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Thread: The definite 1936-1946 WWII scenario

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    The definite 1936-1946 WWII scenario

    yeah...after many years of HoI II playing and inspired by a series of really great mods like the Final2 Mod, Core or the excellent Third Reich Mod or No Mercy Mod I decided to
    make yet another 1936-1946 scenario with emphasis on the core conflict between axis and allies (especially the war in the east) without "what if" stuff...I know this is problably the 98th attempt but I dare to say that I will have some unique features to be enjoyed which will raise immersion considerably...
    Ultimate goal is to create one of the most immersive german campaigns ever with a unique atmosphere according to the timeframe squeezing everything possible out of the old engine in order to circumvent and outwit some of the most important hardcoded limitations

    among other things there will be:
    1. country specific expensive elite divisions like:
    UK Commandos, US Rangers, Soviet Guard Infantry (41,43 and 45 model)...and of course german ss divisions with mot,mech and tank divisions (model 40 and 43)..all these are additional to the existing units in the game
    1a. UK,US and USSR ai will actually recruit the new elite infantry units
    2.Striped all unnecessary stuff and techs from all trees as this is only a pure WWII thing...1936-1946 (semimodern)
    2a...for building elite units player has to built certain authorities or ministries...
    3.German StuG tech tree with proper brigade pictures (now StuGs are to be considered instead of SP-Art as they give little morale and org)
    4. Reworked german SP Art tree with correct models
    5. New unique brigades for germany apart from normal models. Example: Tank Destroyers: Elephant (43) and Jagdtiger (44) buildable apart from normal Tank Destroyer tree..all with brigade pics,unique values,advantages and disadvantages...Regular Tank Destroyer tree is:Pz.Jg I, Marder II, Jagdpanzer (38t),Jagdpanzer IV,Jagdpanther
    6. 3 different heavy artillery pieces 38cmK5 Rail Art, 60cm Mortar Karl, 80cm Dora Rail Art..all buildable and unique without upgrading and with real brigade pictures for immersion
    7. Realistic production in comparison between the majors GER,UK,US,JAP and USSR
    and so on..and so on...
    8. Germany wont built heavy tanks until mid 1941..beware !
    8a. Other immersive featues which will come to my mind during developement...
    9. Entire setting and balance will make for a most difficult german scenario without excessive unit spawning
    10. Allies will outproduce axis at least by 2:1 depending on the course of the war and german conquest..the longer the war against Russia takes the harder it will get for Germany...
    11. 3 different super heavy artillerys to choose from for Germany with different prices,values and purposes...good for inital bombardment
    12. Reworked and reorganized/relocated Brigade system to make maximum usage of ability to show brigade pictures for immersion and flavor. Its useless to see pictures of Police/Pioneers but couldnt have pictures for hardequipment like StuGs or new Heavy Artillery Brigade (all countrys) or Super Heavy Rail Artillery for germany
    13. New Brigade for Infantry ALL COUNTRYS: Heavy Artillery 1938 and 1942 (expensive but great for attack support)
    14. Eliminated Light Armor Brigade cause it was a waste of a brigade slot with picture showing ability and from its values it was not even considered to be built by players (In 6 years of HoI II playing I never built it)

    Many of the minor features are inspired especially by The Third Reich mod and the No Mercy Mod...


    a few early developement alpha screens...everything visible is working already
    screens are in german...sorry ....if I wont get some helping hand Iam not sure when I will be able to deal with the english as I do developement in german ...in the meantime just google specific words if you really need to know what xyz exactly means..I think most things are obvious as we all now the tech trees,except for the secret weapons tree which is now called "Special Technologies"





    Last edited by chris10; 23-08-2011 at 17:00.

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    Sergeant jkduncan1973's Avatar
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    I have a bit of free time away from work, so I can try to help with the German to (American) English translation if you would like.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jkduncan1973 View Post
    I have a bit of free time away from work, so I can try to help with the German to (American) English translation if you would like.
    Thnx for your offer ..I still have considerable work to do on the tech concept but I will pm you once I can advance towards translating finished files...

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    3 different Tank Destroyers in 1944 at the same time (after meeting the other requirements of course). All with different advantages and disadvantages (attack,defense,morale,org,price,built time etc)...now choices are harder and immersion can greatly be increased by a lot bigger brigade diversity ( for those who like to play more historical and with a plausible army composition)...this will add a lot to flavor...

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    Beltz, Mayn Shtetele Beltz bestmajor's Avatar
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    maybe watch your PM box, i cant contribute to much, but a few things you mentioned are already done (mostly gfx).

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    War is over! if you want it Titan79's Avatar
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    Just like bestmajor, I can't lend you too big a hand but I think I could have fun making some icons for special units, should you ask for it.
    “Every truth passes through three stages before it is recognized: in the first it is ridiculed, in the second it is opposed, in the third it is regarded as self-evident” (Arthur Schopenhauer)


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    Super Heavy Artillery...3 different brigades with different values, prices and purposes...
    however due to engine limitations these brigades have to be built independently cause the engine would assign always the last model...so there would be no choice which brigade to add but I think one could live with it...having the agony of choice is already a huge step forward epecially considering the tremendous equipment diversity of the german armed forces...


    Quote Originally Posted by bestmajor View Post
    maybe watch your PM box, i cant contribute to much, but a few things you mentioned are already done (mostly gfx).
    Quote Originally Posted by Titan79 View Post
    Just like bestmajor, I can't lend you too big a hand but I think I could have fun making some icons for special units, should you ask for it.
    thnx a bunch guys ...no idea where this is going to end..I started doin an event for the eastern war 2 weeks ago and now Iam on the way to do half a total conversion

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    Beltz, Mayn Shtetele Beltz bestmajor's Avatar
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    well, i know those paintings are controversial - and maybe icons as well (dont know that - though)
    but take a look at Titans counter strip and clock. it makes things so much easier (i.e. organising your troops) and its obvious for everybody no matter what taste.

    small note about the german translation (i usually play in english): Betriebsstoff. was that you or has it been always like this? 10 out of 10 points.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bestmajor View Post
    Betriebsstoff. was that you or has it been always like this? 10 out of 10 points.
    me
    I already changed a bunch of little details to official Wehrmacht terms for immersion
    Wehrfähige=Mannschaften (wo angebracht)
    Stärke=Personalbestand
    Hardattack=Hartziel Angriff
    Softattack=Weichziel Angriff
    and similar things...I hate sloppy translations and usage of plain wrong terms..In english its easier but when it comes to german terms things are getting more complicated...have a look at this ..

    EDIT...Now I look at it there is still something weird...
    this is better
    Last edited by chris10; 23-08-2011 at 00:05.

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    War is over! if you want it Titan79's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chris10 View Post
    thnx a bunch guys ...no idea where this is going to end..I started doin an event for the eastern war 2 weeks ago and now Iam on the way to do half a total conversion
    Well, if you'll go on and will be interested in those icons for Sondereinheiten, feel free to ask.

    Quote Originally Posted by bestmajor View Post
    but take a look at Titans counter strip and clock. it makes things so much easier (i.e. organising your troops) and its obvious for everybody no matter what taste.
    Thanks, that's great credit from you
    “Every truth passes through three stages before it is recognized: in the first it is ridiculed, in the second it is opposed, in the third it is regarded as self-evident” (Arthur Schopenhauer)


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    Beltz, Mayn Shtetele Beltz bestmajor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris
    me
    I already changed a bunch of little details to official Wehrmacht terms for immersion
    Wehrfähige=Mannschaften (wo angebracht)
    Stärke=Personalbestand
    Hardattack=Hartziel Angriff
    Softattack=Weichziel Angriff
    finally somebody who knows the terminology. very fine. i'll probably return to german if sth comes out of this attempt.

    interested in an improved OOB?


    EDIT:
    Quote Originally Posted by Chris
    and similar things...I hate sloppy translations and usage of plain wrong terms..In english its easier but when it comes to german terms things are getting more complicated...have a look at this ..
    you're from spain?

    little suggestion:
    "Wir benötigen insgesamt XXX Wehrfähige um unsere Truppen (Divisionen) wieder auf Sollstärke zu bringen."

    its usually IST-Stärke vs. SOLL-Stärke (Iststärke/Sollstärke) - instead of Maximum

    Quote Originally Posted by Titan
    Thanks, that's great credit from you
    well, you can have likes and dislikes, but the counters + clock arent debatable. both make the game so much better.

    @Chris: i wouldnt invest so much time in railroad artillery. there are no ai commands for that, so its human thing only.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bestmajor View Post
    finally somebody who knows the terminology. very fine. i'll probably return to german if sth comes out of this attempt.
    interested in an improved OOB?
    OOB?..elaborate please....
    Quote Originally Posted by bestmajor View Post
    you're from spain?
    naah..Hamburg...just live in Spain
    Quote Originally Posted by bestmajor View Post
    little suggestion:
    "Wir benötigen insgesamt XXX Wehrfähige um unsere Truppen (Divisionen) wieder auf Sollstärke zu bringen."
    its usually IST-Stärke vs. SOLL-Stärke (Iststärke/Sollstärke) - instead of Maximum
    of course,this is correct...I already used Sollstärke in the text.csv
    Code:
    DIV_RE_IRO3;;;;;Die Sollstärke dieser Division beträgt bereits 100%. Verstärkungen werden nicht benötigt.;;;;;;x
    I got dragged away and decided to let the terms for a later stage when Iam finished with the unit and tech concept and have all techs an units up and running
    EDIT
    Quote Originally Posted by bestmajor View Post
    @Chris: i wouldnt invest so much time in railroad artillery. there are no ai commands for that, so its human thing only.
    This is the point...I focus on human player for DR...the ai wont be able to recruit the ss units either and the only reason it will recruit the Guards Inf, Commandos and Rangers is cause I trick the engine...but there is no way to make the ai differ between 2 diferent unit models (mot 40 vs. ss mot 40) for example....What I wanna do here is do add great immersion to the german gameplay,especially the great war in the east which is anyway the main argument of the entire game...

    For me its not so relevant to make this playable from either side with each country (this will always destroy balancing in one or another way)...
    I adquiered a great inside view in game balancing while developing a modfoldered campaign for the Rome Total War engine and its almost impossible to balance a game to be equally playable from all sides...to much unpredictability and to much possibilities..
    First comes the german campaing...then I see if playing with another major can work out..the ai wont miss units it doesnt know
    I prefer a extraordinary german campaign with huge immersion factor over a generic gameplay which trys to balance in all directions but doesnt really offer all possible depth

    Its a little like in real live...one usually can not have everything and has to set priorities ..like Der Grosse Friedrich said: "He who defends everything,defends nothing.."
    EDIT
    Quote Originally Posted by Titan79 View Post
    Well, if you'll go on and will be interested in those icons for Sondereinheiten, feel free to ask.
    thnx a bunch
    Last edited by chris10; 23-08-2011 at 00:45.

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    Beltz, Mayn Shtetele Beltz bestmajor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris
    OOB?..elaborate please....
    well ,some time ago i started working on these. http://www.lexikonderwehrmacht.de/ info basically. never really finished but a good start. be careful to insert it in your game as some divions/corps have leader-IDs which arent in your game and austrians are "sleeping" which are not in vanilla as well.

    what i did was eg inserting the border guards: http://www.lexikon-der-wehrmacht.de/...Gliederung.htm

    while reducing the strangth of some inf units (never finished, though)

    i'll attach this one here.
    just do not insert it in your game as it wont work without the leaders CSV. (some units have their original leader attached, and you dont have them in your lists.

    EDIT:
    Quote Originally Posted by Chris
    First comes the german campaing...then I see if playing with another major can work out..the ai wont miss units it doesnt know
    I prefer a extraordinary german campaign with huge immersion factor over a generic gameplay which trys to balance in all directions but doesnt really offer all possible depth
    note thats only me, the nerd. but delete the fake leaders then. i hate those wrong images, traits promotion dates, double leaders.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bestmajor View Post
    i'll attach this one here.
    just do not insert it in your game as it wont work without the leaders CSV. (some units have their original leader attached, and you dont have them in your lists.

    EDIT:
    note thats only me, the nerd. but delete the fake leaders then. i hate those wrong images, traits promotion dates, double leaders.
    interesting inc file..looks good.....what the deal with the dormant ss divisions?...are they activated by event like leades..never seen it before..whats the function realted to them ? ...I mean..I just recently analized the HoI II file structure and code execution to see if I can do what I wanna do but I lack experience in HoI II modding so lots of little details are unknown to me...

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    Beltz, Mayn Shtetele Beltz bestmajor's Avatar
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    interesting inc file..looks good.....what the deal with the dormant ss divisions?...are they activated by event like leades..never seen it before..whats the function realted to them ?
    well thats why i mentioned the compendium mod from luxor. those things are basically from him.
    the dormant mots are from HSR mod and the SS is from Compendium - so you cant use it.

    and yes you get an event to found the ss and you pay resources for that constantly (offmap), and then you get the divs (if you match the prerequisits, ie you'll get Galicia only if you have conquered Kiev, etc).
    same for the soviet guards, both guards and SS have different brigades which increase toughness. but all in all its only copied together very fast from different mods. from different mods and i wouldnt release it without permission as its not my work. but it adds flavour.

    whats mine are the leaders, of course.


    EDIT: on a side note: if you want to make the game funnier for a german player, you should focus on the soviets. Stalin line, molotov line, correction of the purges and these things. that will give you more fun than all ss divs you can imagine.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bestmajor View Post
    EDIT: on a side note: if you want to make the game funnier for a german player, you should focus on the soviets. Stalin line, molotov line, correction of the purges and these things. that will give you more fun than all ss divs you can imagine.
    I have projected such thing
    Quote Originally Posted by bestmajor View Post
    and yes you get an event to found the ss and you pay resources for that constantly (offmap), and then you get the divs (if you match the prerequisits, ie you'll get Galicia only if you have conquered Kiev, etc).
    .
    ah..ok..Iam not to fond of massive unit spawning anyways..I would rather prefer the player to manage his ressources and consider him to pay 20 MP and nearly 30IC on builidng a ss pz division with high combat value or 1,6 normal pz-divisions

    Quote Originally Posted by bestmajor View Post
    well thats why i mentioned the compendium mod from luxor. those things are basically from him.
    the dormant mots are from HSR mod and the SS is from Compendium - so you cant use it.
    the thing with modding is that there is no copyright cause the modder is the first who brakes the copyright law (when taking things down to the written law modding is illegal) and especially when it comes to coding and scipting nobody can claim an exlusive right to use one or another script command/code or whatever...I have written over 20.000 script lines for RS2 a Rome Total War conversion mod and I wont even bother if somebody uses part of my developed scriting code cause I have no right over it. Things become a bit different when somebody creates new skins or sprites from the scratch (without templates)..then it can be considered artwork which indeed would be protected in a certain way but coding, no way !
    Last edited by chris10; 23-08-2011 at 02:12.

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    Beltz, Mayn Shtetele Beltz bestmajor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chris
    the thing with modding is that there is no copyright cause the modder is the first who brakes the copyright law (when taking things down to the written law modding is illegal) and especially when it comes to coding and scipting nobody can claim an exlusive right to use one or another script command/code or whatever...I have written over 20.000 script lines for RS2 a Rome Total War conversion mod and I wont even bother if somebody uses part of my developed scriting code cause I have no right over it. Things become a bit different when somebody creates new skins or sprites from the scratch (without templates)..then it can be considered artwork which indeed would be protected in a certain way but coding, no way !
    thats true of course. but lets say if somebody would always take my work without permission i would stop releasing stuff after a while (and no matter what). i just think its about manners. you spot something you like and which was made by another person. well you can kindly ask for that and all is fine. if the original author isnt credited he will stop contributing and this is hurting all players.
    for me its just all about manners, actually (and 99% of modders will give you permission anyway).

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by bestmajor View Post
    ....the compendium mod from luxor. those things are basically from him.
    the dormant mots are from HSR mod and the SS is from Compendium - so you cant use it.....
    I wouldn't say "you can't use it", rather I would say "you can't use it without his permission."

    For example, TRM uses bits and pieces of many different mods, all of whose creators gave me permission to use their work, and all of whom are credited at the bottom of the first post of the TRM thread as well as at the bottom of the readme file. I have already given Chris10 my blessing to use anything from TRM in his mod, obviously as long as he gives me credit and it is for non-commercial purposes.
    For a harder 1936 campaign as Germany try my mod:
    http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/...d.php?t=473808

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    New brigade for ALL countrys:
    Heavy Field Artillery Brigade 1938 (21cm Gun) +10 softattack, defense +6, art-strike 10, -8% org, infantry only
    Heavy Field Artillery Brigade 1942 (24cm Gun) +12 softattack, defense +8, -10% org, art-dtrike 12, infantry only
    Expensive and slow (-2) but excellent fire suppot featuring high softattack values and artillery strike according to calibre.
    Takes some div org away cause of great effort to transport,pack,unpack mount and support/supply very heavy art shells
    Unit can and will be recruited by ai...especially SOV and US
    IC values are not final

    Last edited by chris10; 24-08-2011 at 00:48.

  20. #20
    Beltz, Mayn Shtetele Beltz bestmajor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris
    7. Realistic production in comparison between the majors GER,UK,US,JAP and USSR
    do you intend to add a penalty for german/SOV CV production to reflect the weaker shipyards?

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