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Thread: Children of the Sun - a Cuzco MEIOU AAR

  1. #641
    Field Marshal Malurous's Avatar
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    Expect another update within a few days probably. The pace is a bit quick now but I'm trying to catch up to where I am in the game as I have a question to ask before I play further...

    Quote Originally Posted by Zzzzz... View Post
    Which is richer? Mexico or Inca?
    Aren't they both Inca? Still the original lands on average, but only because of the abundance of gold/silver/diamonds and the cacao spread that makes some otherwise mediocre provinces good. Apart from the CoTs my richest provinces are in Mesoamerica, but so are the poorest. A bigger scale there.

    Quote Originally Posted by Boris ze Spider View Post
    Can we see a pic of France?
    France? No. I haven't seen it myself and I don't intend to until I discover Europe.

    In fact, the only thing that I've seen that I haven't shown you guys is the Spanish lands in northeastern South America that I can see in the start map after loading the save.

    Quote Originally Posted by Athalcor View Post
    Go Majorca!
    And: Oh no..., Ulm again. He even lurks in to another AARs...about Inca!!
    You can't really escape the fella, can you?

    Quote Originally Posted by FinnishFish View Post
    Ulm is attacking repel those evil savages and release...
    umm...
    mm...
    Release Finland from evil claws of Sweden
    That's one theory!

    Quote Originally Posted by Enewald View Post
    So close!
    Ulm is blobbing I hope?
    Wouldn't know, but hopefully. Or at least gathering vassals.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chief Ragusa View Post
    Ah the map spread. Portugal is telling everyone where uyou are, but your request for information about europe was met with a very dismissive rejection.
    Indeed... Those bastards always keep information away from us, no matter if it's about maps or boats.

    I am actually convinced Bio Bio is used by Inti missionaries as a training ground for new recruits.
    Hmm, that's a very good theory really. Good luck challenging the prevalent theory in scientific circles of the Sapa Incas just inventing filler for their CV.

    I was sure Ulm has traded in Cuzco before now, but maybe it was one of the other German cities.
    I'm not absolutely certain but I think that was Lübeck.

    Good to see Burgundy and France humbled by Scwyz and Mallorca. Fear them, if they should build colonies in your part of the world.
    That's a scary thought. I don't know if Switzerland is a potential colonizer from where they start, but Mallorca is clearly a threat!

    How much longer until your "heir" becomes able to go off hunting alone?
    That'll be possible really soon, under two years I think.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alan deLane View Post
    Thanks, they're more or less how I thought they would be.

    Once you start to colonize seriously, don't forget to move towards "expansionism". One or two other sliders have an influence on colony growth too, but I'm too lazy to check it now.
    Yeah, the next move (a year and a half after the screenshot actually) was towards Expansionism, as will be seen in the next update.

    Frankly I'm not entirely satisfied with how I've played the slider game. Okay, I admit that Cuzco's starting positions were really rotten (heavily decentralized, full narrowminded, full serfdom, almost full quantity, somewhat isolationist) so centralization and innovative were a must for westernization, expansionist required for colonization and some quality moves were extremely useful in the original expansion that I did. But had I stayed at something like -2 serfdom instead of going as far as +1 free subjects, and maybe taken one less move towards quality, I could have full centralization (needed for military modernization) and some more expansionism by now. Yes, I made the right moves at the time and those sliders are better where they are now, but I should have thought ahead more and done at least the free subjects program later.

    And another question: do you want to let your land/naval-sliders stay like this for the rest of the game?
    At least for now I have to. I need the morale boost, and the force limit increase and army cost decreases have much larger economical benefits than the naval bonuses would.
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    Sliders are a nice feature in MEIOU, due to fact that the boni of (e.g.) secularism are not the exact opposite of theocracy. I tend to take production/trade boni into account as a rule, there after it depends on a lot of things, that can be subsumed "as how the game develops". And whether or not I'll conquer a lot of provinces with herectic/heathen religions and whether I stay catholic/orthodox or (though a bit of a novum to me) lutheran (+1 tolerance vs. herectics ).

    But this is about YOUR game: so back to the AAR (and I'm also looking forward for a screenie of Ol' Europe)!

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  3. #643
    A bunny with a hat Moderator Nikolai II's Avatar
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    Oh, a question about long-lasting crappy heirs during crappy regencies. Have you considered just letting their legitimacy slip until they are ousted by a pretender? (Can be sped up by having poor stability.)

    At least I think your regency can be overthrown if legitimacy is low. Haven't checked. Wanted to ask anyway
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    Ha, the Europeans all know where the Inca hang their hats now...You'll be fending off the Breton's and Savoyards soon enough.
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    Great that Mallorca seems to be doing well. It seems as if things are going to become increasingly interesting now that so many European powers now know of you.
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    It certainly would be interesting to see what Mallorca and Switzerland are up to in the Old World.

    In the meantime, things in the Americas seem to be proceeding apace. Your tech rate's looking pretty good really, given you advanced three tech levels in one eight year period. How does it compare to Portugal's?
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  7. #647
    Field Marshal Malurous's Avatar
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    Alright, update in a sec. I'm a bit sad that I had to rush this - there was plenty of material for two updates and I just crammed it all into one - but I want to get back to playing again.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alan deLane View Post
    Sliders are a nice feature in MEIOU, due to fact that the boni of (e.g.) secularism are not the exact opposite of theocracy. I tend to take production/trade boni into account as a rule, there after it depends on a lot of things, that can be subsumed "as how the game develops".
    Yeah true, it leads to more options where you can mix and match and less "absolutely correct" directions to take. In vanilla, I find myself eventually heading for in large part the same sliders irregardless of nation - not so in MEIOU.

    A great example from this game would be the missionary effects: I'm a full theocracy, so even with westernization capable innovativeness, I'm able to retain a small missionary income. While in another situation, I might choose to get a missionary gain by being a narrowminded secular nation.

    But this is about YOUR game: so back to the AAR (and I'm also looking forward for a screenie of Ol' Europe)!
    Nah, if something in the AAR/thread/game/mod inspires someone to go off on a tangent I'm all for it as long as forum rules are followed.

    Europe will be shown immediately when I see it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nikolai II View Post
    Oh, a question about long-lasting crappy heirs during crappy regencies. Have you considered just letting their legitimacy slip until they are ousted by a pretender? (Can be sped up by having poor stability.)

    At least I think your regency can be overthrown if legitimacy is low. Haven't checked. Wanted to ask anyway
    Hmm interesting, I've never tried such a method. But not in this situation, for two reasons: I'm so close to having republics available that I'd rather just switch governments if those were the two options, and besides I want to stick with the Sun God descendants as long as the line survives - I'm not one to dethrone divine beings, unless they're ruling a different nation.

    Quote Originally Posted by blsteen View Post
    Ha, the Europeans all know where the Inca hang their hats now...You'll be fending off the Breton's and Savoyards soon enough.
    Forget the Mallorcans at your peril!

    Quote Originally Posted by morningSIDEr View Post
    Great that Mallorca seems to be doing well. It seems as if things are going to become increasingly interesting now that so many European powers now know of you.
    Yeah who knows, the map spread might give any newcomers a head start. I'd better act quickly with the colonization...

    Quote Originally Posted by Dewirix View Post
    It certainly would be interesting to see what Mallorca and Switzerland are up to in the Old World.
    Indeed, I really look forward to discovering those nations! Not to mention the British Isles. I believe I told of the English bankruptcy cycle and subsequent collapse just under a century ago, and I've learned from the log that at least Wales is independent. The Isles could potentially be a mess.
    (I'm sure any NHL fans out there have heard similar claims a time or two during the past fifteen years.)

    In the meantime, things in the Americas seem to be proceeding apace. Your tech rate's looking pretty good really, given you advanced three tech levels in one eight year period. How does it compare to Portugal's?
    Very badly. At the beginning of this update our tech levels range from four to fifteen, while they're in the high twenties and low thirties.
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  8. #648
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    Chapter Thirty-six
    1576-1588


    For some reason our land force limit goes from 199 to 200 in September (don't know where the difference comes from), so we're in the maximum category for colonist amount. Wohoo!

    In September, our Admirals are Concerned.



    Well they should be, as I don't really know what they are drawing a salary for. Anyway, the other option was going one step Naval, and while the colonist cost decrease would have been nice pretty soon, it has less of an economical effect than the force limit bonus and army cost reduction that I get for Land. And that's not mentioning the nice morale boost.

    I don't know what happens on November 1st, but my game freezes for a minute or so, and just when I'm about to hit reset it continues with a full Portuguese city of 6000 inhabitants, with a level 1 fort, sitting on my northern border!



    That's some heavy event - in terms of both effect and processor use - right there, whatever it was.

    I get a slider move in March 1578 and go the first step Expansionist. Right now I get basically trade efficiency for stability cost, so it's not a good trade, but it obviously gets better when colonization commences.

    May sees Yahuar Hacuac I taking the throne after an uneventful regency.



    He's a Knowledged Tactician, replacing the previous +2 % force limits with +10 %. This is fitting as he's also a 4/6/3/3 general! I'd like a huge celebration as my legitimacy is subpar, but it costs a thousand ducats so I'll settle for a big one instead.

    But the real story is the heir Tupac Hualpa!



    This is what we've been waiting for. If this guy stays alive (fingers crossed) he's good enough to finally westernize. I guess he's Yahuar Hacuac's little brother as he's only two years younger, so basically all that's needed is the death of the new ruler.

    In July I notice that I've neglected one province, Tulum, in the workshop program. I suppose it had an active missionary when I constructed them in Mesoamerica. This gets corrected.

    I send missionaries to Mayapan and Uaxactun in December. These are the last two national focus provinces that haven't been converted, so I should send missionaries now that they still have seven years under the focus.

    Our favorite Switzerland continues doing its thing in January 1579 and diploannexes Burgundy.

    We're one level away from our goal in February 1580. Apparently we are now also advanced enough to have the government form that we have.



    No time to waste with the new Idea slot so close, so...



    It's an unbelievably crappy idea alone in my situation. Both penalties sting and none of the bonuses has any use whatsoever. But it's needed for QFTNW so what can you do.

    General Atoc dies in October, but that doesn't matter as Yahuar Hacuac I will do any fighting that we have to do.

    I don't know how, but this happens in November:



    That's quick! I mean, we still have the Overextension modifier and the last time we had to regain stab with that modifier it took years. I have of course converted (religion and culture) provinces and got rid of the Bureaucracy Idea which increases stab costs, but I still can't explain such a big difference.

    This will be easier than I expected. +2 is reached in August 1581.

    I build a Glorious Monument in Uxmal in September.

    An interesting change for Tlacopan...



    I have six of their cores, so an aggressive cavalry building program is started.

    I actually reach full stability in January 1582, shaving a couple of months, via a Great Man event.



    Tlaxcallan has the honor of having the first Mesoamerican natural disaster that I'd call proper. 7200 people die in an earthquake.

    I start sending colonists to Tumaco. QFTNW is close and I have five colonists, so I might as well get a head start. They take an interesting route:



    So it's not only Europeans and gods (and possibly horses) that make fun of us for not knowing how to build boats, our own colonists do it as well! I mean, in this case there isn't even any reason why they couldn't just walk. Showoffs...

    November brings news that Tumaco will produce fish. As can be expected, that changes to cacao soon enough.

    Chichen Itza gets its Glorious Monument in January 1583. We now have five of them.

    After some quiet years of cavalry building and deploying, the free investment from our Great Man pays off in August 1585.



    In the same month our National Focus becomes available and it's moved to Teotitlan to catch a couple of mid-level provinces. Unfortunately, the last provinces around the previous focus couldn't be converted. Teotitlan gets a missionary though.

    Some interesting development in February 1586...



    Hehe. We would now know more about ships if we knew anything about them. It's always satisfying to give zero a larger multiplier.

    For some reason we have no choice but to Improve the Capital in May.



    They call that an "opportunity"? I wasn't going to use cash and as we ordinarily have 23 times Portugal's manpower, I go ahead and assume that we'll still have plenty with this penalty.

    Switzerland annexes some poor minor (Sitten) in November, this time by force. I seriously want to see these guys.

    We finally have a solid cavalry contingent in each of our Mesoamerican armies in February 1587. We'll have cores in less than four years, so the Tlacopan cores didn't end up making a huge difference. Still, it's something.

    A year later in February 1588, the wait for the Idea is over.



    Oh yeah, it's called Quest For New Trade Routes. I'm going to say QFTNW.

    The next month we get a Colonialism CB on Portugal, and more importantly...



    Okay, that's more like it as far as numbers go!

    To continue our happy month, Teotitlan and Uaxactun convert on the 5th and 14th, respectively.

    Then it gets even more happy, and then a lot less happy.
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  9. #649
    Yay for more happy. Boo for less happy.

    Did Switzerland declare war? : )

  10. #650
    Slacker Extraordinaire Zzzzz...'s Avatar
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    Yes! About time the Incas starts colonizing.. err... finding new trade routes
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  11. #651
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    Good luck with the new trade routes...
    you know, the old trade or bleed routine
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  12. #652
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    you declare war...and get pwned?

  13. #653
    That Portuguese colony is in the wrong place.

    Your Inca ruler dies and you get the westernize Inca, start westernizing and Portugal DoWs allied with Switzerland and Mallorca. I believe that was the alliance they had when they annexed the state in meso-america.

  14. #654
    Field Marshal Malurous's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Omen View Post
    Yay for more happy. Boo for less happy.

    Did Switzerland declare war? : )
    Yay and boo indeed! But of course nothing that severe.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zzzzz... View Post
    Yes! About time the Incas starts colonizing.. err... finding new trade routes
    Heh yeah, maybe we can even find the trade routes that our merchants have been using all along?

    Quote Originally Posted by blsteen View Post
    Good luck with the new trade routes...
    you know, the old trade or bleed routine
    Thanks! How about both, is that an option? As long as we do the trading and other people the bleeding.

    Quote Originally Posted by naggy View Post
    you declare war...and get pwned?
    Not yet at least, though at least the first one should be happening soon enough...

    Quote Originally Posted by Chief Ragusa View Post
    That Portuguese colony is in the wrong place.

    Your Inca ruler dies and you get the westernize Inca, start westernizing and Portugal DoWs allied with Switzerland and Mallorca. I believe that was the alliance they had when they annexed the state in meso-america.
    It certainly is. And yeah the alliance was just that back then, but the reformation put a spanner in the works. Portugal stayed Catholic while I think both of the others converted.

    You nailed the ruler and westernization part there, the rest I'll clarify in the next post.
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  15. #655
    Field Marshal Malurous's Avatar
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    The Question


    So, in April 1589 we get fun stuff like this.



    And this.



    And almost immediately thereafter, we get "fun" stuff like the game crashing before I have the opportunity to save. I guess I should have saved immediately instead of westernizing first, but I was too excited about the possibility.

    So I want your opinion: shall I

    a)
    Load the autosave and cheat-kill my monarch to get the heir to rise to the throne. I would do it on the same day, April 10th, and reload if something of major consequence happens in the early year (the original playthrough was uneventful), then continue as if it was the first playthrough. I checked the Wiki for console commands and it seems to be simple - though does anyone know if it matters whether you use "die" or "heir_succeeds"? Is there a difference if you have a grown-up heir?

    b) Just load the autosave and play on as if that had never happened, and hope for the best?

    Understandably, I'm leaning towards a) myself. After all, I waited for a capable monarch and westernized fair and square. Additionally I feel that, between the PU, the inheritance and the westernization, I've already "paid my dues" as far as waiting around goes in this game. With the possibility of the monarch dying before full westernization looming anyway, I don't think I need an extraneous roadblock like this.

    But I'm not going to take such a drastic step before consulting the audience. This is also why I've updated relatively quickly lately after a slower schedule - I wanted to catch up to the game as I'm not going to play further before I get what can be deemed decisive feedback one way or the other. So fire away!
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  16. #656
    A.

    That is hugely disappointing, and a system error rather than a game play error. I'd rather you edit and play on rather than risk you getting burned out and having to wait decades or more for a new ruler.

  17. #657
    Slacker Extraordinaire Zzzzz...'s Avatar
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  18. #658
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malurous View Post
    I don't know what happens on November 1st, but my game freezes for a minute or so, and just when I'm about to hit reset it continues with a full Portuguese city of 6000 inhabitants, with a level 1 fort, sitting on my northern border!
    It's one of the new secret MEIOU features. Sometimes the AI pauses the game to edit the save when it thinks it would be historically justified.

    As for your system crash, definitely A.

  19. #659
    Second Lieutenant MacDunne's Avatar
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    I'm glad to have come across this AAR. Interesting story/game play and an active audience equals a fun read while showcasing a great Mod in MEIOU.

    As for the question -- not sure how much weight I should have considering how much of a newcomer to this AAR I am, but I second Omen's advice. You've paid your dues and you shouldn't be penalized for a system crash. I have been trekking through your AAR for the past week (don't have the luxury to be able to read such a rich AAR in one sitting) and it just feels right for your empire to take the next step instead of being forced back to the waiting game. Its high time for Chirldren of the Sun to meet their next challenge and see how they fair on the big stage.

    Look forward to see where this AAR will lead to. Been an interesting ride so far, but I'm sure the best has yet to come.
    Is teann madra ar a thairseacht féin.
    Every dog is bold on its own doorstep.

  20. #660
    Field Marshal naggy's Avatar
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    C.) Sacrifice someone to a volcano.

    After that, A.

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