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Power of Offer Vassalization

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Europa Universalis III 46143 EU3 - After Action Reports (AAR)
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Chronicler

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I had an epiphany yesterday. Well, I learnt something new playing EU3. And I love that there is always something new to learn. (Well, I haven't played that much, but still...or well...something something)


Anyway

So here is the scenario.

I'm England in 1455.

And I got a low diplo-monarch (like 3). But like +26 diplomatic skill from my sphere of influence.

I am also holy roman emperor with only 2 reforms left. (This is the England-game I messed up.)

So I thought I would try out offer vassalization in this game. Since I had nothing better to do.

So I started with something small, like Urbino.

Offer Royal marriage, increase relations, offer alliance.

Then Offer vassalization "very likely" yes. And new vassal.

I thought hmm. This is nice. I wonder how it works with larger states

So I did the same with Sicily and Naples (very likely). And later Portugal (likely). (At this point I kinda regretted conquering south of France instead of forcing them to release those nations early and then I could just have made them my vassals.)

But I don't know, I never knew it could be this effective. And my diplomatic skill was lower than half of what it could be. Prestige was decent. Infamy lowish.

I have read a lot of posts on the forum that people say offer vassalization never works for them. Well...try it as HRE with a large SOI....(perhaps you need the title to be hereditary.)
 
The SoI diplomacy bonuses are completely out of whack with the assumed values of the game engine. Yes, with +26 to diplomatic skill (which isn't all that difficult to get) all diplomatic proposals will work, as the probabilities are based on a highest achievable value of about 12 at the utmost (which was the extreme maximum before that addition).
That +1 per country in the SoI addition is just insane.
 
Dragnar said:
The SoI diplomacy bonuses are completely out of whack with the assumed values of the game engine. Yes, with +26 to diplomatic skill (which isn't all that difficult to get) all diplomatic proposals will work, as the probabilities are based on a highest achievable value of about 12 at the utmost (which was the extreme maximum before that addition).
That +1 per country in the SoI addition is just insane.
Click to expand...

I think they didn't take emperors prestige bonuses into account. I have gained loads of prestige...and I'm able to maintain it.

I think I could reach +20% prestige a year if I wanted it so.
 
IMHO the usefulness of vassals isnt so great compared to the other options of PU\conquest. They form more of a roadblock to my own progress unless i want a shield. Although, i used to play EU2 Austria and do nothing but diploannex the whole game... :wacko:

I think they didn't take emperors prestige bonuses into account.
Click to expand...

I think they didnt take alot of things into account....
 
Cataphract887 said:
IMHO the usefulness of vassals isnt so great compared to the other options of PU\conquest. They form more of a roadblock to my own progress unless i want a shield. Although, i used to play EU2 Austria and do nothing but diploannex the whole game... :wacko:



I think they didnt take alot of things into account....
Click to expand...

So half their income and half their supply limit? (lots of vassals to put into your sphere)

Isn't useful? And then HRE bonus on that.
 
I guess i was more concerned about the entangling effects of vassals than the benefits of them, but now that i think about it, vassals inside the HRE can easily be liquidated, and outside vassals be kept to a manageable number which could be a way to conquer for cheap BB, territory it wouldnt be easy any other way, like current allies and people you have no cheap way of attacking soon
 
Cataphract887 said:
I guess i was more concerned about the entangling effects of vassals than the benefits of them, but now that i think about it, vassals inside the HRE can easily be liquidated, and outside vassals be kept to a manageable number which could be a way to conquer for cheap BB, territory it wouldnt be easy any other way, like current allies and people you have no cheap way of attacking soon
Click to expand...

It's also about being able to conquer quickly to gain power fast. And vassals aren't bad in themselves. God way to keep infamy low. +Sometimes you don't have to do the fighting yourself.
 
I've had a similar experience with the "Offer Vassalization", but I didn't know it was because of the sphere of influence.

However I've never been able to use it on a country larger than 3 provinces. Maybe there's some kind of comparison in size because I wasn't very large either (maybe 15 or so provinces)? It went from Very likely to imposible with a 4 province country. Or maybe it's the same size/value calculation as with vassalisation offer during peace?
 
fudd_bopo said:
However I've never been able to use it on a country larger than 3 provinces. Maybe there's some kind of comparison in size because I wasn't very large either (maybe 15 or so provinces)? It went from Very likely to imposible with a 4 province country. Or maybe it's the same size/value calculation as with vassalisation offer during peace?
Click to expand...

If I don't err, you can't by game's design can't vassalize a country larger than 3 provinces by diplomacy.
 
il_loco said:
If I don't err, you can't by game's design can't vassalize a country larger than 3 provinces by diplomacy.
Click to expand...

Could that still be true? I think I had a high success rate with Brandenburg. Gotta check again. (Brandenburg was 4 provinces)
 
Chronicler said:
Could that still be true? I think I had a high success rate with Brandenburg. Gotta check again. (Brandenburg was 4 provinces)
Click to expand...

Hmm, seems about right. Naples had lost one province to Castille. And Portugal had just 3-4 left.

Don't know if more could work if I was larger and had a higher diplomatic skill though.
 
Chronicler said:
It's also about being able to conquer quickly to gain power fast. And vassals aren't bad in themselves. God way to keep infamy low. +Sometimes you don't have to do the fighting yourself.
Click to expand...

Yep, this way I don't have to deal with revolts while "expanding", and I only have to deal with the enemy's main armies while my vassals clean up.
 
This thread should really be called "Power of SoI". :)

And that is the problem, with a lot of countries in your SoI everything will be easy and everyone will like you since you also have a huge bonus to relations that comes from the diplomatic skill. Quite annoying sometimes though since you extremely often have to insult first if you want to start a war..

EDIT: I assume the bonus from SoI is moddable? And that in the next patch PI should remove/severly nerf the diplomatic bonus.
 
Castios said:
How to check your diplomacy skill level? It can be increased by influence?
Click to expand...

Hold your mouse over the diplomatic skill of your ruler and it will tell you everything about it. Most of the numbers you see in the game work that way. Just hold the mouse over it and you get a breakdown of everything. Great way of learning what does what. :)
 
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