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Thread: [MiniMod] Great Wars for Victoria 2

  1. #1
    Field Marshal Rylock's Avatar
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    [MiniMod] Total Wars for Victoria 2

    Total Wars for Victoria 2


    After no small amount of discussion in this thread regarding whether or not it would be possible to simulate the "Great War" in Victoria 2-- considering all the variables that needed to be in place for World War I which very likely would not be repeated in your average game-- I had an idea of how it might work. So the goal was to allow great powers to have late-game wars that would draw in their allies result in severe effects for a defeated country without having an overly deterministic setup-- and, after a great deal of tinkering, got it implemented.

    NOTE: Since the "Great War" system was added in AHD, this has been renamed to "Total Wars". The vanilla Great Wars still occur when any war has more than one great power on each side, and makes wargoals cheaper-- the Total War system exists on top of that. A Great War could involve this system, if the Dismantle CB is invoked, but need not.

    DOWNLOAD


    For "Heart of Darkness", v3.03: Great Wars 1.9
    For "A House Divided", beta patch 2.3: Great Wars 1.8


    Instructions for making Great War compatible with other mods are included in the text file.
    More detailed info on the Great War system can be found on the PDM Wiki.




    What It Does


    * As soon as any great power invents Mass Politics, they will have a "Great War" casus belli show up on any other great power with whom they have -150 relations or less (and who is not already disarmed). This CB will occasionally be granted by event (and, in AHD, can be constructed). If you are already at war with another country, the CB costs 0 infamy to invoke.

    * A "great war" country modifier which reduces war exhaustion so winning countries are far less likely to peace out, but still allows war exhaustion to build in the loser.

    * Once a great power is in a Great War, they will be prompted to seek out allies from those countries who are hostile to their enemy, who have cores in the enemy country or who are ideologically compatible. This creates an alliance and increases relations.

    * After the above, the country calls all its allies into the existing war. Note that if you pay attention to the event ticker, you'll occasionally see something like "The Russian Empire makes peace with ." -- that's just the hack by which the Call Ally function is available, since there's no command to call individual countries by command. Just ignore it.

    * Allies who are also greater powers will also call THEIR allies.

    * While in a great war, extra casus bellis will appear: they are 0-infamy and lower-warscore versions of Free Peoples, Take From Sphere, Release Vassal, Place in the Sun and Acquire Core. You can only use them on nations you're already at war with, and the AI will use them as well. (In AHD, there is an additional "Install Government" CB which becomes available if their capital province is occupied.)

    * When the Great War is done, if any greater or secondary power involved is disarmed (meaning a Cut Down to Size or Great War casus belli has successfully been enforced), the country's empire will be dismantled. This means non-existing countries in their borders will be released, cores returned, many of their colonies lost, etc... and they'll also experience a rise in fascist sentiment, not to mention a "national humiliation" modifier. (In AHD, countries are only disarmed if the Great War CB is enforced.)

    * Specific dismantling events have been written for the most common great powers, so Germany won't release all its German minors, England releases Ireland and its colonies but not Scotland, etc.


    What It Does Not Do


    * This is NOT a way to create World War 1 in Victoria 2. All it does is make the late wars in the game potentially far more threatening than they currently are... a true "great war" can result if there are enough nations involved in it and conditions are right, but it may simply be a war like many others. The differences are that allies will always be called (which does not happen normally) and a country can seek out and obtain allies even while they're at war (again, something that does not happen normally).

    * The "dismantling" effect of a great war only occurs if one of the countries involved ends the war disarmed. That requires a considerable defeat. In many cases the great war might simply mean a war where many wargoals are involved (since they are much less "expensive", the AI will invoke them more often). (As above, in AHD the dismantling effect only occurs if the Great War CB is enforced.)

    * While allies are sought out, there's no way to force them to join the war. It depends entirely on the AI's choice. So while there's a greater chance of getting more allies in the action, we can't actually have factions like in the actual World War. There's a chance something like that might occur, but it's in no way guaranteed.

    This isn't mean to underplay what the mod does, simply to set expectations appropriately.


    The war begins!



    Shall we call our allies?



    Peace at last!



    The Treaty of Vienna is signed!



    The results of the treaty:




    NOTE: The dates on the above screenshots don't reflect how this will work in the game-- events were fired manually for screenshot purposes. Since Mass Politics cannot be invented until after 1900, Great Wars can only begin after that point.

    WARNING: There is a bug in the non-AHD version of the game (which cannot be modded) that affects this mod. If you enforce a Great War CB or Cut Down to Size CB on a country while you're still at war (with anyone), they will pay you reparations but they WILL NOT BE DISARMED. This means the dismantling event will not fire. Just be warned.

    Any comments or suggestions for changes will be welcome. This work is included in the PDM mod.

    UPDATED with v1.9:
    • Compatibility with Heart of Darkness expansion pack, v3.01.
    • Added CB's to install Fascism & Communism, as well as install Democracy on Fascist/Communist countries, outside of a Great War

    UPDATED with v1.8:
    • Compatibility with A House Divided expansion pack, beta patch 2.3.
    • The Great War CB has been renamed to "Dismantle Nation" -- it works independently of the Great War functionality which was added in the 2.3 patch. So wars which invoke the Dismantle CB can cause Great Wars if enough nations get involved, but are not Great Wars in and of themselves. Invoking the CB will start the country into "total war" mode... which otherwise works exactly as the system does now.
    • The mod directory is now used.

    UPDATED with v1.7:
    • Compatibility with A House Divided expansion pack (1.7 will only work with the expansion), beta patch 2.21 or earlier.
    • The Great War system now only kicks in when a Great War CB is invoked.
    • Dismantling of an empire now only occurs when the Great War CB is enforced. The treaty event will always fire, regardless of whether the country is disarmed.
    • A new "Install Government" CB is available during a Great War, requiring that the enemy's capital province be occupied before it can be invoked. It may be used by democracies/hms governments on either fascist or communist countries, by fascists on non-fascist countries or by communists on non-communist countries. If enforced, it changes the target's government type as appropriate, makes the target friendly to you, sets up an alliance and will give you some diplomatic influence if they're not a GP.
    • A dismantling event specific to the Ottoman Empire has been added.
    • A fix to prevent the disbursement of colonial provinces from stalling has been added.
    • The country-specific dismantling events will now occur regardless of whether or not they are still GP's or SP's.

    UPDATED with v1.6:
    • Compatibility with the Sept 9th beta patch (1.6 will only work with the 1.4 patch).
    • Added two events that can fire after Mass Politics is invented. These events grant a Great War CB against enemy countries you are currently at peace with. Prior to getting these events, starting a war with the Great War CB costs infamy-- you are still able to apply the Great War CB to any country you are currently at war with.
    • Relation levels with a dismantled country and any other country increased. The dismantled country also has its infamy set at 24.99.
    • Uncivs are no longer released as a result of dismantling.

    UPDATED with v1.5:
    • Added the Infamy War events. Now, when a country gets too high in Infamy, it will be warned by the strongest AI great power existing to dismantle... and should the Infamy country refuse, that country will begin a Great War against it even if Great Wars have not been activated yet. Other countries will also be drawn in against the Infamy country, forming a coalition of sorts.
    • The dismantling events no longer check for whether overseas or colonies are cores.
    • Updating AoC compatibility to AoC 3.2 using the separate download, and also made Great War inherently compatible with NNM 1.6.

    UPDATED with v1.4:
    • Revamped the colonial assignation system completely. It will spam events a bit, as an event is required for each colonial state, but this way all the colonies and overseas states of a defeated power will get assigned to a victor-- and hopefully not end with borders that are too crazy.
    • Any power that has had 75% of its territories occupied for a month can end up getting the treaty event (so being disarmed may not be required).
    • Austria-specific dismantling event included.
    • Any country that's involved in a great war will be heavily restricted on declaring war for 3 years. Any country that's been dismantled will be unable to declare war at all for 10 years. This did involve larger changes to the cb_types file, which makes it more difficult to combine the mod with other mods... so I've included a version of Great War that is specifically for AoC 3.1, and instructions on making it compatible with some other popular mods. PDM, of course, does not require this.

    UPDATED with v1.3:
    • All non-allied neutral countries receive cores back, but they get theirs last after everything else is figured out.
    • Non-existing countries are only released so long as there is at least one core province which isn't colonial.
    • Colonial disbursement has been revamped, giving only states that are coastal and/or neighboring to your territories, and then possibly any neighboring states to THAT. It won't give colonies that are deeply interior, but at least it now won't give isolated land-locked states that the country can't possibly access.
    • a player victor gets "first dibs" on colonies, meaning the AI events that take colonies don't fire until after the player has made his selection (otherwise the AI events fire at the same time, and are therefore "faster" and get their provinces first).
    • The Great War CB now correctly requires -100 relations or less (not more).
    • Someone who ends a Great War not disarmed only gets "no more war" for 3 years, not 10.
    • The MTTH for the events which bring on the reduced country modifiers has been shortened.

    UPDATED with v1.2:
    • Made all colony/overseas territories dole out by state only, to prevent messy borders (particularly in Africa).
    • Colonies in Africa more likely to go to a GP only.

    UPDATED with v1.1:
    • There are now three country modifiers instead of one, with the others replacing the first with a speed variable on how well the country is doing.
    • Expanded the list of approached countries a bit more.
    • The colonial release script looks for overseas OR colonial provinces, not provinces that must be both.
    • Released countries now won't perform secondary releases on countries of the same culture group as the treaty country.
    • The "War is Upon Us" event now instructs a player how to dismantle their opponent.
    Last edited by Rylock; 12-09-2013 at 21:21.

  2. #2
    Many new events. I'm downloading the files right now. Good job.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Rylock View Post
    Any comments or suggestions for changes will be welcome. This work will likely be included in the PDM mod sometime soon.
    I just suggested to the PDM people to implent it, and then I saw this... lolFAILlol. Never mind.
    Anyway- This looks awesome! But I think all the "release poeple" and all other free CBs in a great war shouldn't be free, but heavily Infamy-reduced instead. It's not like two empires collapsed and Germany lost all its colonies in WWI... oops. But anyway, do you think the CBs should be FREE?

    And I think there is a minor problem with Czechoslovakia.
    Is there any moment in history where a country attacks another country because their allied with a country that is at war with a country that is the first countries ally?

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  4. #4
    Mind if I incorporate this (altering as necessary) into my Eternal Empires mod as an optional additions?

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by LordInsanity View Post
    Mind if I incorporate this (altering as necessary) into my Eternal Empires mod as an optional additions?
    It doesn't make a lot of sense in an alternative history.... Very specific historical reasons lead to the great war...
    Is there any moment in history where a country attacks another country because their allied with a country that is at war with a country that is the first countries ally?

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  6. #6
    Colonel Pj Fallon's Avatar
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    It doesn't make a lot of sense in an alternative history.... Very specific historical reasons lead to the great war...
    I still like it though.
    East vs. West is cancelled. Will we ever get a cold war game?

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Clendor View Post
    It doesn't make a lot of sense in an alternative history.... Very specific historical reasons lead to the great war...
    True, but I imagine that wars with very harsh conditions opposed on the losers still exist. Even in alternate timelines.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Clendor View Post
    It doesn't make a lot of sense in an alternative history.... Very specific historical reasons lead to the great war...
    THE great war was a result of reasonably specific historical reasons (I wouldn't say very specific because a conflict was inevitable).

    But he doctrine of great war is really just an expression of how industrial economies wage war - also known as 'total war'. The whole economy is geared up for war and consequently the outcomes are significantly great. Given that this period is when the great powers of the world shifted into heavily industrialised patterns then allowing for 'great wars' to be fought is entirely realistic.

  9. #9
    Modding Victoria 2 ZomgK3tchup's Avatar
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    I'm glad you took my suggestion for custom defeats for the Great Powers but if Ireland is released from the UK, then it would no longer be the UK and require a new tag - Great Britain and use a version of the Union Jack without St. Patrick's Cross.

    Also, it makes sense historically. A World War-style conflict was almost inevitable; the trigger was totally up to chance. If the Second French Empire was still in power and its heir was assassinated, then a World War would most likely occur. If the German states fell into civil war and Russia encroached on Central Europe, then no doubt Austria and France would intervene somehow.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by ZomgK3tchup View Post
    Also, it makes sense historically. A World War-style conflict was almost inevitable; the trigger was totally up to chance. If the Second French Empire was still in power and its heir was assassinated, then a World War would most likely occur. If the German states fell into civil war and Russia encroached on Central Europe, then no doubt Austria and France would intervene somehow.
    Yup, Europe has always suffered from 4 fat men in a phone booth syndrome

    The nice thing about this minimod is that it doesn't force a Great War, or produce an implausible one based on history that would seem ridiculous if the game doesn't pan out historically - if Germany doesn't form, then a direct port of WW1 makes no sense at all. But it does permit a late-game Great War between different GPs which can devolve into 4 years of mindless violence and destruction, and can shatter Empires. It's a really impressive bit of work
    For every subtle and complicated question, there is a simple and straightforward answer, which is wrong.

    Creator of PDM:PoD for Heart of Darkness: http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/...ownload-thread
    Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand Creator of '1792' for March of the Eagles: http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/...69074-1792-mod

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Naselus View Post
    Yup, Europe has always suffered from 4 fat men in a phone booth syndrome

    The nice thing about this minimod is that it doesn't force a Great War, or produce an implausible one based on history that would seem ridiculous if the game doesn't pan out historically - if Germany doesn't form, then a direct port of WW1 makes no sense at all. But it does permit a late-game Great War between different GPs which can devolve into 4 years of mindless violence and destruction, and can shatter Empires. It's a really impressive bit of work
    *pray* impletation in the PDM *pray*
    Is there any moment in history where a country attacks another country because their allied with a country that is at war with a country that is the first countries ally?

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  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Clendor View Post
    *pray* impletation in the PDM *pray*
    Dude, it was written by a member of PDM staff using PDM, and was initially started as part of PDM... Prayer doesn't come into it :P It'll be included in 4.0.2 once Rye's ready.
    For every subtle and complicated question, there is a simple and straightforward answer, which is wrong.

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  13. #13
    Field Marshal Rylock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clendor View Post
    But I think all the "release poeple" and all other free CBs in a great war shouldn't be free, but heavily Infamy-reduced instead. It's not like two empires collapsed and Germany lost all its colonies in WWI... oops. But anyway, do you think the CBs should be FREE?
    One reason those CB's are made Infamy-free is so the AI will use them-- it won't use them otherwise. All of them other than the Great War CB are only addable once the nations are at war (so as added wargoals), the idea being that there is some "justification" behind them. In an era late into the game, where things such as propaganda exist, it's not too hard to imagine formulating a justification for freeing an oppressed people.

    Or, at least, I don't have a problem imagining it-- especially in a game where half the wars started by the AI are engineered by the Border Incident event and have no Infamy attached to them anyhow.

    And I think there is a minor problem with Czechoslovakia.
    Union nations don't get released... and in this case, Czechoslovakia is a union nation so Bohemia and Slovakia get released separately.

    If your game has different cores for countries, then the borders will use those cores instead. The idea was to create a mod that simulates the Great War and its effects without requiring a deterministic setup for World War I. In your game, there might be several smaller "Great Wars"... or you may end up with alliances forming in such a way that all of Europe gets dragged in just as in history.

  14. #14
    Field Marshal Rylock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZomgK3tchup View Post
    I'm glad you took my suggestion for custom defeats for the Great Powers but if Ireland is released from the UK, then it would no longer be the UK and require a new tag - Great Britain and use a version of the Union Jack without St. Patrick's Cross.
    I'll leave that to the individual mods to do-- PDM, for instance, has an England that will appear if both Ireland and Scotland are no longer part of the UK. "Great Britain", insofar as Victoria 2 vanilla goes, is the name used for the UK when it's a democracy. I tried to engineer this mini-mod without including extra countries, to make compatibility with other mods as easy as possible.

  15. #15
    Field Marshal Rylock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LordInsanity View Post
    Mind if I incorporate this (altering as necessary) into my Eternal Empires mod as an optional additions?
    Everyone is free to use this in their own mods, if they wish, and alter it to suit. I've tried to comment the events to make them as easy to follow as possible. Credit would be nice.

  16. #16
    First class! I'll try it out today after work. Or at least tomorrow. Yesterday I watched an interview with one of the developers of "Pride of Nations" a Paradox game that seems like a mash up of Vicky II and Ageod's strategy games. In it he talks about how there will be a "crisis mechanic" that can allow great war type situations to begin, and I was thinking, it would be great if there was something like this in Vicky, or at least something more substantial.

    And then suddenly, here it is.

  17. #17
    A couple thoughts: (I'm playing Divergences games at the moment, but I'm looking forward to seeing how this works when I get back to vanilla ones)

    - Maybe the Great War cb should only be available if a GP is already involved in a war (the relations thing might already take care of that, I guess, though)? It seems to me that in both the actual WWI and the other events around it which almost triggered the whole great war thing, the war didn't start as a GP deciding they should destroy another GP. I don't think that in that political climate such an act would be done. Instead, the Great War and other wars spiraled out of control from smaller disputes.

    - It would be nice if alliance blocks could form before the wars, but I'm guessing the AI would just drop them (even if it was right before a war).
    Maybe a series of events that would pop up around that time* that would raise the relations of enemies of enemies to each other, and lower the relations between a GP and the friends of their enemy. This might form tentative alliance blocks before a great war, and also could mean the more "unholy alliance"s in the wars would be more likely to stay together. Stuff like "Support [GP]'s War" if an ally or friendly (greater than 150 or so relations) GP was at war. It would give some relations boost with that GP, but a relations drop with all GP's and SP's that had less than 0 relations with that GP. Refusing to support would lose prestige. "Secret Treaty", which would raise relations with an enemy of an enemy. "Secret Treaty Revealed" if the former event had been supported, which would drop relations with all countries friendly with the nation you formed a treaty against (or other similar effects if that's not mod-able).

    - Perhaps a couple new nations named "Mandate" (or other similar names) which would be given cores on any overseas lands of defeated GPs which couldn't be released in other ways (such as core-less swaths of Africa for when it's not with mods which have specific state cores there).

    During the war or a negotiation period after the war, nations would get events for carving out such Mandates.
    For example: If Britain and several allies are fighting Spain in a great war, and Spain has territories throughout North Africa, the Caribbean, and Oceana - regions without any independent cores (Algeria, Morocco, Cuba - those all are already accounted for).
    - Britain would get an event about Carving Up the Caribbean (there's got to be better names, but I haven't thought of them yet). It could either choose to claim a mandate there, or pass it up. If it chose to claim a mandate, cores for Caribbean Mandate would be added to all of Spain's territories in the Caribbean. Britain would get a country flag which would come into play later. We'll call it "Caribbean".
    - If it didn't choose to claim the mandate, another country would get the choice to claim that mandate. If nobody in the alliance chose the Mandate, Spain would keep the territories at the end (aside from any that would split off due to already present cores, such as Cuba, or any territories claimed by other nations with Place in the Sun).
    - The event would be somewhat random, but would favor higher ranked nations in an alliance, and would favor nations which did not already claim other mandates (so once you start claiming mandates, you diminish your chances of getting another [so Carving Up the Caribbean would check for the country flags claimed_north_african_mandate, claimed_north_oceanic_mandate, etc.).
    - Britain would also have territories in the Caribbean which could get such a Mandate. Spain could get an event to Carve Up the Caribbean - meaning the British territories in the Caribbean. Same stuff would happen.
    - If Spain won, then any Mandate cores on its territories would be removed. If Spain or any ally had claimed the Caribbean Mandate, the cores of the Mandate in Britain would be released from Britain (with the events you already have for the division of an empire, since now there would be releasable cores there). If it was Spain that had claimed it, they'd have the claimed_the_carribean_mandate flag and whatever signs of being a victor in the war, and so they would get the Mandate as a satellite (in some regions, this might show up as "[GP name] [region] Mandate", for example "British North African Mandate" due to how satellites are shown on the map [or however the Kongo region does it], which would look nice).
    - If Britain won, then any Mandate cores on its territories (and that of all of its allies, having also won the war) would be removed. If it had claimed the Caribbean Mandate, it would get the Caribbean Mandate as a satellite when it broke off from Spain.

    - There would also be events to Expand the Mandate (should a mandate already be claimed in a region, but yet another enemy also has non-releasable overseas territories in that region). A nation which claimed a Mandate would be able to use this to expand their mandate (example: if Britain claimed the Caribbean Mandate against Spain, but was also fighting the Netherlands which also had territories in that region, they could Expand the Mandate and cores would be added for all of the Dutch territories in the region).
    - There would be events to Contest the Mandate that another nation claimed. It would cost some diplomatic points or prestige or something (and probably a relations drop). It would launch an event Contested Mandate for the other nation, which could acquiesce and hand over the Mandate (i.e. the country flag claimed_caribbean_mandate would be removed from Britain and added to the contestor Portugal) or refuse (relations drop, maybe infamy - maybe a reward for acquiescing, in regards to relations increase, prestige, infamy loss).

    - There would be a handful of these mandates. Caribbean. A couple for Oceana. A couple for North Africa, a couple for West Africa, and a couple for East Africa. Maybe a couple for South Africa, but it has cores in vanilla too, right? There'd be a couple for each region so that enemy territories in that area would possibly be split between two different allies. There could be an event "Merge the Mandates" if two satellite mandates were neighboring each other (it would make one satellite inherit the other). All the special stuff for them could be copied and pasted mostly - just a few things would need to be changed for each.

    This could help break up the overseas territories of other nations, specifically in areas like Africa, even if there were not releasable nations to give them too.
    Interactive AARs:
    Mutual Assured Destruction: The Presidents 1836-1936: Former Vice President William Gallatin
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  18. #18
    Modding Victoria 2 ZomgK3tchup's Avatar
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    Is it possible to write in an event that unifies Poland and Krakow if the former is released Austria/Germany/Russia?

  19. #19
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    You could just do that through a simple event; if Poland exists & Krakow exists, Poland inherits Krakow.
    Amanda Shaw, Secretary of the Interior (b. 1890)
    in BigBadBob's The Presidents 1836-1936 an Interactive V2 AAR

    Alfonz Aljaz of the State of the South Slavs (b. 1800)
    in theAhawks's A Federation of "Equals"

    Empire's dead, the issues inherent with creating a functional mod of that timespan are just too much.

  20. #20
    Field Marshal Rylock's Avatar
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    Updated version-- link included in the original post.

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