Children of the Fatherland: MP conversion game

[OrangeYoshi]

How convenient that the have reducing the two nations of the "Oriental Alliance" to totally insignificant minors with two equally insignificant AI neighbors to play around a bit. Are they issued a shovel alongside with their sandbox ?

Consider the situation between Croatia and Bulgaria: Even if the entire peace deal is accepted, we are merely trading places on the world stage. He has my current manpower, I get his current manpower.

Now, if you want to continue to complain about that arrangement, why are there no complaints about Croatia being a "totally insignificant minor" and why is no one crying out to help me?

I myself am against the AI states being formed as I see them as going a bit overboard. But the rest of it is really minor land exchanges.

[FrozenWall]

Now, I myself am against the AI states being formed as I see them as going a bit overboard. But the rest of it is really minor land exchanges.

Note that that is simply a threat if we have to fight this war for several sessions and annex our way to the maps edge to get peace. If they are reasonable in their negotiations, and this war does not drag over several sessions those threats will not come into effect.

All we want is for the stuff they took from us last war to be returned.

[King of Men]

The war has been rather back and forth. There have been several sieges of Constantinople, none successful. At one time al-Andalus landed north of Corfu; these troops were driven back into the sea by the Theme of Hellas. A hundred thousand screaming Cossacks invaded Thrace; the cataphractoi stood like rocks against the tide, and the waters flowed and receded around them. Only a few thousand survived to limp back north to the steppes. Corfu has been reduced to obedience; Rhodos is occupied. Against this must be set the loss of Zeta to the Croatians and of two Black Sea provinces to the Russians, as shown in black on this map:



That's the Balkan front; in the east things are very different. Rome and the Caliphate have traded blows; Famagusta, Teluch, and Beirut are again Roman, against which must be set the loss of Baalbek and the occupation of large swathes of Roman Syria. But these are pinpricks. The real news here is the defeat of the much-vaunted Fatimid Banners in the inland deserts:



The red smears indicate areas held by the Caliphate before the war, as also shown in this prewar map:



This, presumably, is the complete disaster that the Caliphate so-blithely refers to as the loss of "the sand" and "some border vassals". Persia on the Red Sea, and within striking distance of the wine-dark water!

Some battles. I did not jest when I spoke of a hundred thousand screaming Cossacks:



Observe that the Russian army (defending) has much light cavalry and light infantry, while the Romans have, proportionately, a much larger fraction of heavy infantry and cavalry. Likewise in the Granny-Slaughter at Epirus:



Note that, while the armies are similar in size, the Romans (here defending) have half the light cavalry and twice the heavy infantry. In this case there was no morale bug, in fact the Croatians very kindly stood in their ranks to be killed instead of running away, so I suspect that this disparity was the cause of the slaughter.

[OrangeYoshi]

There have been several sieges of Constantinople, none successful.

False. Croatia took Constantinople early in the war.

[FrozenWall]

This, presumably, is the complete disaster that the Caliphate so-blithely refers to as the loss of "the sand" and "some border vassals".

It is, those lands represent little more than 10 coin and much attrition, we have yet not lost a province worth more than half a coin in monthly income. The only thing that matters in a war is the army, and ones ability to reinforce it. Despite my entire Syrian fieldarmy twice dissapearing due to bugs we have recaptured these lands, and are driving the Persians back in the desert.

The real news here is the defeat of the much-vaunted Fatimid Banners in the inland deserts:

Nowhere has a Fatimid fieldarmy been defeated, unless affected by the moralebug or suffering this new army-dissapeacance-bug (which as it so happens started appearing after KoM fiddled with the mod before this session, hmmm).

False. Croatia took Constantinople early in the war.

And a rebellios byzantine vassal before that

[King of Men]

You are mistaken, as shown in this screenshot:



Byzantion is held by the rebellious Count of Nikomedeia. However, he is a Komnenus and no vassal of Croatia; consequently this is purely a Rome-internal affair, which has indeed been settled to the satisfaction of all concerned. Nikomedeia fought loyally to repulse the invaders in the Thrakian campaign of 1253.

[Foelsgaard]

Nowhere has a Fatimid fieldarmy been defeated, unless affected by the moralebug or suffering this new army-dissapeacance-bug (which as it so happens started appearing after KoM fiddled with the mod before this session, hmmm).

The dear "Caliph" must not have been paying much attention to his armies then, cause the Abbasids saw the backsides of Fatimids a lot in this war.

Of course, being the leader of all Islam must be very burdensome for him and earthly matters is evidently not something he has the strength to bear as well.

[FrozenWall]

The dear "Caliph" must not have been paying much attention to his armies then, cause the Abbasids saw the backsides of Fatimids a lot in this war.

I was paying keen attention. Note that when you declared war all the armies marching into my land were turned back by their equal number, I defeated your armies in detail and drove you to the outskirts of Baghdad, then we started crashing. And my armies were striken by the morale-bug, while you could just demob/remob in the next province to get back to full morale my troops had to come back from Morocco or be beaten of by basically anything. My armies were defeated by the gameengine, tho one must recognize your ability to play to the weaknessess of the game.

[Foelsgaard]

I remember it differently. But alright, I'll concede the point if it soothes your pain.

[FrozenWall]

I remember it differently. But alright, I'll concede the point if it soothes your pain.

In fairness I think a there is a large difference in KoM's and your veteran ability to play the game in the bug-ridden mp enviroment, as opposed to me, OY and vR who are still stuck trying to play the war in singleplayer mode....

[Foelsgaard]

In fairness I think a there is a large difference in KoM's and your veteran ability to play the game in the bug-ridden mp enviroment, as opposed to me, OY and vR who are still stuck trying to play the war in singleplayer mode....

To be honest, I've never played CK multiplayer before this game and never fought a prolonged war before this one.

[King of Men]

I had just as much difficulty attacking Russia against the morale bug, when it was in a death spiral and had rebels on all sides. The bugs favour the defense.

[Foelsgaard]

I had just as much difficulty attacking Russia against the morale bug, when it was in a death spiral and had rebels on all sides. The bugs favour the defense.

It favours small countries with high strength density.

[Gollevainen]

The Kingdom of Vanaja(Finland) is stoutly wathcing the border of Norway! You never know what those migth be up to...
...expecially since the great talk in that other forum has been around allies spesified in NAPs...by the Danish overlords of Norwegians, clearly in the tone: "now, who of those who defende Egypt isen't really an ally of Russia?"

For the recored, Finland was ingame technical ally of Russia...

[FrozenWall]

It favours small countries with high strength density.

alas!

[Foelsgaard]

It favours small countries with high strength density.

To be more correct: It favours a short reinforcement distance. Which is often to the benefit of the defense.

So the bug kinda-sorta gives the effect of supply lines. Which isn't really appropriate for medieval armies living off the land but, indeed, alas.

[OrangeYoshi]

You are mistaken, as shown in this screenshot:

Byzantion is held by the rebellious Count of Nikomedeia. However, he is a Komnenus and no vassal of Croatia; consequently this is purely a Rome-internal affair, which has indeed been settled to the satisfaction of all concerned. Nikomedeia fought loyally to repulse the invaders in the Thrakian campaign of 1253.

15,000 Croatians participated in the seige. It was far from an internal Bulgarian affair.

[Kolibri]

The Kingdom of Vanaja(Finland) is stoutly wathcing the border of Norway! You never know what those migth be up to...

Oh don´t worry about those Ynglings, I got them covered. If they harass you just give me a call and I´ll whip their asses back in line.

[FrozenWall]

So the bug kinda-sorta gives the effect of supply lines.

I can live with the morale bug. What really ruins it is my armies disappearing right before my very eyes for no apparent reason. Especially since it seems they reappear at zero strength in their home prov. :[

[Edzako]

This arguing about bugs makes me happy that I didn't join grand campaign at this phase. That aside what have other powers doing while this war goes on ?