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Thread: Gloria di Firenze - A MMU submod AAR

  1. #21
    Field Marshal blsteen's Avatar
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    Superb, I'll be interested to see what happens in Italy
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  2. #22
    Colonel Sqwerlpunk's Avatar
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    Following. Love Magna Mundi AARs, and love the theme you've put together with your mod and such.

  3. #23
    Duca di Firenze CJL78's Avatar
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    ^Thanks for following.

    ******EDIT: Nevermind, problem solved
    Last edited by CJL78; 14-10-2010 at 19:50.

  4. #24
    General gabor's Avatar
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    These are interesting developments. So you sort of took both recommended NIs: engineer corps and cabinet! Smart. PoA seems such a waste in MMU.

    Romagna is rich and has a university, but I'm sure there's an event with the Pope asking you to give the province back. Don't remember the effects though. Luckily, the province is outside HRE, so no dealing with angry Emperor. I'm curious how long it'll take you to core this prov.

    As for countries starting with -in your mini-mod- mutually exclusive religious/tolerant NIs, I don't mind it really as long as they can keep the NIs without any bad consequences. Bohemia for example had a very specific situation, with compacta and the Hussites and Catholics reaching uneasy compromise. Historically, the Bohemian lands got inherited by the Habsburgs, who had different NIs.

  5. #25
    Duca di Firenze CJL78's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gabor View Post
    These are interesting developments. So you sort of took both recommended NIs: engineer corps and cabinet! Smart. PoA seems such a waste in MMU.
    Indeed, I just played a game as Burgundy, and while PoA was one factor in my keeping at 100 prestige almost constantly after becoming HRE, I didn't feel like it helped much, and wanted to play a game without it now. Plus, Florence is small, rich, homogenous, and with no real opportunities to start a war for a while, until somebody else declares and sets off all those guarantees.... so if I was going to renege the past, well, that was the perfect opportunity. Even with the events, I got back up to +3 stab in less than 5 years and never went below +2 after that.

    Romagna is rich and has a university, but I'm sure there's an event with the Pope asking you to give the province back. Don't remember the effects though. Luckily, the province is outside HRE, so no dealing with angry Emperor. I'm curious how long it'll take you to core this prov.
    Yes, the event (or rather the choice not to give it back) gives 1 infamy, -1 stab, and I think -10 prestige. By now (1482, 16 years) it's fired 3 times, but my godly Medici rulers burn off 1 infamy like its nothing and, as mentioned above, stability is not a problem.

    As for countries starting with -in your mini-mod- mutually exclusive religious/tolerant NIs, I don't mind it really as long as they can keep the NIs without any bad consequences. Bohemia for example had a very specific situation, with compacta and the Hussites and Catholics reaching uneasy compromise. Historically, the Bohemian lands got inherited by the Habsburgs, who had different NIs.
    This was my thought when this was mentioned. For Bohemia, it almost seems appropriate to have an exception. And, like I mentioned, the only real effect is that Ecumenism will pretty much cancel out DS's missionary bonuses, leaving two NIs that give alot of stab bonus, papal influence, and heretic tolerance.
    Other than that, I know Morocco has DS and HT; I don't know much (read: nothing) about Moroccan history in this period, other than the obvious of it being a Berber pirate state, so I'm not sure of the justification for HT there. There may be some other countries that I don't know about.

    Thanks for your thoughtful and interesting posts.

    Another update should be coming soon, bringing the sad news of the death of our leader, Cosimo. But, never fear, it seems the Medicis are not done in Florence...
    Last edited by CJL78; 14-10-2010 at 22:00.

  6. #26
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    Chapter II - The Death of the Father


    "The chief foundations of all states... are good laws and good arms; and as there cannot be good laws where the state is not well armed, it follows that where they are well armed they have good laws."
    -Machiavelli


    Pater Patriae
    In his very last years, Cosimo further influenced the University of Florence, supporting the thinkers of the Renaissance much to the further dismay of the Pope in Rome. He further improved Florence's military and its administration over Romagna, which saw some resistance to Florentine rule. Commercial influence strenghtened even further under his rule, as Florentine merchants took over large parts of markets all over the Mediterranean, including Genoa, Oran, Alexandria, Venice, Kaffa, and Constantinople. To ensure Florence's lasting legacy in trade, he appointed his younger son, Evangelista de Medici, as head of the merchant's guild [Trader advisor]. As one of his final acts, Cosimo oversaw substantial land reform in and around Florence itself.

    After a long life spent bringing Florence to greatness, "Pater Patriae" died peacefully in his sleep on August 30, 1478.


    Giancarlo Tempesta
    His son, Giancarlo Tempesta de Medici, soon took over the reigns as ruler of Florence.



    Some families in Florence resented the Medicis control of the city, and soon after Cosimo's death, a riot-turned-revolt took control of Florence. Giancarlo quickly fled to Bologna, and taking control of the army, returned to Florence to put down the rebellion. The leaders, the Pazzi brothers, were publicly executed as an example. Giancarlo was no slouch, and it was obvious he fully intended to cement Medici rule over Florence.

    Giancarlo continued his father's friendships with the Sforzas of Milan, and the Habsburgs of Vienna. The Republic's standing in the Empire continued to improve. As a show of support for the city's new leader, the Reichstag returned to Florence once again in 1480.

    The Medicis planned to extend Florence's control further, and in 1482, Giancarlo implemented a plan to further reform the Republic's military. He wanted to introduce a new system of recruitment and training for the army, but he also desired to begin building a fleet of signifcance to protect and extend Florence's overseas interests. However, despite the city's wealth, he could only afford to do one...



    *Florence needs another military idea, and Military Drill is perfect. Regimental System could prelude getting Elite Regiments at tech 30. On the other hand, a naval idea will help with piracy and furthermore, Urbino and Siena are heavily defended by guarantees and strong allies, while Aragon is collapsing at the hands of Castile, leaving Sardinia or even Sicily as enticing targets for would-be conquerors. Bureaucracy and Bill of Rights are definite musts, but they won't be needed til later; my Admin Efficiency is very high already.
    Last edited by CJL78; 16-10-2010 at 13:57.

  7. #27
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    Chapter III - "il Magnifico"


    "If you only notice human proceedings, you may observe that all who attain great power and riches, make use of either force or fraud; and what they have acquired either by deceit or violence, in order to conceal the disgraceful methods of attainment, they endeavor to sanctify with the false title of honest gains."
    -Machiavelli


    Giancarlo's Reforms
    Throughout the 1480s, Giancarlo Tempesta reformed finance and industry in Florence, introducing standardized weights and units of measurement. He also greatly expanded the road network throughout the Republic, most importantly building the "La Strada per l'Adriatico", a wide, flat highway with regularly posted guards, going from Pisa, through Florence and Bologna, to Ravenna.

    In Italian politics, Giancarlo severed Florence's alliances with Luigi d'Este, Duke of Modena and Count of Ferrara. Instead, he complemented the economic alliance with Genoa by signing an a military one as well. In 1489, Giancarlo finally achieved international recognition of his father's conquests: the Holy Roman Empire officially recognized Florence's rights to Romagna and placed the province under Imperial jurisdiction.



    Most importantly, he developed Florence's first semi-professional citizen army, instituting yearly mandatory military instruction for all able-bodied men between the ages of 15 and 35. By 1492 the Republic's army, when called into service, was only the fifth largest in Italy, but it was the most advanced and well-trained.




    The Nine Years' War for Urbino
    Giancarlo's army reforms proved critical, when in 1492 the King of Naples declared war on the Duchy of Urbino, starting the Nine Years' War for Urbino.

    The Nine Years' War for Urbino were 3 seperate conflicts, each starting almost as soon as the previous one had begun, by different Italian states invading the Duchy of Urbino.

    By the end of the War, the Republic of Florence emerged as the predominant Italian rival of Venice for power and influence in Italy.

    Naples Invades Urbino
    King Francesco of Naples was deeply insulted by the Montefeltro Duke of Urbino when he refused to marry the King's daughter. Francesco had had his eye on the Duchy for quite some time, and used the incident as a flimsy excuse to start a war.

    Giancarlo, like his father before him, organized a League for the defense of Urbino, including the Dukes of Milan and Savoy, the Republics of Genoa and Venice, and Pope Iulius II.



    Hearing reports of Florentine, Mlianese, and Venetian armies heading to defend the city of Urbino, the King turned south and defeated the Papal army. His 18,000 men then laid siege to Rome as the Genoese and Venetian fleets defeated the main Neapolitan fleet in the Straits of Messina.

    Venice and Urbino refused to aid the Pope, and it was decided for the combined force to march into northern Naples and besiege L'Aquila.

    After 111 days, the city's garrison fell and upon hearing the news, the other towns of the province of Abruzzi surrendered to the forces of the League.

    Giancarlo and the Duke of Milan then marched on Naples itself, forcing King Francesco to call off the siege of Rome. The two armies met outside the walls of Naples and fought for three days. On the fourth day, the reinforced Papal army approached the King from the rear. Suffering huge numbers of casualties, the King surrendered. As part of the terms of peace, the province of Abruzzi remained occupied by the Republic of Florence, to provide "a safe buffer" for the Duke of Urbino.

    The Fall of Rome
    Pope Iulius II declared the terms of the peace treaty "blasphemous" and accused Giancarlo of "bloody conquest, falsely disguised as defense". Calling on all good Catholics to Crusade against Urbino and Florence, the Papal army crossed the peninsula into the duchy in December of 1492.

    The Pope's allies abandoned him, decrying the mad aggression of 'His Holiness'. Giancarlo held the rest of the League together.



    The Pope's army was crushed and he fled back to Rome. Florentine and Venetian forces marched on the city and laid siege to it for over 3 years.

    The Pope secluded himself in the Vatican and refused to see reason. When the walls of Rome finally fell, the Pope's forces refused to surrender and fought to death, led by the Pope himself. The war-weary soldiers overran the city, slaughtering the city's garrison, Iulius II included.

    With the death of the Pope, Giancarlo's troops occupied the city and the surrounding Papal lands. Declaring the Papacy to be "banned from Italy", he paid for the Curia to board a ship bound for France and Avignon.

    Duke Giancarlo il Magnifico
    A year later, the Duke of Urbino died in a hunting accident. His nephew ascended the throne, but was opposed by Giancarlo. Giancarlo claimed the old Duke had bequeathed the throne to him, in gratitude for saving the Duchy from the clutches of Kings and Popes.

    Giancarlo managed to produce several documents, appearing to have been written by the Duke in the previous year, detailing his intent to grant his lands and title to Giancarlo. Historians have since proved most of these documents to be fake.

    Nevertheless, the forgeries were convincing enough that Giancarlo's allies upheld his claims, and demanded the new Duke abdicate in favor of the Medici. The Duke refused, and in the spring of 1499, Giancarlo led his army into the Duchy, intent on claiming his "inheritance".



    The Duke of Savoy came to Urbino's defense. The Doge of Venice declared Giancarlo a 'tyrant and monster of the worst kind', but the Most Serene Republic was too busy fighting the Turks to become involved.

    Urbino was no match for the growing Republic's forces and their leader. Urbino fell early in 1500, and Giancarlo proclaimed himself Duke.

    Torino and Nice fell to Milan in 1501, and Savoy was forced to recognize Giancarlo as Duke of Urbino.

    From then on, Giancarlo Tempesta de Medici was known as "Giancarlo il Magnifico". Giancarlo now controlled the Republic of Florence which occupied Rome and much of central Italy, and personally ruled Urbino as a Duke.


    Florence and the Italian states, 1501
    Last edited by CJL78; 18-10-2010 at 00:50.

  8. #28
    Artificer Urza's Avatar
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    Nice progress. The writing is also good.

    Going for Southern Italy seems the most obvious thing to do now. Sicily is quite rich, after all, and the North all belongs to the HRE (apart from some Venetian provinces). Vassalizing Naples and/or Sicily is also an option.

  9. #29
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    Very Interesting!

    Can you explain in detail what you are doing to curb conversion in your mod?
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  10. #30
    Duca di Firenze CJL78's Avatar
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    TOLERANCE UPDATE 1501



    Well it's 1501 and here's what the Western world looks like:


    What do you say we take a look at Lithuania and the Ottoman Empire, and see how they're doing?



    Lithuania's managed to convert a few provinces, but the ones they did still have "Large Tolerated Orthox Minority"

    The Ottoman Empire hasn't converted ANYTHING... in fact none of their Orthodox provinces have anything bigger than a "Small Sunni Community".

    Interesting. I'm not sure if it's weakened or unbalanced the countries yet, the Ottomans seem to be taking their cores and advancing through the Balkans, though slowly. Another modification I've been thinking of and I plan to do for my next game will be to keep the Mamluks in tribal gov somehow. They have already gotten to Oligarchic Monarchy. I think the OE having a Horde CB on Mamluks will help their expansion southward.
    Poland/Lithuania have managed to stay out of wars so far, not sure what will happen when Muscowy/Russia eventually comes for its cores.

    We'll keep updated on further developments, checking in again sometime around 1530 to see how the Reformation treats Bohemia and Lithuania.

    Quote Originally Posted by ubik View Post
    Very Interesting!

    Can you explain in detail what you are doing to curb conversion in your mod?
    Certainly. Click here.
    Last edited by CJL78; 17-10-2010 at 06:10.

  11. #31
    General gabor's Avatar
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    How interesting! Your modifications seem to work! (Greek islands are Catholic though. I don't think Venice should pursue a 'convert them' policy.)

    Also, it seems you made the right choice about your NI. I'd have probably taken Bureacracy - one of few imo all-round ever good NIs, the sooner taken, the more profitable. Naval NIs will be needed sooner or later, when you grow bigger, the piracy gets fiercer and if you plan, not even grab the islands (there are some exploitish methods here) but hold onto them, you'll need naval NIs badly. As for Regimental System, I find it mediocre; yes Elite Regiments is great, but by tech 30 you might be powerful enough so as not to need it, and there are so many other useful NIs!

    Expanding south will pbly be easier than going against Venice or HRE-Italy. When you become monarchy, you might claim a throne or two too.

    Rome might be even a bigger problem than Romagna. I remeber some stab hits from my Venice game. But I also, vaguely, remember you can 'relocate Papacy' and there's also some sort of 'Vatican' decision, although the Pope can refuse.

  12. #32
    -{Kaiserreich Team]- Davisx3m's Avatar
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    Italy ftw!!!
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  13. #33
    How did you make the name of the countries appear in MMU?

  14. #34
    Duca di Firenze CJL78's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Urza View Post
    Nice progress. The writing is also good.

    Going for Southern Italy seems the most obvious thing to do now. Sicily is quite rich, after all, and the North all belongs to the HRE (apart from some Venetian provinces). Vassalizing Naples and/or Sicily is also an option.
    Thanks.

    I wouldn't have taken Abruzzi already if I had known I would have a chance to take Rome and the claim on Ancona would go through. I would gladly take Napoli, but Calabria and Apulia are too poor and would drag my tech down until I have grown and cored more. Maybe I can entice Venice to take them and I can annex Naples itself.

    Sicily, on the other hand... Me want.

    Quote Originally Posted by gabor View Post
    How interesting! Your modifications seem to work! (Greek islands are Catholic though. I don't think Venice should pursue a 'convert them' policy.)

    Also, it seems you made the right choice about your NI. I'd have probably taken Bureacracy - one of few imo all-round ever good NIs, the sooner taken, the more profitable. Naval NIs will be needed sooner or later, when you grow bigger, the piracy gets fiercer and if you plan, not even grab the islands (there are some exploitish methods here) but hold onto them, you'll need naval NIs badly. As for Regimental System, I find it mediocre; yes Elite Regiments is great, but by tech 30 you might be powerful enough so as not to need it, and there are so many other useful NIs!

    Expanding south will pbly be easier than going against Venice or HRE-Italy. When you become monarchy, you might claim a throne or two too.

    Rome might be even a bigger problem than Romagna. I remeber some stab hits from my Venice game. But I also, vaguely, remember you can 'relocate Papacy' and there's also some sort of 'Vatican' decision, although the Pope can refuse.
    Never fear, I will be taking Bureaucracy at some point... after some naval NIs. Even with a faithful ally in Genoa; Venice, Aragon, and Portugal all have far stronger navy than Genoa. Venice's navy is quite scary this game. What is this 'relocate Papacy' decisions you speak of? I am very interested.

    Quote Originally Posted by Davisx3m View Post
    Italy ftw!!!
    Working on it

    Quote Originally Posted by Metz View Post
    How did you make the name of the countries appear in MMU?
    What do you mean?
    Last edited by CJL78; 18-10-2010 at 00:56.

  15. #35
    Comte de Purchase Merrick Chance''s Avatar
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    I would have gone for the Shipbuilding one so that you can get the science idea.

    Think about that!
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  16. #36
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    Very good AAR! Will follow this!
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  17. #37
    Like in the most recent version of MMU, you can't get a country to say England over it or get France to say France over it...

    Is there a newer version that has fixed this? Or are you using a older version.

  18. #38
    Duca di Firenze CJL78's Avatar
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    Chapter IV - Fall of the Republic


    "It is not titles that make men illustrious, but men who make titles illustrious."
    -Machiavelli


    Leopoldo Ludovisi de Medici
    In his remaining years, Giancarlo il Magnifico used his considerable fame, fortune, and power to legitimize his conquests, and consolidate Florence's control over them. Many rulers outside Italy and the Empire were upset at the Papacy's expulsion from Rome, particularly the devout Catholic kings in Britain. But for the most part, the Empire looked favorably on Florence removing a pain in the Empire's side, or, uh, bottom.

    He died, possibly of syphilis, in 1510, and his son Leopoldo Ludovisi came to power in Florence.




    A New Order of Things
    Leopoldo was officially made Duke of Rome in 1513, and Duke of Abruzzi in 1515 [cores]. He proclaimed himself Duke of Florence on January 1, 1516, officially replacing the Republic with the most powerful monarchy in Italy.

    However, the free people of Florence did not take kindly to the abolishment of their precious Republic, and Florence slipped into a period of relative instability for many years, which was not made any easier by the beginning of the Reformation in Hamburg, and the Milanese War.




    War with Milan
    In 1520, the new Margrave of Mantua deeply insulted the Duke of Milan, and the ill-tempered Duke declared war. Leopoldo led a coalition of all the major Italian states in defense of Mantua. This sounds familiar...



    In short, Milan won the first battle against of force of Mantuans and Venetians, and laid siege to Brescia. However, Leopoldo's army soon marched north and scattered the Milanese, lifting the siege. Along with Savoy and Genoa, the allies overran the Duchy and laid siege to Milan and Parma for over a year. With the Duke of Milan prisoner, Leopoldo forced the Peace of Parma, occupying the south of Milan and declaring himself Duke of Parma. Of course, this wasn't recognized by anyone, and soured his otherwise perfect relations with the Habsburg Emperor, who was first in succession to the throne of Milan.



    Four years later, in 1526, Leopoldo tragically fell down a staircase in the Palazzo Medici. His 7 year old son, Ferdinando, inherited the crown, furthering destabilizing the shaky Duchy.

    Last edited by CJL78; 25-10-2010 at 00:41.

  19. #39
    Duca di Firenze CJL78's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Merrick Chance' View Post
    I would have gone for the Shipbuilding one so that you can get the science idea.

    Think about that!
    I have thought about it, but we'll see.

    Quote Originally Posted by mayorqw View Post
    Very good AAR! Will follow this!
    Thanks!

    Quote Originally Posted by Metz View Post
    Like in the most recent version of MMU, you can't get a country to say England over it or get France to say France over it...

    Is there a newer version that has fixed this? Or are you using a older version.
    Oh I see what you mean. No, I'm using the most recent version of MMU (v1.26), albeit with my modifications, but that has nothing to do with the country names. Country names have appeared for me in all MMU versions since the patch that introduced them. Parcae's MMU AAR has them as well. It must be something with your installation; I would re-download MMU v1.26, and if it doesn't work, I would post in the MM mod thread for help.

    Though personally, I think the all-caps in that font is extremely ugly, and if anyone knows how to make country names not appear in all-caps please let me know. Thanks in advance!
    Last edited by CJL78; 25-10-2010 at 08:38.

  20. #40
    General gabor's Avatar
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    And so ends the Republic. Neither the Regency (although its high DIP might be a blessing as you pbly got some infamy for grabbing Parma) nor the young heir look promising. Interesting choice of advisors. But with monrach's poor ADM, aldermen is useless imo, no advanced buildings anyway and the boni to TE and PE are pretty insignificant that early in the game.

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