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Well, I finished gameplay tonight, and it turns out everybody was right and I was wrong :D That may seem a bit cryptic, but it will make sense in a bit.

I've decided to create two more posts. One is a long-awaited tutorial, the second will be an end of the game style post, full of maps and ledger pages a-plenty. Since I intended this to be a TutAARial, I want to encourage any rookie players to post any questions about how I did things in this game; I'll be happy to answer!

In case you think you're missing something, I will give you the top three most exciting things that happened from the last update until the end of the game, except for one that I'm saving for the TutAARial (probably up tomorrow sometime).

1) I dishonored an alliance with China so I wouldn't have to fight the UK in 1935.
2) I declared war on Bali, with Cut Down to Size and Humiliate.
3) I built my first Guard unit, nearly fifty years after I started it.

Yeah, that's it. Aren't you glad I didn't drag this out for six or seven more boring updates? :D
 
that actually fits with my, limited, experience with V2 ... the mid-size/small powers are great to play till the 20thC rolls around. Its not uninteresting, but you become very blocked in what you can do due to the relative size of the big-boys. Its quite a good simulation (there was a reason for the growth of permanent alliances after 1900), but it does lead to a rather constricted end game (my feeling is it becomes a bit like the world of HOI3 where the smaller powers really cannot become independent actors), so yes it sounds like going for a summary is the best solution ...
 
that actually fits with my, limited, experience with V2 ... the mid-size/small powers are great to play till the 20thC rolls around. Its not uninteresting, but you become very blocked in what you can do due to the relative size of the big-boys. Its quite a good simulation (there was a reason for the growth of permanent alliances after 1900), but it does lead to a rather constricted end game (my feeling is it becomes a bit like the world of HOI3 where the smaller powers really cannot become independent actors), so yes it sounds like going for a summary is the best solution ...

The one thing I would love to see (saw it all the time in 1.2, never in 1.3) would to see the occasional GP brought down by a revolution. That would completely change the landscape of the 20th century (it certainly did IRL), and maybe give some of the smaller powers a chance. I think I could have beaten the (GP less) Ottoman Empire, and perhaps even ended with an epic war against my former brethren in Russia, but with all the alliances between GP, it really did restrict my freedom of movement.
 
The Ultimate Tutorial: Becoming (and staying a Great Power) and establishing your Sphere of Influence

It finally happened, on December 20, 1930.

tutorialgp.jpg


This tutorial is designed to give you a solid understanding of how to become a Great Power from humble origins and how to stay there. We'll talk about Spheres, too.

There are three requirements to becoming a Great Power.

1) You must be Civilized.
2) You must be one of the top eight in Total Score.
3) You must maintain your place for a certain period of time (I believe six months).

Now, there are three components to the Total Score: Military Score, Industrial Score, and Prestige. At first glance, it might look like you can just stick to one path or another and eventually become a GP. You'd be wrong, though. There are three main strategies to maximize your score, but you'd be best served choosing at least two of them to ensure your success. Time is of the essence; the earlier you become a GP, the larger your sphere will be.

Prestige-spamming

What it is: By focusing on the techs that give you the prestige inventions (Aesthetics, in Culture), you can quickly gain prestige, if you are the first to discover them.

When to use it: As early as possible. Both to get the maximum benefit and because Prestige is much less differentiated early in the game, so 20 points of prestige is much more valuable in the beginning.

Why not use it?: You gain no benefit from the techs for prestige, other than prestige, which can put you behind in the arms or industrial race. Prestige is easier to get later in the game, through a number of events or through wars. Because these opportunities pile up closer to the end of the game, there's an excellent chance that a GP slot held solely on prestige will evaporate. You might become a GP, but you'll lose it quickly.

In my first test game as Ukraine, I became a GP in 1860 by pushing this relentlessly -- I also lost it in 1870 and never got it back.

Industry

What it is: Getting as much industry as you can possibly pack in to your country. This includes techs. Industry score is based on your output and profitability, so dozens of Cement factories is not the way to go.

When to use it: An unindustrialized country is a tasty snack. You should always industrialize, if you can afford it and you have the population.

Why not use it?: You may not able to. Early in the game, goods like iron, timber, and coal are absolutely critical in developing a large industrial base, and if you don't have them, industrializing will be very, very difficult. If you aren't in State Capitalism, your Capitalists will make stupid decisions until you "prime the pump."

You need high-tech factories to really make this strategy work, so you need Literacy and the raw materials (or enough prestige so it doesn't matter). It's a mid-to-late game strategy, for the most part.

This was the first prong of my strategy in this game; I didn't initially realize how powerful it could be, until I started turning colonies into states; that gave me enough population and land to see my industry really take off.

Dreadnought-spamming

What it is: A dreadnought is 25 military score. (I originally said five; I was mistaken). Building lots of them can drive your military score up very very quickly.

When to use it: Since you can't build them until 1906, it's necessarily a late game strategy.

Why not use it?: You can't afford dreadnoughts or you're too busy fighting wars on land. You need Telephones and Fuel for this strategy, which are not readily available to all nations.

This was the second of my two pronged strategy.

The challenge for a small to middling power is that industry is, to a certain extent, predicated on size. You can only have eight factories in a state; the more states, the more factories you can have. Technology and railroads matter, but not as much as you'd think. Bigger really is better. Your only way out of this is to get bigger. Going after uncivs, vulturing states from poorly run civs, etc.

Big powers have two main advantages: the one I just mentioned and the likelihood you'll have a huge army to begin with, which will drive up your military score. Dreadnoughts can be game changers, but until dreadnoughts, armies are the big component of military score. (I think you get one point for a man o' war and five points for an ironclad; these formulas aren't entirely transparent).

If you're small and landlocked, I pity you. I really, really do. Extremely high tech industry is the only way to go here -- it would be interesting to see if somebody could pull this off with such a country.

I would prioritize score in this order:

1) Industry
2) Military
3) Prestige

Industry has the most staying power; it will keep you a GP if you become one. You can use military both for score and to take stuff from your neighbors, a viable strategy if you've got a continent without a whole lot of competition or you're huge. Prestige is pretty, but ultimately fickle.

So, you're a GP now. What difference does it make, I hear you ask?

First, certain events and decisions are GP only. One event I got huge amounts of were the "Patrimony" events, which give you cores on territory you hold. Now, I don't know entirely what purpose cores serve in Vicky 2, but I figure it's better to have them than not.

Second, the Sphere of Influence, which as we've discovered, is much better for the Sphere-r than the Sphere-ee.

Because Ukraine got to be a GP so late in the game, my Sphere doesn't end up all that big. I get Moldavia and Serbia. I almost sphered the Russian Empire (who I kicked out at #8), which would have been hilarious, but Russia eventually made itself a GP again. Too bad.

The core of the Sphere-of-Influence system is Influence. Here are the differing influence scores for two different countries:

tutorialinfluence.jpg


tutorialmoldaviainfluen.jpg


There are three major components to Diplomatic Influence. First, your base influence. I must admit some ignorance on this; I'm not entirely sure what does and does not determine your base influence. The Market Functionality Path says it increases Diplomatic influence, but I think they are talking about your base diplomatic points, not GP influence. However, you've only got so much to go around. You can choose None, Low, Medium, or High influence, which increases your base rate at the expense of being able to influence lots more countries.

Second, the geographical proximity of the country to be sphered. Neighbors get a nice bonus, but if they're on another continent or overseas, you get penalties instead. Both countries, in this case, are my neighbors.

Third, the relative position of your country's total score vs. theirs. Note that I get a nice bonus for influencing Moldavia, but a very small for influencing Russia.

Who should you influence? For starters, it's always a good idea to sphere countries that have raw materials you need. Korea is a great choice (if you don't outright conquer it, of course :D), as are China and Japan. You have to consider how easy getting a country into your sphere is, though. China is always a diplomatic hot potato -- you have to be prepared to fight for it. Look at Ukraine in this AAR; that can show you how heated competitions can be for influence.

The most influence you can have in any country is 100 points. What exactly can you do with it? Below is a detailed list of the different diplomatic functions you can exercise with influence.

Discredit

Costs 35 influence. You can decrease the rate of influence for any country for 30 days at your opinion or lower.

Expel Advisors

Costs 50 influence. Eliminate another GP's influence for this country instantly (your opinion or lower) and remove discredit.

Ban Embassy

Costs 65 influence. All the benefits of Expel Advisors, plus they cannot gain influence at all for 365 days.

Increase Opinion

Costs 50 influence. Increase target country's opinion of you, up to Friendly, one step. (Remember: Hostile -> Opposed -> Neutral -> Cordial -> Friendly)

Decrease Opinion

Costs 50 influence. Decrease target country's opinion of another GP (your opinion or lower) one step.

Add to Sphere

Costs 100 influence. Add target country to your Sphere of Influence.

Remove from Sphere

Costs 100 influence. Remove target country from another GP's SOI. You must be Friendly with the target country.

It's worth repeating the benefits of a sphere of influence. All of their goods are added to your domestic production; tariffs do not apply. You get these goods even before the sphered country does! They can still buy what you don't use.

There are a couple of miscellaneous things you should know about influence and spheres. First, unless the sphered country does something about it, you cannot remove a country from your own Sphere of Influence. Since you cannot declare war on a country in your SOI, think very seriously about who you wish to sphere. Remember, you're obligated to protect them in any wars -- you cannot dishonor a call from one of the countries in your sphere.

Second, you cannot influence a country with whom you are at truce. You can still use the influence you already have, but going to war to add a country to your sphere can be very problematic, if other countries are in a position to reduce your influence.

We have one last item on the table -- strategies for using influence.

Like in most areas of life, the best defense is a good offense. Unless you're talking about China, you'll have at best two or three opponents for any given country. I had none for Moldavia and Serbia, for example.

Right off the bat, I want to you look carefully at Discredit. 35 influence is a lot. The effect is minimal. Don't waste your time with it. The AI loves it, which is weird, but what are you going to do?

Ban Embassy is always a great option, unless there is another country within striking distance of taking a country out of your sphere besides the one you're banning. For a whole year, that country is meaningless in the race. You can even add insult to injury by Decreasing Opinion, which will, eventually, render them ignorable.

Another powerful one-two punch (if you have 100 influence) is Expel Advisors --> Decrease Opinion. Wait until the last possible second (99 influence if they're trying to take it out of your sphere, otherwise 50), and you can set them back a long time.

Now, if you are trying to get a country into your sphere, I almost never bother with offensive action. Just increase opinion when you get the appropriate icon (like the one below):

tutorialicon.jpg


If it's between you and one other country, you can get nasty, but with two or more opponents, the influence points are far too precious to waste. With luck, they'll cancel each other out, or do stupid things like wasting influence on Discrediting. With China and France both hotly pursuing Russia, I nearly put Russia into my sphere because China kept wasting influence discrediting me. If China had just ignored me, it would have had Russia in her sphere in no time.

Three final thoughts on influence. First, never, under any circumstances, stop influencing a country in your sphere. You may need to beat back challengers, and without influence points, you're in trouble. Some players prefer to sphere as much as possible; I'd rather have a stranglehold on a few countries. Second, don't be too stubborn to give up on some countries. Egypt is another hotly contested country (for the Suez Canal; once the Canal is built, people stop caring about influencing it). You could be fighting off as many as five challengers. You'll have to get very lucky to even get Friendly. Finally, at Friendly, you have the option to intervene for a particular country; a very powerful tool to keep enemies out. That applies to other countries too, so make sure you examine the diplomatic situation in a country before you pick on your favorite unciv.

One more update for this AAR -- the End Game post!
 
Sons of Kiev: End Game

First, I'll show you some maps from 1932. There were no territorial changes between now and the end of the game; the clock ran out on the UK's expansion into China.

First, Europe:

endgameeurope.jpg


Nothing too stunning here. Prussia eventually lost GP status (to Mexico, I believe) and was in the French sphere for a long time. Austria-Hungary did pretty well, but ultimately never even formed the SGF, let alone Germany. Italy never happened either. France took a nice bite out of Belgium and the Netherlands. Spain expanded a lot, but never got within sniffing distance of Great Power status ever again.

Arabia:

endgamearabia.jpg


Usually, I get the entire Arabian peninsula, but this game I focused a lot more on Asia, to my benefit, I think. Enjoy your sand, Spain! I thought about finishing off Oman, but not never got around to it. Egypt is entirely gone, divided between the Ottomans, France, Spain, and of course, me :D

Africa:

endgameafrica.jpg


It would appear France got the Congo; apart from me, the only other big Sub-Saharan player is the UK. I got boxed out of most of Africa, because I got such a late start :mad: Interesting to note, Madagascar stayed independent the entire game. (There's a French decision that gives them Madagascar).

SE Asia and the Pacific:

endgameasia.jpg


Here, it's me, the Dutch, Spain, and the UK. (Also, a little China, as you can see, which I believe they took from Portugal.) For most of the game, I was hoping for a revolution in the Netherlands, so I could take their colonies; alas, it never happened.

Korea:

endgamekorea.jpg


Russia and the UK sure did a number on China! Shocking to see Burma still independent. I should really call it Korea (featuring Ukraine) instead of Ukraine; it was way more productive than mainland Ukraine (more on that in a minute).

Our final upper house:

endgameupperhouse.jpg


At one point, the Fascists were the number three party, behind the Socialists and Conservatives. The most interesting thing to happen in politics? The Socialists won an election! :eek: It seems people really wanted the 14 hr workday; 25% of the voters had it as their number one issue. I just ignored the election, picked my own party (which increases MIL), then enacted the 14 hr workday with the liberals in power; the Socialists never so much as sniffed the Ruling Party spot again. I eventually got my HM's government, too!

A summary of the world in 1936:

endgameworld.jpg


I was number six in the world! WOO HOO!!! Given more time, I bet I would have caught up to Chile, but the top four is probably out of the question. Poor Spain -- all that land and you can't even get to the top sixteen! This is the lowest I've ever seen France; I wonder what happened? Surprising showing for Venezuela.

I hear 1.4 will force recalculations of Industrial Score; I've installed it but haven't played yet, but that should keep countries from being untouchable, I imagine.

Very proud of 76% literacy, too, given that I started at 10% and added a whole bunch of illiterates to Ukraine. I maxed out Industry, getting all thirty techs there. Army was second (15 techs), Culture had 13 techs, Navy had 10, Commerce had 6. Never got a chance to pass Women's Suffrage; very odd.

My most profitable RGOs:

endgameprovince.jpg


You know what's sad? Only three of those are actually Ukrainian; the rest is stuff I conquered/colonized.

Factories:

endgamefactory.jpg


All Ukraine and Korea here; I was one of the few countries to ever produce Barrels (I added armor to my armies but never got to use them; never had airplanes).

I finished top five in all the high tech manufactured goods (Electric Gear, Automobiles, Airplanes, Telephones). Also Coal and Tea.

Other interesting comparisons: I had the eight most provinces in the game (UK number one, no surprise there). #7? Spain. And yet, nearly worthless.

I was #11 in total army size and #8 in navy (with more than 100 dreadnoughts). One thing that will hurt this strategy in 1.4 is that colonies won't produce as many soldier POPs; this should also, however, greatly reduce the number of soldiers for the British too.

And, finally, to close out this AAR, a map of the world!

endgameworldmap.jpg

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So what's next? Well, I've still got my Tuscany AAR. I'm not sure when/if I'll start another (I don't even have a solid idea for one yet). I don't think I'd do a Tutorial for HOI 3 (way too complicated, in my book :)) but I might do an AAR at some point. I've been eagerly following the EU 3 --> Vicky 2 converter; I would be very tempted to start a new Vicky 2 AAR for my Russian Empire DW AAR. You're welcome to suggest projects, but I highly doubt I'll start another soon.

I hope you've enjoyed this AAR, and if you learned half as much as I did making it, well, you're probably an expert now :) I'll be happy to answer any and all questions; just because I didn't waste your time with boring updates doesn't mean I don't have data for the 20s and 30s.
 
I knew that Ukraine would eventually become a GP! :) Now if only France had returned the Suez Canal, which they so rudely stole.
Anyway, epic AAR. Too bad it's now over. :(
 
Wow, there's some very interesting results in that game. Interesting to see Russia ignore the usual targets, like Khiva, and take on China instead. China still made it to number 3 GP, in spite of the huge territory loss. And Chile made it to number 5! Some interesting goings on, that's for sure. Good to see you finally get to GP status, but 100 Dreadnoughts will certainly help there. lol Anyway, good stuff, I enjoyed reading it.
 
I knew that Ukraine would eventually become a GP! :) Now if only France had returned the Suez Canal, which they so rudely stole.
Anyway, epic AAR. Too bad it's now over. :(

Wow, there's some very interesting results in that game. Interesting to see Russia ignore the usual targets, like Khiva, and take on China instead. China still made it to number 3 GP, in spite of the huge territory loss. And Chile made it to number 5! Some interesting goings on, that's for sure. Good to see you finally get to GP status, but 100 Dreadnoughts will certainly help there. lol Anyway, good stuff, I enjoyed reading it.

Thanks for the kind words, both of you. Honestly, without the Dreadnoughts, I highly doubt I ever would have sniffed GP status. I was mildly surprised with Chile too, but if I'm reading the map right, they did some major damage in South America.
 
thanks for both a well written and highly informative AAR, its done a great job in making V2 seem much less daunting. In Europe it looked like Spain was generally the big winner and Prussia the main loser, but otherwise a pretty plausible end world.

I have no earthly idea why Spain didn't industrialize or build a larger army; it ended up costing them.

good job! GP status ws gained in the late geme and kept :d
high tech industry can be really profitable :)

It wasn't until I started cranking out dreadnoughts that I began to believe it might be possible; I'd also been lacking in railroads, which I really need to remember to focus on next time around.
 
In your earlier screenshot showing the global powers it's interesting to see how Chile and Mexico are global powers despite having practically nowhere near your prestige level (16 & 82 compared to your 555) and only around half your military score (215 & 359 to your 592). It's because their industrial scores are more than 1000 higher than yours, which covers those gaps. So it shows that to be the global power requires as high an industrial score as you can get and the other stats aren't as important, except where your industrial score can't keep or catch up. Hence why you needed the dreadnaughts to get that military boost to your score, to make up for the industrial shortfall.

I guess that just reinforces your earlier point of prioritising Industry first, then Military then Prestige in that order. Especially since the only way to get the late game Military boost that you got (592 up to 2481) that came from your dreadnaughts would be to have the industrial means to produce and support them! All interesting stuff and a really helpful 'tutorial'. Beats reading manuals any day!. Thanks.
 
In your earlier screenshot showing the global powers it's interesting to see how Chile and Mexico are global powers despite having practically nowhere near your prestige level (16 & 82 compared to your 555) and only around half your military score (215 & 359 to your 592). It's because their industrial scores are more than 1000 higher than yours, which covers those gaps. So it shows that to be the global power requires as high an industrial score as you can get and the other stats aren't as important, except where your industrial score can't keep or catch up. Hence why you needed the dreadnaughts to get that military boost to your score, to make up for the industrial shortfall.

I guess that just reinforces your earlier point of prioritising Industry first, then Military then Prestige in that order. Especially since the only way to get the late game Military boost that you got (592 up to 2481) that came from your dreadnaughts would be to have the industrial means to produce and support them! All interesting stuff and a really helpful 'tutorial'. Beats reading manuals any day!. Thanks.

Welcome to the forums; honored you chose this AAR for your first post!

You're absolutely right. Now, 1.4 (which is in beta as we speak, you can get it from the Tech Support Forums) is supposed to radically change the Industrial Score calculations, so they'll be overall lower. I'm interested to see how that changes my strategy in the future. But yeah, Industrialization is always the way to go.
 
Well, I finished gameplay tonight, and it turns out everybody was right and I was wrong :D That may seem a bit cryptic, but it will make sense in a bit.

What did that mean?
 
What did that mean?

Reference to earlier discussion if I would ever be a Great Power; lots of people on the thread thought I would, but I thought it would never happen.
 
Yeah, great AAR! TBH I don't have Victoria 2 and, while pondering whether to buy it or not, I decided to have a look at this part of the forum. In the end, I just enjoyed reading this AAR which was very instructive and well written. Of course I can't say I read or understood 100% of it, but was very interesting nonetheless.