Ad Astra! ... an Aurora Forum Game, run by blue emu

[Calantyr]

That's why I added the part about it being cool to do, even if it's stupid to.

As for fighters, I favour speed and agility over hitting power. Their niche is their speed and flexibility, not their firepower. Exploit it.

Are long range 'sniper' ships possible? For example with enough laser tech? I would favour those for taking out enemy capital ships if the mechanics support it.

[blue emu]

O Mightiest of the Emus,

What chances are there of us developing some new, larger warships now that we've been gaining so many techs?

I'm thinking we should be building some larger carriers since our fighters have proven they can be effective at engaging the Prix AND providing additional targets for Prix missiles.

We certainly have the technological, shipbuilding and financial capability to start building 20,000-ton Battle-Cruisers and 20,000-ton Fleet Carriers. What we still lack is a sound resource base. Give me another year or so to get an additional 300 mines set up on Procyon A-1 (I'm really gonna have to name that place) and then our resource situation will be more-or-less straightened out and we can start undertaking some more ambitious construction projects.

[Cromelex]

O Mightiest of the Emus,

What chances are there of us developing some new, larger warships now that we've been gaining so many techs?

I'm thinking we should be building some larger carriers since our fighters have proven they can be effective at engaging the Prix AND providing additional targets for Prix missiles.

Yes! Very big carriers... but at least two of them! (Isn't that so, fellow Carrier Commander TheLoneGunman ? )

[blue emu]

That's why I added the part about it being cool to do, even if it's stupid to.

As for fighters, I favour speed and agility over hitting power. Their niche is their speed and flexibility, not their firepower. Exploit it.

Are long range 'sniper' ships possible? For example with enough laser tech? I would favour those for taking out enemy capital ships if the mechanics support it.

Lasers are extremely short-ranged. Missiles can be fired over 100 million km, but lasers are limited to about 1.5 million km. Why? Because the game operates in five-second turns, and light can only travel 1.5 million km in five seconds. And if the game had to track a long-range laser shot across the map, turn by turn... in what way is it different from a missile?

[Polar Mongoose]

Yes! Very big carriers... but at least two of them! (Isn't that so, fellow Carrier Commander TheLoneGunman ? )

No, it isn't so. We need at least three

[CptJoker]

(I'm really gonna have to name that place)

How about Moria?

[blue emu]

Our dockyards limit us to 20,000 tons at the moment. If the Carrier carries no jump drive and only a single layer of armor, it could hold 45 Streak Fighters

Constellation class Carrier 20,000 tons 1295 Crew 3412 BP TCS 400 TH 1144 EM 450
5720 km/s Armour 1-65 Shields 15-250 Sensors 1/1/0/0 Damage Control Rating 21 PPV 6
Annual Failure Rate: 152% IFR: 2.1% Maint Capacity 2239 MSP Max Repair 66 MSP Est Time: 6.18 Years
Hangar Deck Capacity 8000 tons Magazine 422

Magneto-plasma Drive E8.4 (26) Power 88 Fuel Use 84% Signature 44 Armour 0 Exp 10%
Fuel Capacity 950,000 Litres Range 101.8 billion km (205 days at full power)
Delta R250/17.5 Shields (6) Total Fuel Cost 105 Litres per day

CIWS-200 (1x6) Range 1000 km TS: 20000 km/s ROF 5 Base 50% To Hit
Size 1 Missile Launcher (6) Missile Size 1 Rate of Fire 10
Missile PD Fire Control FC8-R1 (2) Range 8.6m km Resolution 1
Size 6e 2043 ASM (60) Speed: 30,700 km/s End: 23.3m Range: 42.9m km WH: 9 Size: 6 TH: 204 / 122 / 61
Size 1e 2043 AMM (62) Speed: 48,200 km/s End: 3.5m Range: 10.3m km WH: 1 Size: 1 TH: 305 / 183 / 91

Strike Group
45x Streak Fighter Speed: 15142 km/s Size: 3.5

Missile to hit chances are vs targets moving at 3000 km/s, 5000 km/s and 10,000 km/s

This design is classed as a Military Vessel for maintenance purposes

[Quift]

I'm wondering about the possilbity to instead of trying to terraform existing planetary bodies (which should be a futile endeavour), build new ones. Wouldn't it be easer to terraform say venus if you change it's orbit, to be further out form the sun (and in opposite of its orbit in relation to earth) smack some asteroids and comets into it to get it into the proper size, and the then throw a bunch of watery comets into it to give it water and oxygen. In the end you should end up with something that has the proper size, shape, orbital location, etc. You might even manufacture a moon for it.

If you could do this then we start having some really cool projects, such as dragging planetary bodies together from the Ooort cloud, importing oxygen from neighbouring solar systems, and generally build planets in the center of our empire. All of this while mining the gas giants for athmosphere etc.

[TheLoneGunman]

Our dockyards limit us to 20,000 tons at the moment. If the Carrier carries no jump drive and only a single layer of armor, it could hold 45 Streak Fighters

Looks awesome.

How long does it take to prep a shipyard for creating them?

[TheLoneGunman]

I'm wondering about the possilbity to instead of trying to terraform existing planetary bodies (which should be a futile endeavour), build new ones. Wouldn't it be easer to terraform say venus if you change it's orbit, to be further out form the sun (and in opposite of its orbit in relation to earth) smack some asteroids and comets into it to get it into the proper size, and the then throw a bunch of watery comets into it to give it water and oxygen. In the end you should end up with something that has the proper size, shape, orbital location, etc. You might even manufacture a moon for it.

If you could do this then we start having some really cool projects, such as dragging planetary bodies together from the Ooort cloud, importing oxygen from neighbouring solar systems, and generally build planets in the center of our empire. All of this while mining the gas giants for athmosphere etc.

I think trying to move Venus might end up throwing it a tad too close to Earth for my liking.

[GrimPagan]

As for fighters, while I like the idea of them being able to destroy fleets on their own, I suppose speed and range is what counts. Their primary role is either first strikes and ambushes, or hunting down fleeing vessels, while the fleet takes care of the prolonged battles.

Should we have an actual need for bases defending jump points or important sites, other types of fighters could be usefull for those roles, but not as long as we are being on the offense.

We could probably look at a PD fighter though, if we could fit a decent system on a fighter, as it could create an outer layer of PD defense or even an anti fighter force, should we encounter enemies with fighters.

[blue emu]

Looks awesome.

How long does it take to prep a shipyard for creating them?

It would take about 15 months to retool the dockyard, and two and a half years to build it. That does not include waiting for a free slipway, of course. We could build them three at a time. One important point is that the vessel carries no jump drive, so we would also have to build a 20,000-ton Battle Cruiser to jump it in and out of the target system. That might take somewhat longer.

The design presented above is optimized for carrying the largest possible air group... at the expense of armor, magazine space, point defense, etc. A more balanced design would have to carry fewer aircraft. As it is, the above design would rely on other vessels to paint its targets (it has no sensors), to carry ammunition for its air group (it only carries the initial strike plus reloads for one-and-a-half follow-up strikes), for point defense (although we are already building purpose-built PD vessels), and so on.

[Gwalcmai]

I'm wondering about the possilbity to instead of trying to terraform existing planetary bodies (which should be a futile endeavour), build new ones. Wouldn't it be easer to terraform say venus if you change it's orbit, to be further out form the sun (and in opposite of its orbit in relation to earth) smack some asteroids and comets into it to get it into the proper size, and the then throw a bunch of watery comets into it to give it water and oxygen. In the end you should end up with something that has the proper size, shape, orbital location, etc. You might even manufacture a moon for it.

If you could do this then we start having some really cool projects, such as dragging planetary bodies together from the Ooort cloud, importing oxygen from neighbouring solar systems, and generally build planets in the center of our empire. All of this while mining the gas giants for athmosphere etc.

Even if you could move Venus, you'd still be stuck with an atmosphere that is 100x Earth's in density.

But it would be cool to have a way of altering a planet's albedo. I found one which is the third rock from its sun, has a gravity of ~1g, an atmosphere with a density of ~1atm, composed of 77% Nitrogen, 21% Oxygen and a smidgen of Carbon Dioxide... and a surface temperature of -100C because of its albedo of 0.7.

[Quift]

I think a huge flying hangar is a bit to specialiced. Specially since 45 streakers will be left to die without a way to return home would the carrier recieve a single volley. A prix ship firing pd missiles would be enough to kill it wihtout armor.

So add some armor, some CIWS, enough ammo storage to reload the fighters at least once. No need for it to paint it's targets though, since it would rely on the fighters to provide sensors and offense.

[BwenGun]

Personally I'd say that waiting until shipyard capacity is near 30,000 tonnes would be better. Both because it will allow for a larger strike wing, but also Carriers less reliant on support ships to do their jobs.

[Edzako]

Seeing all these cool designs I am starting to regret being stuck on Command Ship. I call dibs on the next Death Star :P

[Cromelex]

How about expanding a shipyard? Might be a good option, while we're waiting for the resource situation to improve further.. and we would probably get a few new techs in the meantime.

[blue emu]

I think a huge flying hangar is a bit to specialiced. Specially since 45 streakers will be left to die without a way to return home would the carrier recieve a single volley. A prix ship firing pd missiles would be enough to kill it wihtout armor.

So add some armor, some CIWS, enough ammo storage to reload the fighters at least once. No need for it to paint it's targets though, since it would rely on the fighters to provide sensors and offense.

As long as we still have one Carrier left, we can get all of the Fighters home... by cycling the wings in-and-out of the remaining Carrier as they run short of fuel. Not that Fighters are much problem to rebuild. They don't need slipways, you build them in your factories.

The design already has one advanced CIWS turret, and six PD launchers. It has enough magazine storage to reload the strike wing one-and-a-half times, not counting the missiles that the Fighters already carry when they come on-board. The GPD Frigates will also defend it as long as it stays with the fleet.

It's a specialized ship, agreed. But I think I should let my Carrier commanders decide what sort of design they want to command.

Another point worth mentioning is that this debate is not unique to the game. Back in World War II there were two schools of thought on Carrier design. The British opted for well-protected, armored Carriers; while the Americans and Japanese opted for unarmored Carriers... basically, floating hangars. Naturally, the British designs could only carry about half the air-group that an American or Japanese Carrier could hold.

The British point of view was similar to yours. The American and Japanese point of view was that the Carriers main defense was its Air Group... by seeking out and destroying the enemy before he could wreck your Carrier, you could render the question of armor moot. American Carriers relied on the other ships in the same Task Group for much of the anti-aircraft fire to keep them safe... just as the above design relies on GPD frigates and AMM-fire from neighbouring ships.

[blue emu]

Personally I'd say that waiting until shipyard capacity is near 30,000 tonnes would be better. Both because it will allow for a larger strike wing, but also Carriers less reliant on support ships to do their jobs.

How about expanding a shipyard? Might be a good option, while we're waiting for the resource situation to improve further.. and we would probably get a few new techs in the meantime.

Expanding a shipyard also consumes minerals... thousands of them, in fact. It's an option, yes... but it's not a free option. It will cost us minerals that might have been used for another purpose.

Seeing all these cool designs I am starting to regret being stuck on Command Ship. I call dibs on the next Death Star :P

As mentioned above, if we build those puppies, we will need to build some 20,000-ton Battle-Cruisers as well. You could transfer your flag to one.

[TheLoneGunman]

I personally favor a specialized carrier that maximizes hangar space and speed (enough speed to keep up with our escorts).

Holding such a large number of fighters (that are already armed) more than makes up for the lack of in-house rearmament supplies, but a dedicated auxiliary vessel would more than make up for that (and could probably double as a PD platform directly next to the carrier if its tonnage were increased).

I think the other carrier commanders would agree.