battles reach near-parity, and the Russians move a couple 40,000-man armies into the provinces I had occupied. Fortunately, my outnumbered troops in Korea receive reinforcements from Argentina. Note that the World Market has gotten back into balance, and I have been able to recruit Guards to my heart's content. It helps that I built liquor factories from around 1839.



    In early February we invent Stormtrooper Training, and we are pleased that their too-accurate-to-be-Sandpeople shooting skills will add that +1 attack bonus to the front immediately. We take three more Korean provinces, two of which are not what we're asking for in the peace deal. The Kimchaek battle remains a roughly even one until mid-February when our men unload. Things start to go our way there, but there's no way to pocket the Russians when bordering China.



    The Riga battles go well. In Dorpat I kill 31,000 for a cost of under 7000, and as you can glimpse in the bottom left of this screenshot, the other battle is going well. I keep looking at the map for chances to pocket the enemy, but it takes all I can muster to win the battles in the first place. That's 50,000 Russians not fighting just in this screenshot. Don't worry, that will change soon. The number, I mean. And also the not fighting.



    On March 5, 1908 I take three more Korean provinces. My warscore is up to 23, and the peace offer is down to 14, but still the Russians would not take it. We'll see whether and when we get to that point before I decide whether to demand more. I'm not holding my breath. I take three more Riga-area provinces a few days later. Odessa is now a backwater, I'm just holding what I've taken. It's screenshots like this that have me constantly checking the peace negotiations when I take a province.



    That's 200,000 Russians in combat, and 170,000 looking for a way in. I'm guessing they'll find a door before long. How many fresh Russians can 250,000 Argentines beat without a break? I have this vision of Helm's Deep, except I have no wall. Score 25, peace offer 14, still unacceptable. And the trouble is that I have reached or will soon reach the +25 limit for battles in my warscore, even with nice results like this +6.4



    Or this +4.2



    Warscore is now +31 and peace deal still 14, and the Russians still say "Nyet!" Fortunately, I'm around 90% in my occupation of St. Petersburg, and the Russians are not yet contesting that. And then, good news! I found the Russian reinforcements!



    Look carefully at the number below, or at the list on the right. Yes, that's 318,000 Russians, added to the nearly 200,000 visible elsewhere in this screenshot. At 500,000 men, this is only 1/4 of Russia's force. And the Russians decide to try their own version of "get her!", sending 400,000 men into one fight. I don't think that the Enemy Plotting Cards I just invented are going to help me here. North of the fight you can see that the last of my Belgian forces has landed (my navies where held up for some time in sea battles, and I didn't think/want to extract them manually).



    On April 5 I take St Petersburg, and as you can see the big Korean battle still has not been decided yet.



    I Win!



    That is to say that, in a spirit of generosity, I chose not to add further war goals. What a guy.
    I follow Paradox on Twitter and have Johan's photo on my phone for Twitter messages. I also follow the Pope. When the Pontiff tweets, I see the picture and lately I wonder "yes, but is Johan speaking ex cathedra?"
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  4. #64
    Historically plausible Dewirix's Avatar
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    A well-deserved victory. There's not much point trying to eliminate Russian brigades once you've got what you wanted as they'll be able to mobilise them all over again the next time they're in a war.

    What was Russian war weariness like at the end?
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  5. #65
    Second Lieutenant CromagnonX's Avatar
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    Very nice job, and great reading! I especially like the tongue-in-cheek comments craftily inserted.

    Edit: Oh, and the Ottomans throwing you out? Very annoying. Happened to me five times with the same country (Kalat, I think), so I took to stationing a garrison there. I don't think I went to war with them, though, so I'm not sure if it really is due to "bad relations."
    Last edited by CromagnonX; 03-10-2011 at 19:51.
    Cheers,
    Cromagnon

  6. #66
    Ask how many Divisions I have! InnocentIII's Avatar
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    Chapter Nineteen: A Couple More Wars

    Dewirix Thanks, and good point on the conscripts, though I get so used to some tactics it's tough to turn them off. On War Weariness, I really wished I had checked. Oddly enough, however, that will continue to be an issue for some people

    CromagnonX You're on to me! My search on the Diplo-Under-Seige led to posts where commentors said they thought it was bad relations, I haven't checked the event itself so I am uncertain.

    Previously on "Last Tango" - Two Million Screaming Russians were held off long enough to grab a worthless chunk of real estate, but one which is well positioned to allow me to cause further mischief. I solemnly swear that I am up to no good.

    As time moves on, it becomes harder and harder to clean up after your wars. Grabbing all my soldiers from around the world is much more difficult than it used to be, when I could simply march them back over the Argentine border. Now that the war is over, let's look over my more peaceful pursuits. Colonizing continues to go well.



    We discover Phenominalism as we clean up the debris of war, and hope that our brigades will be fit for action soon. The only reforms I can enact are a shorter workday or Acceptable Pensions, so I continue to pass, hoping that the unsatisfied desire for social reforms will help the push for political ones. I note that I am taking in an extra $6000/day and have nearly $14m in the bank. I generally like a positive cash flow when at peace, and between that and forgetting to lower taxes after a war, I often end up with more money than I really need. On the other hand, it's great to spend the last ten years bleeding cash for Dreadnoughts and not caring. In July 1908 I reach 5 million Platineans and my fifth NF. As much as I'd like the 6th, the collateral consequences of getting it - more dangerous rebellions - seem pretty harsh. Here's the source of Argentina's power.



    Hello, Sokoto! Since China and the UK always field absurd armies, what really matters on that list is that I have triple the soldier Pops of anyone else. God has given us an army, now let us enjoy it. In November, I once again Sphere the Ottomans with bad relations (only -77 this time), and immediately get Diplomatic Mission Under Seige. I then think, "maybe this is supposed to happen?" At the risk of foreshadowing, in April 1909 I develop the ability to use Gas Attacks, which fortunately happen automatically. I'd hate to have to click "use gas". I don't mind starting wars which will could kill millions, and then describing the wars to readers using two diagrams. And. A. Joke. But I want it done in a gentlemanly fashion. Still, so long as my hands are clean, let's hope that this is an advantage I get to use. In July I notice that Belgium has turned Commie! Yes! I love the changed flags for communist states and the like. I have 13.32 Infamy, and I need a place for more armies. I demand Gelderland, and attack. Let's just say I'm not going to waste a lot of bandwidth on this war.



    Two more armies are arriving by sea, but other than having one army head for each province I do no planning whatsoever on these battles. I win.



    I discover Semi-Automization (-10% factory cost) mid-war, and settle in for the long European sieges. In September I learn to defend against gas attack. Then my elections start. Good thing I'm at war. My occupations begin to succeed after about 6 months, but many take eight months. In April 1910, Belgium grants me what I have demanded. In May, my first tanks are completed back home, and we discover Assembly Line and another 10% discount on factories. Refrigerator technology is invented in June, half an RGO boosting tech all in one invention. I have 580 brigades now, and with all the tank building going on there are another 100 in the hopper. I'll be hoping for a real war before long. At full supply, I now spend 17,000 a day on bullets and k rations. The poor are good for 15,000 of that, and the rich 5,000 more, so life is good. In November I begin work on grabbing China, which is in the Russian Sphere of Influence. The UK, USA and France are all friendly. I do have a nice land border, however, and the other powers seem to be distracted. November finds Africa reaping the traditional harvest of tanks.



    In December, the Ottoman Empire grants us military access, and we begin piling men into European OE territory. We are apparently still the only builder of Barrels in the world come 1911. Too bad I can't put an export ban into place. In Aeroplanes we nearly equal the UK, and outproduce all the rest of the world. In Automobiles we equal the UK, and again outproduce the rest of the world combined. In May 1911, the colonization of Africa is complete, and Argentina has claimed a vast swath of the continent.



    In May, despite being discredited here and there, we hit Friendly with China. We have all military techs available in 1911. We're up to 640 brigades, below the UK and China, but the next power is Russia with under 200. Paraguay revolts and breaks off our relations, an amusing reminder of how little South America now means to us. Argentina is a world power, and our near neighbors might as well be in South Central India. In November, largely unopposed, we remove China from Russia's SoI. In January 1912 we note that our truce with Russia lasts until 6 April 1913. We are ready for round two.



    Research is not conducted through all 1913, to save up for Aeronautics which is available in 1914. Just as I hit 100 Influence with China, a border incident grants us the opportunity we'd been waiting for (that's with Russia, sorry I didn't get a clearer screenshot).



    In August 1913, China joins with us in a military alliance and grants us military access. We look over our plans against Russia, hoping that the UK, as France did last time, will see reason and not make this into a World War.



    We demand Budjak, which makes up for it's general lack of value with being really conveniently located to all our troops massed in the Ottoman Empire, and in the absence of forts. We try to frighten off potential enemies by asking our allies to join with us right from the DoW. China and the OE do, the USA does not. However, look at who our war is against. Ooopsie.

    I follow Paradox on Twitter and have Johan's photo on my phone for Twitter messages. I also follow the Pope. When the Pontiff tweets, I see the picture and lately I wonder "yes, but is Johan speaking ex cathedra?"
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  7. #67
    First Lieutenant Vaya con Queso's Avatar
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    We'll get that Argentine national back the only way we know how; by annexing the entire region where he is being held!

    Don't be too worried about the British, they aren't as scary as their reputation would suggest. There will be heavy fighting in the African colonies, and the may try to land troops in Belgium or even in your homeland, but it shouldn't be anything you can't handle.

  8. #68
    Historically plausible Dewirix's Avatar
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    With the British it'll come down to who can control the seas. If those 302 ships you've got contain a fair proportion of dreadnoughts then it shouldn't be so bad, and it may well be that you can put the squeeze on them.

    On the other hand, I wouldn't like to be in China's shoes right now. The Himalayas are going to be thick with redcoats.
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  9. #69
    Second Lieutenant CromagnonX's Avatar
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    We are apparently still the only builder of Barrels in the world come 1911. Too bad I can't put an export ban into place.
    But you can stockpile the barrels you make so they don't get put on the market. Once you fill your stockpile, though it's out of the bag.
    Cheers,
    Cromagnon

  10. #70
    Ask how many Divisions I have! InnocentIII's Avatar
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    Chapter Twenty: Fighting Sauron

    Vaya con Queso Now that's what I call foreign policy!

    Dewirix I'm out of luck on controlling the seas, but dodging around in them is a possibility. Talk about playing in traffic. If you're right on China, well, it'll be like every EU game I've ever played. The worst possible position for any other power to be in is my primary ally.

    CromagnonX Ah, I really need to try that sometime.

    Previously on "Last Tango" - Meaning to fight way too many Russian troops for a worthless bit of Russia, we accidentally start a fight with way too many more UK troops for a worthless bit of Russia.

    Fortunately, we brought precious China. China has a land border with both the UK and Russia, and stacks and stacks of guys. While I pay no attention whatever to those fights (which I only just now realized is something of a failing in the AAR, sorry), I know from experience that the AI is a master at walking vast numbers of soldiers across great distances. My troubles are far greater than that, however. I kind of counted on the 750,000 men in Belgium getting into this war, and without control of the seas, I'm going to be hard pressed to bring them anywhere. And the UK, not Argentina, is likely to have control of the seas, despite my Cruiser and Dreadnought building spree. The war with the UK also brings combat to other parts of the world, like south and central Africa. I used to recruit troops there, but mostly brought them to the "front" before combat. So Sokoto has one decent army, and Zulu has one under construction. Here is a general disposition of Argentine forces:

    Belgium 750,000
    Ottoman Empire 500,000
    Korea 400,000
    Africa 150,000
    Other 200,000

    That's 2 million Argentine troops, but 0.5 million troops are where I need them, and 1.5 million are elsewhere. As expected, the war in Russia starts off well in the target area around Budjak and Odessa, since a half million men simply walk to battle.



    The Brits occupy Johore provinces, which are completely undefendant, and expendable. They're also pretty well fortified, an old habit of mine. I wish there was a "build every fort I can build right now" button. Here's the order of battle, sort of. Note that Russia has not yet mobilized, and that between Argentina and China, we are about even with our enemies in brigades. For the moment.



    The war in south Africa heats up, and I get a chance to see how nice gas attacks are against a defenseless enemy. I had neglected Zulu for decades, and then noticed that I could recruit a whole army there, and had started to a couple years earlier. Lucky break.



    The battles in Odessa go well. Note my small armies, and access to Moldavia. If at all possible, I am going to pocket my enemy this war.



    Here is a constant problem I'll face in this war, the British navy. I believe - sorry I am not sure - that these ships pin my St Petersburg invasion fleet into the Baltic for a bit. My main two combat fleets are headed up to the Channel.



    Tanks and gas and pockets, oh my!



    I do manage to get 80,000 men to St. Petersburg. And I win that battle in Umtata, killing 10,000 of the 24,000 and capturing the rest. But there are plenty more where those came from, and 30,000 show up while my men are still in the red. A transport fleet is sunk off the ivory coast, I have no recollection of sending them, and I am pretty sure the ships were empty. By the simple device of leaving some empty space, I invite 45,000 Russians into my pocket. Notice the not insignificant Ottoman Empire force.



    A check of the peace negotiation shows me with +4 battles, +4 total score, and of course no where near enough to get what I want. Did I mention the UK navy? The shot below is not a good sign.



    I generally dislike dealing with navies except when they transport my armies, but the UK lives or dies on the ocean. My tech disadvantage is going to be like that bad war against Chile. On the other hand, as you can see on the far right of this next shot, my battle fleets are engaged with British ships, whose ships are therefore engaged with my battle fleets. Remember how close Belgium is to the UK? I did. Let's see how this works.

    I follow Paradox on Twitter and have Johan's photo on my phone for Twitter messages. I also follow the Pope. When the Pontiff tweets, I see the picture and lately I wonder "yes, but is Johan speaking ex cathedra?"
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  11. #71
    Now that's ballsy. Good luck!

  12. #72

  13. #73
    Historically plausible Dewirix's Avatar
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    Good luck! I think you might be able to maintain local naval dominance in the Channel and the North Sea, and from the looks of it while the Royal Navy is large, a lot of it is old-fashioned. The Battle of the Gulf of Cadiz was your crusiers and dreadnoughts against the commerce raiders the UK has been able to build from the start.

    That said, I'd forgotten quite how ship-happy the AI can be at times (which comes from having only reached 1840 in my own AAR). Thirteen hundred ships will comfortably beat much better-equipped navies by sheer force of numbers.
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  14. #74
    Sergeant Pauly_Walnuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swiss Pauli View Post
    To Hull and back?
    Ha!!! Pure class!

  15. #75
    Second Lieutenant CromagnonX's Avatar
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    Remember how close Belgium is to the UK? I did. Let's see how this works.
    Hell yeah! I managed to invade and occupy half of the British Isles as Netherlands - twice! The UK does a shoddy job of defending home (for some reason, they never mobilized in either war), so if you can land a few armies, you'll gain major traction in the war.

    You must have developed Gas Defense and the UK not, which will help a ton as well.
    Cheers,
    Cromagnon

  16. #76
    General morningSIDEr's Avatar
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    Cracking stuff, I've just spent the last couple of hours reading through this, I'm enjoying it very much. From the highs of the closely fought victory over Chile in your first war with her, then to victory over Russia the first time around to the lows of the white peace with France, far from a shameful result, curse them for intervening! To losing all of your bureaucrats. Somehow.

    I'm enjoying reading about this current scrap (considering this is verging on a world war, perhaps 'scrap' is too mild a term) with Britain and Russia, intrigued as to how your landing on the British mainland will go. I'm sure the The Argentine Death Star (tm) will emerge triumphant though!

    The AAR itself is brilliant, it is good that you happily admit mistakes, where you wish you'd acted differently and your future plans and so forth, all of this laced with good wit. Exactly the kind of stuff I love to see in a gameplay AAR. I'll certainly be following this.

    Oh and my favourite line;

    Quote Originally Posted by InnocentIII View Post
    I develop a sophisticated plan to conquer Chile: I shout, "Get Her!"
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  17. #77
    Ask how many Divisions I have! InnocentIII's Avatar
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    Chapter Twenty-One: The Argentine Invasion

    Omen Thanks! My navies will certainly need it, and my armies ... we'll see.

    Swiss Pauli LOL, but, um, back?

    Dewirix Thanks. Yeah, the AI has ship numbers and I expect the UK has many techs I lack as well, my ships aren't sinking so much as hitting 0 Org.

    Pauly_Walnuts /agree

    CromagnonX True on navies. It might be a design decision in some respects, because with naval battles taking as long as they did, any serious rotation of ships in the north sea/channel would make invasion almost physically impossible. Still, you'd think someone would be watching.

    morningSIDEr Thank you very much, especially for respecting the (tm)! I love using Ghost Busters lines, though I'm still looking for a chance to say "I'm terrified beyond the capacity for rational thought."

    Previously on "Last Tango" - 1066 and all that, the Argentines could not wait for the release of CK2, and so invaded England.

    Just as the first provinces fall in Korea, which had no Russian troops, Argentine armies hit the beaches of eastern England. With the warscore heading south for us, given blockades and the lack of much captured territory so far, the UK adds a wargoal: Demand Argentinian Arucania! I realized later that this makes perfect sense. As the name implies, I own only some of Argentinian Arucania. The Brits colonized Easter Island, and therefore the AI wants the rest of the state. Of course, this opens up the possibility of a separate peace with Russia, so it might well be a good thing. Meanwhile, in another bad sign at sea, modern Argentine warships take a beating from what look like Jack Aubrey and his compatriots in wooden ships (those Frenchies are obviously taking collateral damage). I guess the fact that Argentina only developed her first steam ships fifteen years earlier means we don't really know how they work yet. Plus, our enemy are rather numerous, but it's not as though that's going to change. Argentinian Arucania might be more accessible to UK troops than to Argentine reinforcements if they must be returned from abroad, and I've only got 100k-ish troops in South America.



    We wipe out 35,000 Russian troops in Korea. Given our Chinese ally's numbers, we do not expect to see many more Russians in this part of the world.



    The results of the gulf of Cadiz are in, when I pull the ships away my transports are nearly all sunk, and while I lost no warships, I sank none either. We spread out in the Odessa region largely unopposed. Russia still has not mobilized in mid-February, I wonder if the AI looks at friendly troop totals to make that call? Take a look at the message box and you'll see that my men made it ashore in Lincoln and Hull on February 9, 1914. Having your eye on the Gulf of Cadiz doesn't look like such a victory now, does it Sauron?



    The pocketed Russians in Budjak are in the red, badly outnumbered and surrounded, so that's going well. On the other hand, my warscore is -3, explaining why the Brits added a demand.



    On February 19th we conquer Odessa, and on the 23rd we take another Korean province. More importantly, the battle in England rages. You dig in, I'll use Gas.



    Two more Russian provinces fall in February, and I "Lost" the naval battle off the UK when I pull my ships back to Belgium. I sank three and lost none, but I need mine available to make another dash for the coast if/when the opportunity presents itself. It turns out that my decision to throw more men into the battle of Newcastle-upon-Tyne (and yes, it feels weird to write that) was a mistake, as the Brits seriously reinforce their troops in Hull. My ships had recently been ordered away, so that sea battle was over.



    Russian and Korean provinces are falling regularly, and by March 10 my warscore is back in black. I abandon the occupation of Lincoln in an attempt to hold out in Hull long enough to win the battle of Newcastle-upon-Tyne, which can't end soon enough if you ask me, and you know that you do.



    On the 11th I take another Korean province, but that won't mean much if I lose in the UK. On the 12th, things take a turn for the worse, when it turns out that the Brits did not leave their home island as undefended as I'd hoped.



    Fighting in Britain itself, outnumbered 270k to 160k. I wonder how this turns out?
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  18. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by InnocentIII View Post
    Fighting in Britain itself, outnumbered 270k to 160k. I wonder how this turns out?
    Fantastically well as Britain instantly begins to beg for peace on whatever terms you demand?

    Well, maybe not, but hopefully your gas can give you the advantage needed to defeat Britain, things are looking a bit grim at present though. At least you are making progress against Russia. If need be securing a good peace deal with them and settling for whatever you can get with Britain would be no terrible thing.
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  19. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by InnocentIII View Post
    Meanwhile, in another bad sign at sea, modern Argentine warships take a beating from what look like Jack Aubrey and his compatriots in wooden ships (those Frenchies are obviously taking collateral damage). I guess the fact that Argentina only developed her first steam ships fifteen years earlier means we don't really know how they work yet. Plus, our enemy are rather numerous, but it's not as though that's going to change.
    It's the last part that's the real problem. In the Battle of Cadiz you've only got 25 warships against 178, allowing the Brits to wear you down through weight of numbers alone. If I were you I'd try massing my navy into a single large fleet and defeating the RN in detail. How many dreadnoughts and crusiers do you have in total?
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    don't worry too much about land battles against the Brits. they tend to have poor literacy and obsolete armies.
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