Cold War Extension for AoD

LordInsane said:

Oh, indeed. It certainly isn't a, ah, high-priority thing. Really, my main reason for mentioning it was annoyance that AOD had bothered to add a nation and then never gotten around to make anything for it but the flag, the name and the entry in revolt.txt (the secondary was, as I suggested, that I find that it, in a modified form, is more plausible in the time-frame of this mod than for WW2 and environs).
What range do you want the minister-ids to be in?

Click to expand...

You could always go for giving "early birth" to European Companies of today, like EADS, Airbus, Eurocopter, etc.

From you, since you're into these things, I'd like to see your ideas on naval and air doctrine from 1970-present. Once that's complete there would only be minor revisions.

Click to expand...

Ill get on them asap.


Here is what I was working on for the non-aligned doctrine tree. When you mentioned earlier a more open-ended post 70ish tree I though of these.
They're compatible with Warsaw Pact & Guerilla doctrine tree as well as would work very well for a theoretical Nazi Ger/Israeli tree ie. use NATO doctrines plus the ones below as they're counterinsurgency/repression focused.

Play around with them & see where/if they fit. Optimally could be used to boost the 3rd world, Ger/Israeli, WP & guerrilla trees.




#Overseas Officer Training

#Doctrine of using supperior training and facilities of large scale allies to improve the strategy & techniques of our fighting men.
#Nonaligned/Guerrilla/Israeli? doctrinal trees?

year = 1970
component = { id = ? name = "School of the Americas model" type = management difficulty = 8 }
component = { id = ? name = "Long duration overseas officer training" type = training difficulty = 8 }
component = { id = ? name = "Counterinsurgency and specialized skill focus" type = infantry_focus difficulty = 8 }
component = { id = ? name = "Preparation and examination" type = decentralized_execution difficulty = 8 }
component = { id = ? name = "Reintegration in national forces" type = training difficulty = 8 }

effects =
{ command = { type = build_time which = land when = now where = relative value = 5 } #they're overseas after all
command = { type = max_organization which = land value = 5 }
command = { type = morale which = land value = 5 }
command = { type = build_cost which = cavalry when = now where = relative value = -5 } #counterinsurgency focus
command = { type = build_cost which = bergsjaeger when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = build_cost which = police when = now where = relative value = -5 }
}


#Culture of Fear

#Doctrine of counterinsurgency focus in light of non-state sponsored violence
#Nonaligned/Guerrilla/Warsaw Pact/Israeli doctrinal trees?

year = 1975
component = { id = ? name = "Media manipulation" type = management difficulty = 8 }
component = { id = ? name = "Secret police focus" type = infantry_focus difficulty = 8 }
component = { id = ? name = "The enemies are amongst us mentality" type = individual_courage difficulty = 8 }
component = { id = ? name = "Internal defense training" type = training difficulty = 8 }
component = { id = ? name = "Sweep the streets with shows of force" type = small_unit_tactics difficulty = 8 }

effects =
{ command = { type = urban_defense which = land value = 5 } #urban focus
command = { type = morale which = land value = 5 } #media manipulation & vigilance
command = { type = build_cost which = police when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = max_organization which = police value = 10 } #professional secret police detachments
command = { type = morale which = police value = 10 }
}


#Death Squads

#Doctrine of utilizing state sponsored terror tactics on internal/occupied population
#Nonaligned/Guerrilla/Warsaw Pact/Israeli doctrinal trees?

year = 1980
component = { id = ? name = "Violent political repression focus" type = management difficulty = 8 }
component = { id = ? name = "Extra-judicial killings, assassinations, and forced disappearances" type = infantry_focus difficulty = 8 }
component = { id = ? name = "Summary justice mentality" type = individual_courage difficulty = 8 }
component = { id = ? name = "Internal enemies focus" type = training difficulty = 8 }
component = { id = ? name = "Show of force" type = small_unit_tactics difficulty = 8 }

effects =
{ command = { type = max_organization which = land value = 5 } #wide freedom of action
command = { type = morale which = land value = 5 } #above the law
command = { type = build_cost which = infantry when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = build_cost which = police when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = max_organization which = police value = 10 } #professional secret police detachments
command = { type = morale which = police value = 10 }
}


#Global Arms Procurement

#Opening up of international arms procurement to the highest bidder in light of the end of the Iron Curtain.
#Also see movie: "Lord of War"
#Nonaligned/Guerrilla doctrinal tree?

year = 1990
component = { id = ? name = "Global arms market access" type = management difficulty = 8 }
component = { id = ? name = "Open bidder design competition focus" type = technical_efficiency difficulty = 8 }
component = { id = ? name = "Bidding wars" type = individual_courage difficulty = 8 }
component = { id = ? name = "'Customer is always right' procurement mentality" type = centralized_execution difficulty = 8 }
component = { id = ? name = "Delivery and testing" type = training difficulty = 8 }

effects =
{ command = { type = build_cost which = land when = now where = relative value = -10 } #bidding wars!
command = { type = build_time which = land when = now where = relative value = -5 } #surplus stock delivery, competition contract boost

command = { type = morale which = land value = 5 } #new hardware!
command = { type = industrial_modifier which = supplies value = 10 } #cheaper imported munitions
}

Couple notes from first impressions:

Urban Spearhead Doctrine has the same bonuses as 3 Block War Doctrine

Instead should be:

effects =
{ command = { type = build_cost which = land when = now where = relative value = 10 } #Inc cost of specialized urban warfare equipment
command = { type = urban_attack which = land value = 25 }
command = { type = urban_defense which = land value = 25 }
command = { type = urban_move which = land value = 25 }
command = { type = morale which = land value = 5 } #Feelgood about the new toys & doctrine?
}

Iron Dome Doctrine has GDE set @ 1.0 instead of 1.2-1.3. However im not even sure that you can raise GDE above 1.0 (shot in the dark really). If that doesnt work use:

command = { type = "land type"_defense which = land value = 25 }

Overall land doctrine tree looks supersweet

------
Regarding Interwar Extension, I find that instead of making multiple copies of AoD one should just use the Jonesoft Generic Mod Enabler instead. At a flip of a button ill rotate the Interwar extension in or out of the AoD folder. Could be used for CWE or any other mod as well.

Also importantly this could be used to give the game more flavor. Rotating in say GIP vismod to give more flavor in the 50s or MDS 1.5/1.6 interface skin for the modern era without any problems.

Flagpacks could also be modeled that way, although it would have to be as a group
Either way, check it out here:
http://www.users.on.net/~jscones/software/products-jsgme.html

A couple of ideas concerning land doctrines.

You could also add land doctrines to represent the use of private military companies. I'm not good at modding techs, but I'll just say roughly what I think.
My ideas are for two different doctrines, one for the NATO branch and other for the Third World branch to represent the different ways that PMCs are used worldwide.

For NATO (Private Military Companies, circa 2000), the trade off is cheaper forces to deploy with reduced efficiency.
For the Third World (Mercenary Groups, circa 1990) it is the opposite, they are more expensive than regular troops but also fight in more organized fashion.

I just don't know how to represent this "cheaper/more expensive" difference. For NATO it should mean reduced supply usage, because they focus on long term deployments. And for the third world perhaps should be reduced IC cost or build time, as they were used to turn the tide in ongoing wars.

Also I think they should be like the "fast training" techs and be somewhat independent, not a prerequisite for anything.

Edit: a few questions.
Is it possible to reduce belligerance required to DOW via techs?
Is it possible to improve land units suppression efficiency via techs?

Ringwraith_JP said:

You could also add land doctrines to represent the use of private military companies. I'm not good at modding techs, but I'll just say roughly what I think.
My ideas are for two different doctrines, one for the NATO branch and other for the Third World branch to represent the different ways that PMCs are used worldwide.

For NATO (Private Military Companies, circa 2000), the trade off is cheaper forces to deploy with reduced efficiency.
For the Third World (Mercenary Groups, circa 1990) it is the opposite, they are more expensive than regular troops but also fight in more organized fashion.

I just don't know how to represent this "cheaper/more expensive" difference. For NATO it should mean reduced supply usage, because they focus on long term deployments. And for the third world perhaps should be reduced IC cost or build time, as they were used to turn the tide in ongoing wars.

Also I think they should be like the "fast training" techs and be somewhat independent, not a prerequisite for anything.

Edit: a few questions.
Is it possible to reduce belligerance required to DOW via techs?
Is it possible to improve land units suppression efficiency via techs?

Click to expand...

PMC units if used as a doctrine, would in all likelihood be high grade militia units, as they lack heavy support weapons & are relegated to small arms & technicals (for all intents and purposes). They would likely have high organization but low morale (as they're expert but fight for $$) & their support costs should also be higher, to represent their large cost of running (average western Merc makes 3-4x more than equivalent soldier)
No problem making that a western tech, lets see if nomonhan has space for it though..

iceHawk said:

PMC units if used as a doctrine, would in all likelihood be high grade militia units, as they lack heavy support weapons & are relegated to small arms & technicals (for all intents and purposes). They would likely have high organization but low morale (as they're expert but fight for $$) & their support costs should also be higher, to represent their large cost of running (average western Merc makes 3-4x more than equivalent soldier)
No problem making that a western tech, lets see if nomonhan has space for it though..

Click to expand...

I disagree with that. Western found a use for PMCs because they're, all things concerned, cheaper. The contracted soldiers make more money, but the government does not pay his wage directly. That's the whole point of outsourcing; for the US government it is cheaper to outsource some functions than spend a lot of money in training, keeping and providing other types of support (like family support) to the soldiers. The use of PMCs in the US military has it's roots on the LOGCAP program, that had precisely this objective. I agree that they should have poor combat efficiency in comparison to regular troops, but I'm not sure about what would be better, reduced Organization or reduced Morale. But I cannot agree with them being more expensive. What would be the point of this? Units that are more expensive than regular units, and that fight poorly?

On the other hand, the use of PMCs by Third World Countries represents the exactly opposite. The big example is South African Company Executive Outcomes work in Angola, fighting UNITAS rebels alongside government forces. Compared to Third World troops, PMCs represent more expensive troops (the Government of Angola committed a great percentage of it's income with oil exports to pay what Executive Outcomes wanted), but fight way better than regular troops. When Executive Outcomes arrived in Angola they managed to turn the tide of the war BRUTALLY in favor of the government forces.

Edit: about their lack of heavy support weapons.
Executive Outcomes, that I've mentioned earlier, fielded Mi-24 Gunships and T-72 tanks, with crew. Blackwater has a aviation branch, they even bought a Embraer Super Tucano light attack aircraft. They do what they're paid to do.

Ringwraith_JP said:

I disagree with that. Western found a use for PMCs because they're, all things concerned, cheaper. The contracted soldiers make more money, but the government does not pay his wage directly. That's the whole point of outsourcing; for the US government it is cheaper to outsource some functions than spend a lot of money in training, keeping and providing other types of support (like family support) to the soldiers. The use of PMCs in the US military has it's roots on the LOGCAP program, that had precisely this objective. I agree that they should have poor combat efficiency in comparison to regular troops, but I'm not sure about what would be better, reduced Organization or reduced Morale. But I cannot agree with them being more expensive. What would be the point of this? Units that are more expensive than regular units, and that fight poorly?

On the other hand, the use of PMCs by Third World Countries represents the exactly opposite. The big example is South African Company Executive Outcomes work in Angola, fighting UNITAS rebels alongside government forces. Compared to Third World troops, PMCs represent more expensive troops (the Government of Angola committed a great percentage of it's income with oil exports to pay what Executive Outcomes wanted), but fight way better than regular troops. When Executive Outcomes arrived in Angola they managed to turn the tide of the war BRUTALLY in favor of the government forces.

Edit: about their lack of heavy support weapons.
Executive Outcomes, that I've mentioned earlier, fielded Mi-24 Gunships and T-72 tanks, with crew. Blackwater has a aviation branch, they even bought a Embraer Super Tucano light attack aircraft. They do what they're paid to do.

Click to expand...

Good points on the long term costs.. More upfront cost but no long term benefit payments/support. Therefore probably remove the increased cost mention.

However your off on the heavy weapons aspect. While one or two gunships or light helicopters would be used or a tank here or there, At most were talking about a Company sized attachments, not even close to a Brigade or even a division.

The use of private military companies is debatable. They have a lot of pluses but cannot use the MOST MODERN weapons available because governments won't sell to them. Case in point--the weapons you mentioned are 1970s era weapons. But it still might be better than what the country can produce on its own. The effect would seem to me to be similar to buying a foreign unit that is beyond your own technological level.
If we're looking at overall effects, I'd be inclined toward reduced max_org (not the latest equipment) but increased morale (fight better).

Click to expand...

Realistically, if they were to be included, they should be militia divisions or even ad-hoc(mixed heavy weapons) brigade attachments. Although I would also argue about the lack of latest gear. Because they're outside of a usually slow bureaucratic procurement process, and COTS components being widely available in the XXI century, i would argue that for light infantry unit(militia) or say mixed technical/LAV/tank/gunship PMC brigade they could have high org & high morale.


Overall the land tree is done for now. Ill run through it in detail & suggest a fix here or there but its fine. 1 PMC tech (unlockable in 90s for 3rd world tree) or post 2000 for NATO would be a nice addition..

Ill post preliminary ideas on naval doctrines in next day or two np.

If we are in need of a compromise I would go for the Mercenary doctrine for the Third World tree.

About ways to implement it, I think that the brigade idea could be nice. But historically, talking about PMC working with Third World countries, the differences in battle efficiency were HUGE. So that should be a very good brigade attachment and quite expensive. But sounds good.

nomonhan said:

What I want more is ideas for air and naval doctrine. I can only think of a few--
air -- mid air refueling
air -- AWACS
naval (can't think of a name right now) but the 1990s doctrine to concentrate on supply delivery to regional conflicts rather than conventional naval warfare)
naval --modern piracy (Somalia, etc)

Click to expand...

On no problem on these! Here is a VERY rough idea mix/sketch for naval doctrines:


Modern Maritime Interdiction Operations http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maritime_Interdiction_Operations
Combat Information Center http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operations_room
Electronic Sea Warfare
Naval Tactical Data System http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naval_Tactical_Data_System
Naval Battlespace
Modern Fleet Formation
Maritime Cooperation
Maritime Security Operations http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maritime_Security_Operations
Visit, Board, Search, and Seizure http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visit,_Board,_Search,_and_Seizure

Bluewater Operations/ Concentrated Chokepoint Defense
Cooperative Seapower Strategy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Cooperative_Strategy_for_21st_Century_Seapower
Cooperative Seadenial http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-ship_ballistic_missile


SOSUS Net
Nixie Torpedo Decoy
ASW Triad
SURTASS
Advanced MAD
Surface Ship Torpedo Defence http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SSTD



Inner Air Battle
Naval UAV Operations
Aircraft Carrying Missile Cruiser or Harrier Merchant Carriers


Swappable Missile Cells
Guided Gun Muinitions


Modern Outer Air Battle
Modern Carrier Battle Group
Plane guard http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plane_guard
Carrier onboard delivery http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrier_onboard_delivery
Unsinkable aircraft carrier http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unsinkable_aircraft_carrier


Deperming http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deperming
Performance or Stealth
Towed/Spherical Arrays
Submariner Rescue Doctrine
Nonacoustic Sensors
Rocket Torpedoes
Shallow Water Operations
Digital Sensors
USV
USCV


Underway replenishment http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Underway_replenishment
Loss of Strength Gradient 1962 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loss_of_Strength_Gradient
Vertical Replenishment (VITREP)
Seabasing http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/ship/seabase.htm
Mobile Offshore Basing

The other two techs--Culture of Fear and Death Squads can't be given to Israel without also giving them to NATO. If they're implemented at all there should be political ramifications (increased dissent, etc). They might be better implemented as ideas.

Click to expand...

Actually if you'd like you can mix culture of fear and death squads into one tech as they are vaguely familiar. I think it should be represented in 3rd world & warsaw pact trees as they were somewhat repressive.

Modeling it into Israeli/German doctrine tree would simply require it to have say, Modern Blitzkrieg as a prerequisite. I might not like to admit it but "Extra-judicial killings, assassinations, and forced disappearances" are doctrinally used in the West Bank/Gaza.. Theoretical Nazi Germany would obviously use these in Nazi Poland & elsewhere...

My two cents on Naval warfare:

Naval Defense in Depht (US defensive CV doctrine):
http://nrotc.unm.edu/ns304/22 - Air Warfare and Flight Deck OPS.ppt
This presentation could be used to brake down the doctrine into small pieces, if need to.

I have recently at Brazilian Submarine Command interviewing the Commander of Submarine Forces, he is very friendly. I could try to contact him and ask for a little help here. I'll just have to find out with the guys that work with me if that's doable or not. Let's just hope for the best.

About pictures, as I said, I work as military journalist. There are a couple of pictures I could provide without any copyright issues. We have great pictures here for the following models:

- Air
Dassault Rafale
F-16C
Mirage 2000C
Embraer A-1 AMX
F-5M
KC-135
C-130
Cessna Caravan (military version)
IA 58 Pucará
T-37 Dragonfly
C-17 Globemaster
Embraer T-26 Xavante/Aermacchi MB-326
737 (military version)
KC-10
Eurocopter Ecureuil
Bell UH-1 Iroquois
Eurocopter AS-332 Super Puma
SH-3 Seaking
SH-60F Seahawk
E-2C
F-18E Superhornet (folded wings, on deck)
C-2 Greyhound

PS: there is also pictures of flight lines, a couple of aircraft from different countries flying in pairs (like a Brazilian A-1 and a French Rafale), formation flying and maintenance that could be used on doctrines.

- Land
EE-9 Cascavel armoured car
M109 howitzer Self Propeled Artillery
Leopard 1A1 - MBT
M113 - APC
Jeep Willys
AAV-7A1
MOWAG Piranha (UN painting)
EE-11 Urutu

PS: some vintage radio equipment as well. I have pictures for modern sniper with ghillie suit and M82 Barret Sniper rifle, as well as some special forces taking over ships (fighting stance). Peacekeeping forces with blue helmets are available as well (also in fighting stance).

- Naval
Type 209-1400 submarine
CVN-70 Carl Vinson

A couple of good photo galleries from where I work:
http://www.rotaaerea.com.br/home.php?mod=articles&page=galeria&idc=7&id=10117
http://www.rotaaerea.com.br/home.php?mod=articles&page=galeria&idc=7&id=10084
http://www.rotaaerea.com.br/home.php?mod=articles&page=galeria&idc=7&id=10082

If you spot something you want, just let me know and I'll get the original picture for you.

I also have some suggestions regarding ballistic missile warfare.

Suggestions regarding ballistic missile warfare.
Right now the path to ICBM is quite easy and do not fully represent the "missile race" that existed back in the Cold War. Proposed changes include 2 more models. Proposal follows with suggested models for USA, GER and SOV.

Strategic Rocket, 1942
PGM-11 Redstone, V2A4, SS-1 Scunner
Range: 380

Ballistic Missile, 1944
PGM-19 Jupiter, V2A7, SS-3 Shyster
Range: 1200

Advanced Ballistic Missile, 1947
PGM-17 Thor, V2A9, SS-3 Mod.2
Range: 2400

Intercontinental Ballistic Missile, 1951
SM-65 Atlas, V2A9/A10, SS-6 Sapwood
Range: 12000

Improved ICBM, 1960
LGM-30 Minuteman, V2A11, SS-9 Scarp
Range: 15000

Large ICBM, 1985
LGM-118 Peacekeeper, V3 (?), SS-18 Satan
Range: 10000*

*Since those missiles were optimized to use MIRVs, they should be available after MIRV technology and represent further development in MIRV use, as the first deployments were of MIRV warheads to previously designed missiles. The Peacekeeper and the SS-18 could carry 10 MIRVs each, opposed to the 3 MIRVs from Minuteman and Scarp missiles. So those later models should be even cheaper and faster to build to represent more MIRV warheads deployed at the same time.

PS: obviously GER models are a guess, and they dont match the effective range of their designs. But no one can know what von Braun would achieve in a Fatherland 'scenario' for the Germans.

Proposed models for Brazil.

Int 0 Boeing P-12
Int 1 Curtiss P-36
Int 2 Curtiss Tomahawk
Int 3 Curtiss P-40E
Int 4 Curtiss P-40K
Int 7 Gloster Meteor F.8
Int 8 Lockheed F-80C
Int 10 Mirage IIIE

Int 12 Northrop F-5E
Int 13 Mirage IIIEBR
Int 14 Mirage 2000C

Ftr 0 Curtiss Kittyhawk
Ftr 1 P-47D Thunderbolt
Ftr 2 P-47D-27RE
Ftr 3 Gloster Meteor T/F.7
Ftr 4 Lockheed T-33
Ftr 7 Northrop F-5B/E
Ftr 8 Northrop F-E/FBR
Ftr 9 Northrop F-5EM

Tac 0 B-18
Tac 3 B-25D Mitchell
Tac 4 B-25J Mitchell
Tac 5 Douglas B-26C Invader
Tac 10 Embraer A-1 AMX
Tac 11 Embraer A-1M

CAS 0 Vultee V.11
CAS 2 A-20K Havoc
CAS 3 B-26D Invader
CAS 7 Embraer AT-26 Xavante
CAS 10 Embraer A-1 AMX
CAS 11 Embraer A-29 Super Tucano

TRA 0 Savoia Marchetti S.79T
TRA 1 C-47 Skytrain
TRA 2 C-54G
TRA 3 Fairchild C-119 Flying Boxcar
TRA 4 Embraer C-95 Bandeirante
TRA 5 Lockheed C-130 Hercules
TRA 6 Embraer C-390

NAV 0 PV-1 Ventura
NAV 1 PV-2 Harpoon
NAV 2 PBY-5 Catalina
NAV 4 P2V-5 Neptune
NAV 5 P2V-7 Neptune
NAV 6 Grumman P-16 Tracker
NAV 7 Embraer P-95 Bandeirulha
NAV 8 Lockheed P-3AM Orion
NAV 9 Embraer P-99

SS 0 Foca-class
SS 1 Balilla-class
SS 2 Tupy-class
SS 3 Humaytá-class
SS 4 Guanabara-class
SS 9 Humaitá-class
SS 10 Tupi-class
SS 11 Tikuna-class
SS 12 Scorpène-class
SS 19 (2005 Nuc Attack Sub) Riachuelo-class

ARM 0 Renault FT-17
ARM 1 Vicker Mk.E
ARM 2 M3 Lee
ARM 3 M4A1 Sherman
ARM 4 M4 Sherman
ARM 5 M4A3(105) Sherman
ARM 6 M47 Patton
ARM 7 M48 Patton
ARM 8 M60 Patton
ARM 9 Leopard 1A1
ARM 11 Leopard 1A5
ARM 12 EE-T1 Osório
ARM 13 EE-T2 Osório
ARM 14 EE-T3 Osório

CVL 5 Minas Gerais-class

CV 7 São Paulo-class

SP-Art 7 ASTROS I
SP-Art 8 ASTROS II
SP-Art 10 ASTROS III

Missile Frigate Niterói-class
Missile Frigate II Greenhalgh-class

Heavy Destroyer I Inhaúma-class
Heavy Destroyer II Barroso-class

@iceHawk
What font you used on these SKIFF-like icons to write the model numbers?

PS: about German and US MBT models. I think that MBT-70 should be ARM 11 model for both US and Germany. It was a joint development and led both to the Leopard 2 and M1A Abrams. Starting the Leopard 2 family from 1982 (ARM 12) onwards sounds more logical to me.

Naval Doctrines Part 1

Here they are:
------------
First off general naval doctrines - available to all:

Modern Maritime Interdiction Operations 1968

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maritime_Interdiction_Operations
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/ops/mio.htm
Maritime Interdiction Operations (MIO) are naval conducted operations, that aim to delay, disrupt, or destroy enemy forces or supplies en route to the battle area before they do any harm against friendly forces.


Lessons of Cuban Missile Crisis - management
Sanctions enforement doctrine - large_taskforce_tactics
Forced boarding actions - individual_courage
Dispersed task force tactics - decentralized_execution
Command staff training - training

command = { type = morale which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = task_efficiency which = convoy_raiding value = 0.10 }
command = { type = task_efficiency which = naval_interdiction value = 0.10 }


Modern Combat Information Center (CIC) 1970

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operations_room
The Operations Room brings together and manages information on the warships status, its surroundings and supplies this to the commanding officer who would be present on the bridge, and if on the ship, a flag officer who might have their own separate "flag bridge". Some control, assistance, and coordination functions may be delegated to the CIC.

requires computer tech

Integrated Navigation, Gunnery, Missile, Aviation & Sensor suites - naval_engineering
Naval Tactical Data System - electronics
Complete, up-to-the-minute tactical picture - technical_efficiency
Computers, user interfaces and embedded systems - electronics
CIC staff training and integration - training

command = { type = max_organization which = naval value = 5 } #organized data distribution
new naval FC - Computer FC Capital
new naval FC - Computer FC Escort


Electronic Sea Warfare 1973

Integration of electronic sensors, ESM, ECM, ECCM into a fluid electronics package
requires radar tech

Anti-ship missile threat negation - management
Integrated naval ESM - electronics
Integrated naval ECM - electronics
Sensor management - management
Emissions Control - centralized_execution

command = { type = convoy_def_eff value = 0.1 }
command = { type = snow_attack which = naval value = 10 }
command = { type = rain_attack which = naval value = 10 }
command = { type = night_attack which = naval value = 10 }
new naval FC - CW Naval Radar Capital
new naval FC - CW Naval Radar Escort


Defense in Depth 1980

Doctrine of layered zones of defense to protect fleets from swarms of anti-ship missiles.

Airborne threat prioritization - seamanship
Fighter engagement zone - fighter_tactics
Missile engagement zone - rocketry
Close-in engagement area - naval_artillery
Joint enagement management - naval_training

command = { type = max_organization which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = morale which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = convoy_def_eff value = 0.1 }
new Escort AAA - CW AAA Escort (CIWS, SR-SAM)
>naval Capital AAA should be unlocked by SAM techs


Maritime Cooperation 1990

Doctrine of continued integrated military naval training & cooperation between allies.

Naval cooperation focus - seamanship
Multinational fleets - large_taskforce_tactics
Joint aviation excercises - carrier_tactics
Naval officer exchange - individual_courage
Joint fleet excercises - naval_training

command = { type = max_organization which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = morale which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = convoy_def_eff value = 0.05 }
command = { type = task_efficiency which = naval_interdiction value = 0.10 }
command = { type = task_efficiency which = naval_combat_patrol value = 0.10 }


Naval Battlespace 2000

Modern digital fleet management and doctrine.

requires miltary internet tech, modern SAM

Naval digitization - electronics
Distributed information picture - small_taskforce_tactics
Digital combat information center - naval_engineering
Fleet information data system - electronics
Naval fleet excercises and integration - naval_training


command = { type = max_organization which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = naval value = 0.1 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = naval value = 0.1 }
new naval FC - Digital FC Capital
new naval FC - Digital FC Escort
new Escort AAA - Digital AAA Escort (RAM/Kashtan, MR-SAM)


Maritime Security Operations 2008

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maritime_Security_Operations
Modern doctrine to combat sea–based terrorism and other illegal activities, such as hijacking, piracy, and slavery, also known as human trafficking.

Naval operations other than war - seamanship
Modern sanctions enforcement - large_taskforce_tactics
Visit, Board, Search, and Seizure - naval_training
Distributed sensor picture - small_taskforce_tactics
Naval fleet excercises and integration - naval_training

command = { type = morale which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = convoy_def_eff value = 0.10 }
command = { type = task_efficiency which = naval_interdiction value = 0.10 }


Future Fleet Formation 2015


Asymetric Naval Protection Focus - submarine_tactics
Integrated UAV/USV Use - technical_efficiency
Minehunter fleet inegration - small_taskforce_tactics
Swappable Misson Modules - naval_engineering
Future fleet excercises and integration - naval_training

command = { type = max_organization which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = morale which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = naval value = 0.1 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = naval value = 0.1 }
command = { type = convoy_def_eff value = 0.10 }
command = { type = task_efficiency which = naval_interdiction value = 0.10 }
command = { type = task_efficiency which = naval_combat_patrol value = 0.10 }
command = { type = task_efficiency which = asw value = 0.10 }
new Escort AAA - Future AAA Escort (Laser/Energy CIWS, VLS-SAM)

-----------------
This part is a more doctrinally specific. Consists of 3 groups of doctrines:

Green Water Navy (green water ops, coastal area denial, littoral warfare)
Blue Water Navy (blue water ops, concentrated choke point, assassin's mace)
Global/Deep Blue Navy (command the seas, co-op seapower, air-sea doctrine)

last tech of each should unlock 1 other doctrine. So Green water navy aspires to be a blue water navy, blue water wants to be a global power & global power wants to refocus on littoral/green water warfare. This in effect very realistically represents current naval doctrinal themes developing worldwide..
If this can be represented, that would be VERY nice



Green-Water Operations 1970

unlocked by Modern Mixed Fleet, Submarine Predominance or Sealane Denial
blocks Bluewater operations and Cooperative seapower strategy

Regional naval defense mindset - small_taskforce_tactics
Small warship focus - naval_engineering
Coastal artillery modernization - naval_artillery
Coastal anti-ship batteries - rocketry
Fleet excercises and integration - naval_training

command = { type = max_organization which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = morale which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = build_cost which = destroyer when = now where = relative value = -10 }
command = { type = build_cost which = submarine when = now where = relative value = -10 }
command = { type = build_cost which = light_cruiser when = now where = relative value = -10 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = submarine value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = submarine value = 0.05 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = destroyer value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = destroyer value = 0.05 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = light_cruiser value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = light_cruiser value = 0.05 }
command = { type = building_prod_mod which = coastal_fort value = 10 }

Coastal Area Denial 1985

follow-on to Green-Water Operations

Coastal area denial focus - small_taskforce_tactics
Coastal anti-ship missile brigades - rocketry
Local ISR assets - electronics
Combined sea-air-land missile swarm - rocketry
Missile barrage timing - naval_training

command = { type = max_organization which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = morale which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = building_prod_mod which = coastal_fort value = 10 }
command = { type = build_cost which = destroyer when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = build_cost which = naval_bomber when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = build_cost which = submarine when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = submarine value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = submarine value = 0.05 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = destroyer value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = destroyer value = 0.05 }
command = { type = build_cost which = b_u9 when = now where = relative value = -5 } #ALCM
command = { type = build_cost which = naval_mines when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = build_cost which = naval_fire_controll_s when = now where = relative value = -5 } #cheaper FFG/DDG ASHM


Littoral Warfare 2005

follow-on to Coastal Area Denial
unlocks Bluewater Operations

Modern anti-ship cruise missiles - rocketry
Swarming small boats - naval_engineering
Ultra-quiet diesel submarine focus - submarine_tactics
Sophisticated sea mines - naval_engineering
Multiple delivery platforms - small_taskforce_tactics

command = { type = max_organization which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = morale which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = building_prod_mod which = coastal_fort value = 10 }
command = { type = build_cost which = submarine when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = submarine value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = submarine value = 0.05 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = destroyer value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = destroyer value = 0.05 }
command = { type = build_cost which = b_u9 when = now where = relative value = -5 } #ALCM
command = { type = build_cost which = naval_mines when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = build_cost which = naval_fire_controll_s when = now where = relative value = -5 } #cheaper FFG/DDG ASHM


Bluewater Operations 1970

unlocked by Modern Mixed Fleet, Submarine Predominance or Sealane Denial
blocks Green-water operations and Cooperative seapower strategy

Regional naval domination mindset - small_taskforce_tactics
Submarine/Cruiser focus - naval_engineering
Fleet/Air cooperation - aeronautics
Balanced fleet mix composition - seamanship
Fleet excercises and integration - naval_training

command = { type = max_organization which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = morale which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = build_cost which = light_cruiser when = now where = relative value = -10 }
command = { type = build_cost which = nuclear_submarine when = now where = relative value = -10 }
command = { type = build_cost which = heavy_cruiser when = now where = relative value = -10 }
command = { type = build_cost which = battlecruiser when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = build_cost which = escort_carrier when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = nuclear_submarine value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = nuclear_submarine value = 0.05 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = light_cruiser value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = light_cruiser value = 0.05 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = heavy_cruiser value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = heavy_cruiser value = 0.05 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = battlecruiser value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = battlecruiser value = 0.05 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = escort_carrier value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = escort_carrier value = 0.05 }
command = { type = build_cost which = naval_bomber when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = build_cost which = naval_fire_controll_l when = now where = relative value = -5 } #cheaper CG/BCG ASHM


Concentrated Chokepoint Defense 1985

follow-on to Bluewater Operations

Regional naval domination mindset - small_taskforce_tactics
Defensive trap mentality - seamanship
Regional ISR network - electronics
Combined sea-air-land missile swarm - rocketry
Joint naval fleet maneuvers - naval_training

command = { type = max_organization which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = morale which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = build_cost which = naval_bomber when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = build_cost which = b_u9 when = now where = relative value = -5 } #ALCM
command = { type = max_positioning which = nuclear_submarine value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = nuclear_submarine value = 0.05 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = light_cruiser value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = light_cruiser value = 0.05 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = heavy_cruiser value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = heavy_cruiser value = 0.05 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = battlecruiser value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = battlecruiser value = 0.05 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = escort_carrier value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = escort_carrier value = 0.05 }
command = { type = build_cost which = naval_fire_controll_l when = now where = relative value = -5 } #cheaper CG/BCG ASHM


Assasins Mace 2005

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article15348.htm
follow-on to Concentrated Chokepoint Defense
unlocks Command of the Seas Doctrine

Regional naval mastery mindset - small_taskforce_tactics
Assymetric submarine focus - submarine_tactics
Strike them where it hurts mentality - large_taskforce_tactics
Enchanced ISR targeting picture - electronics
Missile barrage timing - naval_training

command = { type = max_organization which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = morale which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = build_cost which = naval_bomber when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = build_cost which = b_u9 when = now where = relative value = -5 } #ALCM
command = { type = build_cost which = nuclear_submarine when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = build_cost which = submarine when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = nuclear_submarine value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = nuclear_submarine value = 0.05 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = submarine value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = submarine value = 0.05 }
command = { type = build_cost which = naval_mines when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = build_cost which = naval_fire_controll_l when = now where = relative value = -5 } #cheaper CG/BCG ASHM
buildcost/organization/morale boost to Anti-Ship Ballistic Missile*
command = { type = surprise which = naval value = 5 } #relies in part on surprise




Command of the Seas Doctrine 1970

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sea_control
unlocked by Overseas Deployment or Carrier Focus
blocks Green-water operations and Blue Water Operations

Modern sea control focus - combined_arms_focus
Continued carrier domination doctrine - carrier_tactics
Sea line of communications (SLOC) mastery - large_taskforce_tactics
Carrier battlegroup composition - seamanship
Fleet excercises and integration - naval_training

command = { type = max_organization which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = morale which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = build_cost which = light_cruiser when = now where = relative value = -10 }
command = { type = build_cost which = nuclear_submarine when = now where = relative value = -10 }
command = { type = build_cost which = heavy_cruiser when = now where = relative value = -10 }
command = { type = build_cost which = carrier when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = build_cost which = escort_carrier when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = nuclear_submarine value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = nuclear_submarine value = 0.05 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = light_cruiser value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = light_cruiser value = 0.05 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = heavy_cruiser value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = heavy_cruiser value = 0.05 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = carrier value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = carrier value = 0.05 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = escort_carrier value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = escort_carrier value = 0.05 }
command = { type = build_cost which = cag when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = max_organization which = cag value = 2 }
command = { type = build_cost which = b_u1 when = now where = relative value = -5 } #LCAG
command = { type = max_organization which = b_u1 value = 2 }


Cooperative Seapower Strategy 1985

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Cooperative_Strategy_for_21st_Century_Seapower
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/600-ship_Navy
follow-on to Command of the Seas Doctrine

600-ship navy plan - large_taskforce_tactics
Regionally concentrated, credible combat power - centralized_execution
Globally distributed, mission-tailored maritime forces - seamanship
Supercarrier battlegroups - carrier_tactics
Large scale fleet excercises - naval_training

command = { type = max_organization which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = morale which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = nuclear_submarine value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = nuclear_submarine value = 0.05 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = light_cruiser value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = light_cruiser value = 0.05 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = heavy_cruiser value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = heavy_cruiser value = 0.05 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = carrier value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = carrier value = 0.05 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = escort_carrier value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = escort_carrier value = 0.05 }
command = { type = build_cost which = naval_asw when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = build_cost which = b_u7 when = now where = relative value = -5 } #battleship upgrade - recomissioning the Iowa class BB
command = { type = build_cost which = b_u8 when = now where = relative value = -5 } #SLCM
command = { type = build_cost which = cag when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = max_organization which = cag value = 2 }


AirSea Battle Doctrine 2005

http://www.usni.org/magazines/proceedings/2010-08/whats-new-about-airsea-battle-concept
follow-on to Cooperative Seapower Strategy
unlocks Green-Water Operations

ASHM/BMD priority focus - rocketry
Carrier battlegroups stand-off operations - carrier_tactics
Counter ISR & counter-space operations - management
SSN prioritization focus - submarine_tactics
Enemy SSK neutrilization focus - submarine_tactics

command = { type = max_organization which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = morale which = naval value = 5 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = nuclear_submarine value = 0.10 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = nuclear_submarine value = 0.10 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = heavy_cruiser value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = heavy_cruiser value = 0.05 }
command = { type = max_positioning which = carrier value = 0.05 }
command = { type = min_positioning which = carrier value = 0.05 }
command = { type = build_cost which = naval_asw when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = build_cost which = b_u8 when = now where = relative value = -5 } #SLCM
command = { type = build_cost which = cag when = now where = relative value = -5 }
command = { type = max_organization which = cag value = 2 }

Follow on ideas - tentative
However, I do need to know how many slots I have to work with...!!
Many are more tech related so they can be relegated to the Naval Ship screen if there is space to spare

FFG/DDG ASW Techs:

SOSUS Net
Nixie Torpedo Decoy
ASW Triad
Advanced ASROC
Low Visibility Hunting - bubble business
SURTASS
Advanced MAD
Surface Ship Torpedo Defence http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SSTD

CG/BCG Techs:

Inner Air Battle
Heavy Anti Ship Missile Battery
Gen I AEGIS (Cruiser)
Modular Missile Cells (VLS)
Guided Gun Muinitions
Gen II AEGIS (DDG/FG)
Gen II Guided Gun Munitions

CAG/CV Techs:

Helicopter in Flight Refueling (HIFR)
Aircraft Carrying Missile Cruiser or Harrier Merchant Carriers
Naval UAV Operations

Combat Direction Center
Modern Outer Air Battle
Modern Carrier Battle Group
Plane guard http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plane_guard
Carrier onboard delivery http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrier_onboard_delivery
Unsinkable aircraft carrier http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unsinka...rcraft_carrier

SS/SSN Techs:

Deperming http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deperming
Performance or Stealth
Towed/Spherical Arrays
Submarine Replenishment at Sea
Submariner Rescue Doctrine
Deep Strike
Nonacoustic Sensors
Rocket Torpedoes
Shallow Water Operations
Digital Sensors
Anti ASW Focus
Modular Missile Cells
USV
USCV

Replenishement/ Logistics:

Modern Underway replenishment http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Underway_replenishment
Vertical Replenishment (VITREP)
Loss of Strength Gradient 1962 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loss_of_Strength_Gradient

Joint Logistics Over-the-Shore (JLOTS) 1975
Seabasing 1995 http://www.globalsecurity.org/milita...ip/seabase.htm
Mobile Offshore Basing 2015

That sounds fantastic!

nomonhan said:

There is plenty of room on the naval doctrines screen. 30 can fit easily and with a sixth column if needed that total could go to something slightly over 40.

Click to expand...

So far this count is 61! so ill simply separate these tentative ones into tech related ones, which will fit on naval tech screen, & doctrinal ones that will stay on naval doctrine. Ill cut unnecessary or too similar ones too so no one panic yet