Quick questions / Quick answers -- EU3

DDRJake · Oct 15, 2012

Xenophon13 said:
Ok, thanks. Weird thing though, It seems there is a HRE province on the new world- it belongs to some Italian state. Any clue as to how they did it?

It's not an HRE province, it's just owned by an elector or the empror. Go onto the HRE mapmode and hover over the province, it will not say "this province is a part of the HRE" or such. Compate that to, say, Ulm or Bern where it will say they are (unless they've been removed, I'm sure you see what I'm saying) It's possible to get every single mainland Euro-Asian-African province in the HRE but every single island and the other continents (except cosica) can never ever become HRE provinces without modding.

Birdjaguar · Oct 15, 2012

I'm playing Chronicles. How do I sell a province? i can't find it under diplo or under the specific province.

cywang86 · Oct 15, 2012

It should be the bottom most diplomatic option, just below Loan Offer and War Subsides. Note that it can only be used when neither of you are at war. (wtb selling multiple provinces option btw)

fanoI · Oct 15, 2012

How to know who is the "Revolutionary Target"?

I'm losing -5 prestige for this and in the triggers it says there's a Revolutionary Government in Europe and I don't want to combat it...

Well where's? If I know where's I would be happy to defeat it... no revolutions bordering the Empire!

Excluding myself (the Holy Roman Empire) in Europa there are this states (and for not so much time in the end only HRE and Papacy should reain):

The Papal States (formerly Archiboship of Mainz)
Duky of Foix
Lordship of Hansa
Lordship of Granada

All are HRE's vassals obviously...

The only revolution in Europa was in Austria (it becomes a Revolutionary Republic), but it was peacefully annexed by HRE with the last decision...

Revolutionary Republics are only in America (Chile and Mexico), I've to delete them for the map to not have anymore this modifier?

unmerged(448326) · Oct 15, 2012

Birdjaguar said:
I'm playing Chronicles. How do I sell a province? i can't find it under diplo or under the specific province.

First, click on the territory of the nation you want to sell the province to. Then, in the menu with the diplomatic options (near the lower left portion of the UI), it's at the very bottom of it (there's a little arrow, you need to scroll down).

--

I have two noob questions of my own:

1) The national idea "Merchant adventures" gives -25% merchant cost. Does this mean the number of ducats you pay to send the merchant to a centre of trade, or the cost of generating the actual merchant?

2) With regards to domestic policy sliders. What's the difference between "Technology Cost" (from Innovative) and "Tech Cost Modifier" (from Free Subjects)? I don't understand the distinction.

Thanks in advance.

vasziljevics · Oct 15, 2012

ars moriendi said:
1) The national idea "Merchant adventures" gives -25% merchant cost. Does this mean the number of ducats you pay to send the merchant to a centre of trade, or the cost of generating the actual merchant?

2) With regards to domestic policy sliders. What's the difference between "Technology Cost" (from Innovative) and "Tech Cost Modifier" (from Free Subjects)? I don't understand the distinction.

Thanks in advance.

1. the former.
2. there's no difference at all. it's just a... well... different interpretation of the same thing

Asilith · Oct 15, 2012

Is there a way to get a religious world map in stead of a diplomatic one?

brifbates · Oct 15, 2012

cywang86 said:
If you're bent on moving your capital away, you have 2 options.
Become the emperor and form the HRE through the last reform, or leave the HRE by spending a magistrate and pass the provincial decision "Leave the HRE" on your capital, which requires negative opinion on the current emperor, and a magistrate per HRE province you still have to avoid the unlawful territory province modifier.

This is incorrect. As part of the "Leave the HRE" process you immediately relinquish all unlawfully held provinces. Also, the button is on the HRE screen, it is not a provincial decision.

unmerged(200028) · Oct 15, 2012

Asilith said:
Is there a way to get a religious world map in stead of a diplomatic one?

Yes, there is, among several other map-types, especially if you have installed Divine Wind. All you have to do is go to the mini-map on the bottom-right corner of the screen, and there will be a row, (or rows), of icons on top. Click on the one with a cross on it, and the map will change to the religious map.

--

I'm not sure that I understand how leaders affect combat. On the EU3 Wiki, I read that a leader's shock or fire values directly modifies those respective values for the units that he commands. Yet, sometimes there is also a shock or fire value appearing next to the dice roll, which is is added into the combined roll.

For clarity, (which I apologize because I am lacking), I will use an example. Let's assume that I have a general who has a shock value of 5, and a fire value of 2, all else 0. In battle, during the shock phase, the number of shock added to the dice roll is not consistent; however it is always a number between 0 and 5. This would apply to the fire phase with a number between 0 and 2, obviously.

Now, according the the wiki, the leader's shock or fire values apply to the individual units, and it doesn't say anything about the combined roll. Yet, it seems as if the leader does both.

My babbling aside, I have a few questions:

I. How exactly does a leader's shock or fire value affect combat.
-a. Does the leader do both of the above, (affecting individual units and the combined roll)?
-b. Assuming that he does, is the value added to the combined roll a random number between the leader's respective value and zero?

I apologize for my long and vague question. All help is thanked in advance.

Threshold · Oct 15, 2012

@Doppelsoldner

It's not random, the reason it's a value between 0 and max (or in some cases a negative modifier-that is, a positive modifier on the other side) is because the actual shock/fire modifier used is equal to your general's shock/fire stat minus the enemy general's shock/fire stat-so if your shock 5 general is commanding an army in combat against an enemy with a shock 3 general, the resulting value is 2. I'm not clear on the other half of your question-my understanding is the shock/fire modifiers are added to the dice roll.

unmerged(540854) · Oct 15, 2012

Doppelsoldner said:
I. How exactly does a leader's shock or fire value affect combat.
-a. Does the leader do both of the above, (affecting individual units and the combined roll)?
-b. Assuming that he does, is the value added to the combined roll a random number between the leader's respective value and zero?

I apologize for my long and vague question. All help is thanked in advance.

Can only answer B for you, as I understood it the schock or fire value is always added directly on top of the dice roll. This is why the number you see is the same for each round of the same battle, but different when fighting different generals: the number you see is the value of your general minus the value of the opposing general or vice versa. This is why shock 6 or 5 generals are such powerhouses in the early game, best lured into a defensive engagement in the mountains or behind a river in the forest. (if you get the lucky terrain).

I have some more questions aswell.

On troops:
- Do the text descriptions with units matter? Aka is the indian hill fighter cavalry really good in hills or should I just look at the shock values. If so, then why are latin knights bad compared to muslim cavalry in the early game?

- You need 4k cavalry in an army to perform surrounds or defend against it correct? But what happens if you take casulties during battle or if you start with 4 under strength regiments in a battle?

- I heard something about modified fire values in the early game making the fire stat useless up into the early 1600? Coulds someone elaborate?

On the HRE:
- Playing HttT does the unlawfull territory exist? Gess not because as Norway I control an uncored HRE empire province next to cored Estland. Is there any downside to leaving these provinces in the empire, or should I spends to magistrate to release my uncored and my cored province?

Threshold · Oct 15, 2012

Gruzmog said:
I have some more questions aswell.

On troops:
- Do the text descriptions with units matter? Aka is the indian hill fighter cavalry really good in hills or should I just look at the shock values. If so, then why are latin knights bad compared to muslim cavalry in the early game?

- You need 4k cavalry in an army to perform surrounds or defend against it correct? But what happens if you take casulties during battle or if you start with 4 under strength regiments in a battle?

- I heard something about modified fire values in the early game making the fire stat useless up into the early 1600? Coulds someone elaborate?

Text descriptions do not matter in the slightest; they're merely flavor, and can be found in the relevant .csv files. Unit names don't even matter, actually, for combat purposes-just their stats.

For In Nomine, they have the same stats, but the Ottoman and Muslim tech groups got an upgrade to their cavalry for HttT; see here.

I believe you need 4 units of cavalry to flank, yes-two on each side. Having under full strength regiments means less damage/morale damage is done by those units, but I believe it's only the positioning that matters-you should still get the bonus even if your 4 cav regiments are at 100 troops each. Someone will correct me if I'm wrong.

There are some among us who prefer to have 6 or 8 cav units per combat, so that when some of those are forced to retreat (no morale), we still retain the ability to flank.

Look in your /technologies/land.txt. The fire modifier is near 0 up until around tech 18 (1530) where artillery starts getting decent fire modifiers, and infantry grows much slower, not seeing its true potential until closer to tech 22 (1565) or even as late as tech 27 (1625). This means that early game, say while your fire modifier is 0.05, for instance at tech level 8 where your shock modifier is 0.5 (infantry, cav has no fire modifier yet), you'll be doing 10x the damage in the shock phase as you do in the fire phase, assuming equal die rolls. The numbers are a little different for IN, which I have-infantry starts having good fire modifiers around the same time as artillery, rather than much later-but the bottom line is the same: Fire generals and fire stat units are useless early game because you do so little damage/morale from technology in the fire phase.

You can see this if you load up an early game start (1399, 1453, somewhere in there) and watch the fire phase of a battle on speed 1 or 2-little to no casualties will be taken, and minimal morale damage will be done.

StephenT · Oct 15, 2012

Gruzmog said:
- You need 4k cavalry in an army to perform surrounds or defend against it correct? But what happens if you take casulties during battle or if you start with 4 under strength regiments in a battle?

It doesn't really work like that. There's no "flanking bonus" as such. it's just that cavalry units have a special extra ability (attacking diagonally) that infantry doesn't have.

When the battle starts, the computer matches up each of your units with an enemy regiment. Any units left over go to the second rank and don't take part in the first round of combat. However, a cavalry unit can also attack the unit diagonally to its left or right, instead of the one in front of it. That means that if the larger army has cavalry, two of its cavalry units will be put on the flanks and get 'free' attacks against the outermost enemy units. In effect, the enemy will be attacking your unit straight in front, while you'll be attacking them with two units - one in front and one to the flank - and they'll take double losses.

6 -4 without cavalry: Only 4 of the units in the larger side get to attack.

Code:

. . I I I I . .
    ^ ^ ^ ^ 
  I I I I I I

6- 4 with cavalry: All 6 of the units in the larger side get to attack, because two of them are cavalry.

Code:

. . I I I I . .
  ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^
  C I I I I C

So it's actually two, not four cavalry units that get to flank - I think people talk about using four units to give some margin to absorb losses and still flank the enemy. But note that this flanking advantage only ever matters for the larger army, and means that two extra units get to participate in each round of battle.

On the HRE:
- Playing HttT does the unlawfull territory exist? Gess not because as Norway I control an uncored HRE empire province next to cored Estland. Is there any downside to leaving these provinces in the empire, or should I spends to magistrate to release my uncored and my cored province?

I believe that Unlawful Imperial Territory was meant to exist in HttT as well, but the event was bugged and didn't actually fire. They fixed the bug in a patch that came out about the same time DW did, and so people assumed it was a new feature.

grommile · Oct 15, 2012

Threshold said:
I'm not sure how exactly to do that in DW (Chronicles), though, as my understanding is it's no longer a provincial decision, and you may have to leave the HRE with your entire country in order to accomplish what you're after.

Yes. Members of the HRE can only remove territory from the Empire by leaving the Empire entirely; in the process, they sacrifice all imperial provinces on which they do not have core.

Non-members can remove provinces from the Empire by province decision as long as they have sufficiently bad relations with the current Emperor.

unmerged(540854) · Oct 15, 2012

Thanks for clearing up the combat

StephenT said:
I believe that Unlawful Imperial Territory was meant to exist in HttT as well, but the event was bugged and didn't actually fire. They fixed the bug in a patch that came out about the same time DW did, and so people assumed it was a new feature.

grommile said:
Yes. Members of the HRE can only remove territory from the Empire by leaving the Empire entirely; in the process, they sacrifice all imperial provinces on which they do not have core.

Non-members can remove provinces from the Empire by province decision as long as they have sufficiently bad relations with the current Emperor.

Does not seem like it was fixed for HttT as I don't have the event. Playing the steam version (4.1b) I assume its the most recent. Is there any point in extracting the provinces from the empire as a non member?

Asilith · Oct 15, 2012

Doppelsoldner said:
Yes, there is, among several other map-types, especially if you have installed Divine Wind. All you have to do is go to the mini-map on the bottom-right corner of the screen, and there will be a row, (or rows), of icons on top. Click on the one with a cross on it, and the map will change to the religious map.

Thanks, but I meant for the map save option (F12) ^_^
As far as I know this is always a diplomatic one, and I'd like to see a religious one if that's possible.

H3mmod1990 · Oct 15, 2012

guys, im trying to play with my friend online, but we both have different versions of checksum i think ( the four letters on the bottom left of the screen)
we resigned million times, but we don't seem to have one checksum in the same time :/
what to do ?

cacra · Oct 15, 2012

H3mmod1990 said:
guys, im trying to play with my friend online, but we both have different versions of checksum i think ( the four letters on the bottom left of the screen)
we resigned million times, but we don't seem to have one checksum in the same time :/
what to do ?

What checksums do you have?

H3mmod1990 · Oct 15, 2012

i have the *JLT he has the *ILT, we both have 5.1 patch

jdrou · Oct 15, 2012

costevie said:
anyone wanna help me register my game via crappy ol' deliver2mac so i can access DW5.2?

or, barring that, fill me in as to the changes in 5.2 so i can just dream until EU4 comes out?

If you have the MacOS version of the game you can't use the beta patch. Or does deliver2mac sell Windows versions as well?

Gruzmog said:
Does not seem like it was fixed for HttT as I don't have the event. Playing the steam version (4.1b) I assume its the most recent. Is there any point in extracting the provinces from the empire as a non member?

The event has actually existed since v1.0 but was broken (so it never fired) until DW. It is also fixed in my final fixpack for HttT, not in any official patch. Note that my fix was only equivalent to the version in DW 5.0 which received a lot of complaints and was heavily modified & expanded for 5.1 and is tweaked further in 5.2.

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